Goldberg

[Loss]

This reminded me how bonkers that Goldberg-Sting match is. Not an all-time great match or anything like that, but they don't make crowds like that anymore.

[Grimmas]

How was the wwe run? The Ogawa match was great.

[Timbo Slice]

It was pretty blah. There's some matches with some nice power spots against guys like Henry, but not his best stuff. He also worked on a broken ankle for a couple months.

[Jingus]

Everyone loved the debut angle and match with Rock, and rightly so. But other than that, I can't remember anything in his tenure that was worth watching. They had no idea what to do with Goldberg once they had him; he ended up working way too many long matches, and spending way too much time selling, which of course wasn't his strong suit. They tried to force him to work WWE style, and the results weren't pretty. Especially since he spent months on end feuding with Triple H, who did the exact same thing with Goldberg in 2003 that he'd do with Lesnar in 2013, forcing the unstoppable monster to slow down and work an even-steven match series. They presented it like Trips was an equal, when of course the fans didn't buy for one second that he was on the same level with Goldberg (or Brock) and it just hurt the monster's unique aura when they ended up on the receiving end of so many pedigrees and sledgehammer beatdowns.

[Slasher]

The one time they booked Goldberg exactly how he should have been booked (Summerslam), they killed it dead with the finish.

[Slasher]

Although I have to acknowledge that Goldberg was always going to be a bad fit in the WWE. They like to book their babyfaces to get sympathy heat and to have to overcome odds with some struggle. They like to have their heels get over on the babyfaces til the blowoff. That wasn't what made Goldberg great. He was a heel destroyer. He was a guy you book to run over the heels and that its the heels who has to struggle against Goldberg.

[Sidebottom]

seems to be forgotten for the most part.

 

Nah, his DVD did good numbers with little promotion. A lot of fans (myself included) still love Goldberg.

 

Anyway depending on how you rate you're top wrestlers (I tend to go for the total package: draw, matches, influence, promo) Goldberg did amazing business in a short span, he had some cracking matches in that time (Hall at Souled Out, Steiner at Fall Brawl, Raven on Nitro) was involved in some great angles (Bret Hart in Canada comes to mind, although that was mostly Bret being awesome), and of course you have to mention that Nitro match with Hogan for the sheer spectacle.

 

I would have liked to see Goldberg in more of 2001 WCW with it's stripped down booking approach: that would have really benefited him.

[Jesse Ewiak]

It's weird, I think Goldberg in a WCW that survives and basically treats him like a special attraction through the mid-00's (ie. squashes guys on Nitro's, has actual competitive matches on PPV against top guys), and continues to have good to great matches with the older stars like Sting & DDP along with the up n comers like Booker possibly might sniff the bottom of this list.

[WingedEagle]

Been watching a bunch of WCW on the Network lately, and I really want to include Goldberg. The matches aren't great, but they are great fun. Based on the criteria that have been guiding my thinking he doesn't stand a chance, but there's always the exception to prove the rule. Or some nonsense like that.

[goodhelmet]

 

Magnificent Muraco was the best squash match guy, he beat up a guy while eating a meatball sub. Quality over quantity .

Good point and the case for Muraco builds.

 

 

I know it is a year and a half later but disqualifying the message based on the messenger. Also... Muraco still sucks years later. Like, really sucks.

 

Anyway, I thought about putting Goldberg at 100 because I enjoy watching him as much as any wrestler in the past 20 years.

[WingedEagle]

That's pretty much where I am as well. Not sure how many other wrestlers were more fun to watch, and if I can find room for some people who didn't have the advantage of working classic main events he's right at the top of the list.

 

Best thing I can say about Muraco is that when I was growing up and watching with my babysitter, she said we had to like him because at that time he was with Superstar Graham. As always she was right. About Graham.

[Bierschwale]

Been watching a bunch of WCW on the Network lately, and I really want to include Goldberg. The matches aren't great, but they are great fun. Based on the criteria that have been guiding my thinking he doesn't stand a chance, but there's always the exception to prove the rule. Or some nonsense like that.

 

I was thinking about Goldberg a few days ago, the DDP match specifically, but in general. We're basing almost everything that he did on under three years of experience. You shouldn't get a bonus for potential, but in terms of being adept, how many Japanese/NA workers can say that they were as impressive as an actual worker in three years? How many had a match as strong as that DDP match 18 months in?

[SegundaCuerda]

This is weird, but I became interested in Goldberg after his feud with Lesnar, loved the squash at Survivor Series and their match at Wrestlemania was awesome. I even liked his match against The Undertaker, maybe for all the wrong reasons, but I enjoyed it. Maybe the thing I like is that the audience is totally into his recent matches because the feeling that Goldberg is gonna win with his first move, or with ANY move after that is so big that it creates a fun spectacle.

I never really get into his WCW squashes so I didn't really care for Goldberg and I hated his run in WWE in 2003, but I would like to watch some of his old matches with new eyes.

From this thread I'm rescuing his matches against Jerry Flynn, Regal, DDP and Sting, anything else that's worth watching?

[Big Pete]

I'd recommend the Spring Stampede match against Saturn where Perry throws the kitchen sink at him and Goldberg returns in kind. It's just a fun smash-mouth match with one of Bill's best ever finishes. The follow-up match between him and Raven on Nitro is one of his most famous matches. It's a really fun smoke and mirrors type of match where Goldberg just goes through the entire Flock.

On last watch the Halloween Havoc '99 match between him and Sid was an enjoyable brawl while it lasted. It really felt like Bill had found somebody who could stand toe to toe with him and it's really violent and bloody. The Fall Brawl '00 match between him and Scotty is very similar and a lot of fans right it right up there as one of Bill's best ever matches.

[Grimmas]

Goldberg is going to battle to get onto my list, but has a fair shot in that 95-100 for workers who rule, but I may just love so that get's them in over someone who may be a bit better.

Strangely, their case has been built up quite a bit over the last 5 years. Never would had thought that.

[strobogo]

The Brock squash at Survivor Series and the hoss bomb battle at WM definitely help him, everything else he's been involved with in the past 5 years has been garbage. 

 

If we're talking actual matches and not just rad squashes:

 

Goldberg vs Saturn Spring Stampede 1998

Goldberg vs Saturn Slamboree 1998

Goldberg vs Sting Nitro 9/14/98 

Goldberg vs DDP Halloween Havoc 1998

Goldberg vs Kevin Nash Starrcade 1998 (which I think is actually a pretty solid match)

Hogan/Nash vs Goldberg/Flair Nitro 3/15/99

Goldberg vs Sting Slamboree 1999

Goldberg vs Sid Halloween Havoc 1999

Goldberg vs Sid Mayhem 1999

Goldberg vs Scott Steiner Fall Brawl 2000

Goldberg vs Satoshi Kojima AJPW 8/30/2002

Goldberg vs The Rock Backlash 2003

Goldberg vs Christian Cage Match Raw 5/12/03

Goldberg/Booker T vs Christian/Chris Jericho Raw 6/16/03

Goldberg vs HHH vs HBK vs Kevin Nash vs Randy Orton Elimination Chamber Summerslam 2003

Goldberg vs Naoya Ogawa HUSTLE 1

Goldberg vs Brock Lesnar WM 20 (also I think a pretty solid match even though it was weird as hell and the crowd was shitting on it hard)

Goldberg vs Brock Lesnar WM 33

 

[Grimmas]

We have vastly different opinions on what garbage wrestling is, it seems. I haven't seen the Taker match, but all the others are all super fun and some are awesome.

[strobogo]

Goldberg squashing KO/Dolph/Fiend in seconds, or the 2 minute losing matches to Braun and Drew were awesome to you? It's not like physical prime Goldberg smashing jobbers and cruiserweights. It's mid 50s Goldberg getting less muscular and more flabby each appearance, struggling to hit his moves, which is definitely not awesome or fun to me.

[Grimmas]

3 minutes ago, strobogo said:

Goldberg squashing KO/Dolph/Fiend in seconds, or the 2 minute losing matches to Braun and Drew were awesome to you? 

YES!!

[Kadaveri]

I think the Goldberg vs. Undertaker match is pretty enjoyable if you just watch is as two prideful old guys having an ugly fight and don't go in with any nostalgia/wanting it to look like 1998. It's one of the least artificial feeling WWE matches of recent years.

[strobogo]

18 minutes ago, Grimmas said:

YES!!

Goldberg is not the type of character or wrestler where an old man back for one last run works at all for me. He was all about being this freakishly strong huge jacked up high intensity high impact guy smashing guys, but coming back in his mid 50s, being smaller and public about how hard and miserable it is to get into "Goldberg shape", being slow, and all of his moves looking like shit, even having to change to board shorts to hide his old man legs as he likely isn't doing heavy squats or deads anymore....shit is a bummer.

[Grimmas]

1 minute ago, strobogo said:

Goldberg is not the type of character or wrestler where an old man back for one last run works at all for me. He was all about being this freakishly strong huge jacked up high intensity high impact guy smashing guys, but coming back in his mid 50s, being smaller and public about how hard and miserable it is to get into "Goldberg shape", being slow, and all of his moves looking like shit, even having to change to board shorts to hide his old man legs as he likely isn't doing heavy squats or deads anymore....shit is a bummer.

I'm sorry you feel that way. I guess you aren't voting for Goldberg. I disagree and there is a good chance I will vote for him.

[strobogo]

Oh I love Goldberg. But not as a slow old man. The come back matches with Brock were a perfect return and send off, though. Everything else has been a bummer. But I could probably put Goldberg in my 100 just based on how rad his squashes were in 1998 and the Halloween Havoc match with DDP.

[Microstatistics]

I like Goldberg, though he is probably more of a Top 200 guy.

Based on what I've seen from late 90s WCW, I can't say I agree with the old assessments that he was green and couldn't work. He had pretty killer offense as well as a solid understanding of timing and selling. Enjoyed his WWE run too. I still maintain the Taker match is one of the most memorable in recent years. 

[Matt D]

I could see someone using a 95-100 personal pick on Goldberg on the basis of a hundred fun squashes, a few good 90s matches and some high octane old man stuff (and maybe that one 02 Mark Henry match?), but I’m pretty sure I could find 100 lucha guys alone to put over him pretty easily. Like, is he really better at the craft of pro wrestling than the fourth best Alvarado family member of his generation (let's say Robin Hood)?