[1992-04-30-NJPW-Explosion Tour: Top of the Super Juniors] Jushin Liger vs El Samurai

[Kevin Ridge]

What's up with the referee taking his sweet time cleaning the mat of streamers? Anyways, I thought this was really good to great. I wish they could have kept up the hatred throughout the match after the mask ripping. It was very unusual to watch a masked man wrestling with his mask completely torn off his face. Camera wise they don't zoom in that much and any close shots are quickly switched to another camera angle. Kind of hurts not having the visual of someone's face when they are hit with a big move or in submission. As match goes on they do show a bit more and more of El Samurai's face. He seems to not care at all though and wrestles as is. Which is good as would have been annoying if he was trying to cover his face up over and over. They busted out some nice big moves at the end towards the finish. All around, match was very enjoyable.

[Zero]

This was AMAZING! This is my match of the year so far. I loved Samurai just being a total asshole, then Liger finally just snapping and ripping his mask right the fuck off.

[MikeCampbell]

Good lord, this rules beyond belief. Lyger and Sammy hate one another and that's pretty much all you need to know. They work rather tight, Sammy really seemed to be trying to stretch Lyger in that armbar, and they throw in some stiffness and mask ripping for good measure. I can see why some wouldn't care for Lyger getting right up after missing the senton, but it wasn't a big deal to me, Lyger appeared to roll through the spot rather than take a flat bump.

[ohtani's jacket]

This has been one of the more interesting yearbook discussions thus far. I watched this match for the first time in years with scant recollection of it and basically wound up enjoying it because of Liger's offence. I don't like El Samurai's mask or his gimmick, and I don't think much of him as a performer so I wasn't buying the whole hatred thing. To me it looked strategic rather than hated filled. I didn't mind the way Liger took over the match, in fact I thought it was pretty cool. He was much better at acting pissed than Samurai was and his run of offence was spectacular. It didn't strike me as casual at all. I also didn't have a problem with Samurai's transition back onto offence and I thought that short spurt was his best part. I hated the submissions, though. What a momentum killer they were. Then they went to the turnbuckle and made a hash of that spot. The match never really built to anything after that and there's far more drama in other Liger matches with better opponents. I tend to agree that it had a squash feel to it, but Liger's offence was aces. I liked the pinfall, but to win the yusho like that was kind of telling.

[jdw]

Probably best to watch this one after watching their match from earlier in the series:

 

http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?showtopic=13576

[WingedEagle]

A little backstory here that no one probably cares about but is absolutely relevant to this match for me. I was 11 in '92 and recently subscribed to the Torch. The Torch had a monthly column about Japan and one month pimped the hell out of this match to the point that I absolutely had to get my hands on it. I sought it out in their classifieds and got a comp tape featuring it. It may have been the first Japanese match I ever saw, but it blew me away then and still blows me away today.

 

This is two weeks after their first tourney match where Samurai started things by slapping Liger prematch and winning in typical heel fashion using a low blow. Liger offers a handshake to start. Samurai spits in his face and the war is ON. Sammy immediately rips at his mask, cracks a beer bottle over his skull, delivers a tombstone on the floor, another in the ring and further rips at his mask. I'm biased but you've got tombstones on concrete, beer bottles and mask shredding 3 minutes in which already makes this the best light heavyweight match you'll ever see. Liger's transition comes with a big fist and he doesn't just go on the attack, he brings his own version of hate to the dance. Sammy eats a power bomb on the floor and then Liger starts working on his mask which eventually is just about completely ripped off and hanging like dead skin from his neck.

 

Samurai takes a sick bump on a dropkick. Liger brings a ringpost moonsault and Samurai is right back with a tope con hilo. The stretch run is sick -- Liger gets a near fall out of a power bomb to counter a Samurai rana. After a DDT and back suplex off the ropes Liger wins it with a top rope frankensteiner.

 

This wasn't just Jushin Liger showing his versatility in the ring and having an opponent who was more than game to rise to the occasion with him, it brought the hatred and violence of Flair/Funk, Austin/Hart or any other classic and applied it in a junior HW setting.

 

****3/4

 

I began the yearbook expecting this to be my MOTY and it didn't disappoint. Its possible the AJ 6 man tag from May surpasses it if i I can be objective, but we'll see what happens come ranking time.

 

What eventually prompted Samurai's face turn and team with Liger? I wasn't paying keeping current with the scene at that time and don't recall the specifics.

[PeteF3]

No, Samurai isn't as good as Liger, at least not here, but this is not Liger vs. a broomstick by any stretch. Sammy is awesome just destroying Liger at the start and heeling it up to the crowd, he's awesome selling the beating (and I love that he never bothers to remove the remnants of his mask, wearing it like a bandana and having it flop over his eyes when he's prone on the mat), and he makes an awesome comeback after Liger's paid him back several times over. Incidentally, another little bit that I thought was great was Liger trying to hit a German suplex, and being ready when Samurai tries to do the reverse punt to the nuts--shifting his body turning it into a backdrop suplex instead. Great little play off the previous encounter. I didn't think the submission portion dragged this down at all--they worked it so well with so much hatred and urgency that it was one of my very favorite parts of the match. There are some spectacular spots, of course, but this is all about Samurai coming in as an overconfident dick and Liger coming back to kick his ass, with Sammy showing that he's a little more than just a lucky cheapshot artist towards the end. On the contrary, I expect this to age BETTER than just about any NJ juniors match to come, because the storytelling element is there and the layout is different than the typical juniors contest.

 

This match had a great deal of buzz in the first Liger/Samurai thread, so I came in with pretty high expectations. For better or for worse, expectations can play a huge role in how I view a match, so that means this match had strike 1 going against it from the start. To me it's *****. Easily. It's one of the 2 or 3 best matches of the 2.33333 Yearbooks I've watched, possibly better than any '80s NJPW match. It was really fucking good, is my point here.

[Loss]

What a difference a few years makes. I still love this match, but I'd take it down ever so slightly. I'm making a note here to remind myself to do a direct comparison to Liger-Sano from 1/90 because this seems more on par with that now. Looking back at my comments, there's not much I'd say differently. It's just that my enthusiasm waned a little after seeing it again. Still an all-time classic, but this is three matches I've watched tonight that I thought were five-star matches originally and three matches I wouldn't give that distinction anymore. I didn't expect that.

[Zenjo]

Liger had a superstar entrance and Samurai initially wasn't that over in the Ryogoku. In a surprising turn of events the underdog fought dirty from the bell, which shocked his opponent during the early stages. Liger fought back with furious anger and kicked Sammy's ass, nearly ripping his mask all the way off in the process. Like Sano and Aoyagi found out in the 1990 Yearbook, you piss off Liger at your peril. I felt like a blade job would've been beneficial and it's not often I say that. The changes in momentum here were very clear cut before they went to a more traditional Junior stretch. Though there were impressive moves it felt a little disconnected to what had gone before. In the end Liger went over strongly and there was no doubting he was the ace. Put me in the really good but not a classic camp.

[Jimmy Redman]

So just as a preamble, I have such wrestling fatigue - literally - at this point that I can barely sit through a ten minute match without nodding off, let alone anything longer, PARTICULARLY something in a style that I'm largely unfamiliar with. Puro juniors matches are not my favourite thing in the world, and I keep trying to watch Liger matches in a kind of "eat your vegetables" way, without ever having really "got" him.

 

This is all to say that the fact that I am sitting here at almost 1am in the morning, having just sat down and watched two half hour Jushin Liger matches back to back, and I am wide a-fucking-wake...is unexpected to say the least.

 

I had never seen a Samurai match in my life before I'm pretty sure, so I don't really know what I was expecting from him here, but I can say that it wasn't him being a fucking asshole rudo from hell. He was great in this, from the hot, hate-filled opening with the mask ripping and the bottle shots, to then being taken over and putting up a fight, but just gradually dying because once he woke the dragon, this shit was over and the question was merely how long it would take. I get the feeling that this performance of his is an exception, which is a shame because he's great here and I'd like to see more of this Samurai if such a thing exists.

 

Liger I am starting to appreciate more and more. I think on the whole it's just a matter of adjusting my own expectations. Going into the juniors scene quite blind, I see this cartoon character in a crazy mask who is the anchor of a juniors division and my instinct is to expect pace, more pace and highspots up the wazoo. Where instead he (and they) basically just works like a smaller heavyweight, with some dives sprinkled in. Once I got past that expectation and started to see him more as simply an ace of a slightly smaller division and not a spot monkey, I've started to get him a lot more. And I can see how he matches up to the classic babyface aces, guys like Misawa, or Hijo del Santo, or even Cena. Liger absolutely nails the aura, just the gait of an ace. And here we get someone willing to test him, to try his luck, but that only awakens the anger in Liger and you just don't fuck with that.

 

This match fucking rocked, basically. I've never enjoyed a 90s juniors match so much in my life. In fact the only other one I enjoyed this much was the other match I watched tonight, Liger/Otani 97, which was also tremendous. So yeah I am certainly turning a corner on Liger, which I wasn't sure was even possible a few hours ago.

[garretta]

I thought this was just as much about Matsuda's comeback as Liger's ultimate victory. (I'm using Matsuda's real name here because he wrestled most of the match with his mask off.) I've seen a pissed-off Liger/Yamada beat guys to within an inch of their lives and overwhelm them to the point where they're completely helpless in the bargain, but Matsuda not only refused to be overwhelmed, he got a few close counts even after Liger's offensive roll started. Ultimately, though, he couldn't take Liger's repeated suplexes off the top; I think I counted one regulation superplex and two back superplexes, plus the finishing Frankensteiner. Kudos to Matsuda for taking so many vicious bumps on the back of his head in so short a time.

 

I knew about the ferocity of the first few minutes from reading about it in this thread, but I didn't expect the sequence in the middle where Liger tried to rip Matsuda's arm off. That has to be some of most painful limb work I've ever seen; I got the feeling that Matsuda was literally trying to keep his arm attached to the rest of his body. Of course, Liger had to get to his flashier finishing offense, so he never really followed up on it, but it would have been interesting to see just how far he'd gone with it if he'd had the time.

 

Matsuda's work on Liger's neck shouldn't be discounted either; not only fid he hit the tombstone on the outside, but he hit another one in the ring right afterward that might have won him the bout if he'd gone for the cover, then followed it up with a Rude Awakening, a recliner chinlock, and a dragon sleeper. I have a feeling that if this wasn't a blood feud already, it's going to be one going forward, as these two have established that they're not only out there to beat each other, but to cripple each other. I'm sure we haven't seen the last of this issue.

 

I wonder who got the idea to hide not one, but two bottles under the ring for Matsuda to use. I've never seen a spot like that done twice in a row before.

 

I haven't seen enough New Japan juniors matches to call it the greatest match ever for that division, and I'm pretty sure it's not the best match in New Japan history, either. But it's certainly the match of the tournament and the start of what should be another memorable rivalry in a long and distinguished line for Liger.

[Microstatistics]

On the contrary, I expect this to age BETTER than just about any NJ juniors match to come, because the storytelling element is there and the layout is different than the typical juniors contest.

Strongly agree with this. Does not age well is literally the last thing I would say about this match. Meltzer's review of this match is honestly pretty bad because he puts all the emphasis on Liger's spots (which are amazing mind you) but completely ignores the aspects that truly make it great.

 

Anyways PeteF3's review and the initial reviews of Loss are tremendous and pretty much sum up why this is a near perfect absolute all time classic, IMO. *****

[JKWebb]

#35 - placetobenation.com/countdown-top-500-matches-of-the-90s-50-1/

 

I love how Samurai starts this off. He's going for the mask, he's hitting him with objects, he doesn't care what the ref says, he's out for blood. Might as well hit a piledriver on the outside and ask the crowd what's up. You get a second piledriver, then back to the mask. I really dig the heelish antics of Samurai in this bout. He really lays it in on Liger for about the first 10 minutes. Once Liger gets the upper hand, he eventually rips the majority of the mask off and gets in some great offense on Samurai. You really can feel the hate. There's one spot I love, where Liger is working a facelock or chinlock and decides to quit and just slam the head of Samurai on the ground (followed by multiple strikes in the corner). I'm still a bigger fan of the 01/90 Sano match, which remains my favorite Liger match to date (and I have that one at ***** for me). But, this is a great match. ****1/2ish to me.

[Cap]

I am closer to the "this is all time great" side of things on this match. The details have been outlined clearly enough. The match builds well to me and I have no issues with the execution. I think the end where Samurai comes back one more time and adds that last tinge of doubt is great. The hate is palpable throughout but in that final few stretches it turns into desperation. The mask rips, the drama, the stiff shots, the dives, that pinfall at the end... this is great wrestling. ****3/4 (I could see bumping it at some point).

[Superstar Sleeze]

No matter what anyone says this thread is *****. I think it is one of my favorite threads in the history of PWO. I first started coming here in 2012 and I remember reading this whole thing at the time. I still remember Charles' post "You all are breaking my heart." then to see thing start to swing into his favor only for him to come in say he downgraded the match and then Stacy comes in and loves it and we get more people who love it. It is a fucking roller coaster of a thread. So where do I stand on such a controversial match?

Jushin "Thunder" Liger vs El Samurai - NJPW Best of the Super Juniors 4/30/92

A very polarizing match in the circle of puroresu fans whether this is a hate-filled brawling classic or a tedious, tone deaf chore. I fall in the former camp, BUT the criticisms of the latter camp is what keeps me from giving this *****. 

The easiest match to compare this to Naoki Sano, 1/31/90 where Liger takes a hellacious beating and is rendered a bloody pulp. Wouldnt you know that was the last match I watched five hours ago. So how do they compare? Well in the Sano my main criticism is they did too much, too early and it kinda made the match drag not from an action standpoint (Sano delivered that in spade), but in a plot stand point. We were just in heat for a while and we wanted to get our rocks off already damnit. What this match does better is Sammy does not beat Liger past the point of no return like Sano does. Thus I buy into Liger making a comeback and kicking Samurai's ass. In fact, I am looking forward to it. Now here is where I want my cake and eat it too. Samurai does not kick Liger's ass thoroughly enough. Wait I thought that was a good thing? It was until it wasnt. At some point, you have to find that next gear and Samurai just did not have it and thus I thought finish was a little anticlimatic. A lot of the people that really enjoy this match point to the first minute...Sammy spits in Liger's face, rips his mask, hits him with a beer bottle in the back of the head and then a tombstone piledriver on the outside and then inside. That's heallacious, thats GREAT heel stuff. However, the fans of the match all stop talking about Samurai. The critics of the match point out the big issue Samurai does not have a whole lot of gas in the latter stages. There is nothing that makes me believe in Samurai in his second heat segment. He does a beautiful somersault plancha, but whats his finish? Whats he building towards? It is better than Sano as I can believe in Liger's comeback, but worse because I dont believe Samurai can get the job done and also I think the hate fades where Sano does not. I would give the nod to the Sano match that even though I had an issue it was a real asskicker. 

This match was indeed great so lets get past that famous first minute. I liked opening heat segment it was more focused on choking and holds so it didnt feel like Liger was dying. Samurai needed an outlet for the hate. This all gets Liger revved up and he unleashes the MUTHA OF ALL SHOTEI OUT OF THE CORNER! He smoked Samurai. Suplexes him to the floor. Exposes the concrete and THROWS HIS ASS DOWN ON THE CONCRETE! One proponent said that this was the first time we see Liger this vicious. I disagree, I think that could clearly be seen throughout the Sano feud. This is blood feud Liger. I think the first half of this match is the classic part. The way Samurai's rudo work sets up this ferocious comeback from Liger where he rips Samurai's mask, powerbombs him, and how about that SOMERSAULT from the Top Rope to Sammy just laying on the floor. Then Liger tries to break Sammy's arm with a double wristlock then a cross armbreaker. Thats great shit. I think the second half is where some of the criticism of it being tedious come into play but I think they are a bit over stated. Samurai gets back on offense and just does not do much. He has lost that fire.  It does feel like that match stalls. Even Samurai's transition is not that cool is just a flying burrito on a criss cross. He hits a missile dropkick and then a dive to the floor. The hate is gone they have returned to Workrate City. Samurai goes for 3-Handled Moss-Covered Grenduzla and I like how much struggle Liger takes to break it. Then we get the sleeper this what I mean it just feels like Samurai does not have much left. Then it is over for him Liger pushes him off the top rope (never give your opponent the high ground) hits a beautiful splash. Liger is ready to take this match home, he throws Samurai down in a powerbomb and then hits a series of moves from the top rope. Samurai has one German Suplex as a nearfall before missing a move from the top rope and crashing & burning. Top Rope DDT, Top Rope Back Suplex. By the last Top Rope Frankensteiner even the crowd feels like this match has been over for minutes and just wanted Liger to end it. 

First half is tremendous, I do think it peters out a little because Samurai really does not have enough bombs to go toe-to-toe with Liger and I think Liger was thinking let me just hit as many moves off the top rope as possible and that will be sweet, which in 1992 it was but only holds up so much. It was warranted because Samurai beat him by low blow earlier in the tournament and clearly disrespected earlier in the match so running up the score so to speak was justified. Great early heel work by Samurai, Liger's ferocious comeback is the best part and then match finishes out as a solid 90s workrate match, all and all worth your time to watch and discuss. ****1/4

 

[dawho5]

Man, I think Sleeze (2 es) hit it on the head for what I thought of this.  I thought the first half was great.  But the problem comes when it becomes a standard juniors finishing stretch and it is clear Liger has way more in the way of big offense than Samurai.  I did love Liger losing his shit and going off, I missed that in earlier matches (since I had seen later Liger before that).

My guess is the Samurai being carried comments stem from him not having the juice to keep up with Liger late.  Maybe building Samurai up a little longer so he has a couple of significant bombs to throw in towards the end would have made the match better.  My guess is they needed somebody new as Liger had run the table on everyone else so far.

Very good to in the neighborhood of great match.

[cactus]

Samurai spits at Liger and proceeds to act like a massive dick to Liger. The first minute is fantastic heel work, but I feel the segment peters out as Samurai isn't able to keep the heat going. Liger makes a glorious comeback which sees him kick all kinds of ass. In a move that mirrored Liger's match with Sano two years previously, Samurai's mask is ripped by Liger. Samurai is able to make a brief comeback, but isn't able to trade bombs with Liger and eventually loses. I didn't think Samurai came out looking particularly strong, but this match made Liger look all kinds of awesome.

★★★★

[PhilTLL]

This is quite good, but I love a transition, and the first one here just sucks. Fortunately the second is a really awesome flying forearm. And I just have to know, why was there a half empty beer bottle under the ring? That should have been at the announce desk or some ringside seat.

I really love how we can see both guys' faces by the end. Displaying that kind of humanity really helps Liger especially.

[Matt Franklin]

Just watched this tonight for what I think is the first time (I know I have seen at least the first half before, but cannot for the life of me remember watching past that for some reason), and I’m wavering between ****3/4 and *****.
 

I am firmly in the ‘hate-filled epic’ camp, and didn’t find it boring at all. I know that some have mentioned the stretch of move/pause/another move by Liger, I found it to be more of him methodically fucking this dude up and making him pay for his disrespect rather than boring, but I guess that’s a matter of how you view it. For a guy who had a costume that covered him head to toe, has there ever been a wrestler more effective at using body language to convey meaning? 

I thought the spots playing off their match two weeks earlier, such as the blocked low blow and hurricanrana - resulting in Samurai having to use a different entry (almost a Toyota roll) to catch him, were awesome and it seemed like the crowd was in on the story, as they also popped big for them. The low blow in the previous match also helps play into the viciousness of Liger in this match. 
 

It is interesting to see the perception of Samurai as being carried by Meltz in ‘92, as when I watch with 2021 eyes I think he is solid as hell in there and is much more than just the ‘other guy’ in this match. Liger could have still had a similar layout and a really good match with someone not as talented as Samurai, but I don’t think it reaches the same heights. El Samurai is becoming almost a forgotten talent these days, but the dude was soooo good! Never as flashy as some of his peers, but when you look at his resume it is actually pretty damn strong.

I’m hesitant to go full 5* yet, as after reading this thread I feel like if I was in a different mood on rewatch it may not pack quite the same punch (or shotei even) that it has on this watch, but it is as close as you can get to five without being a slam dunk.