The Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin Feud

[ohtani's jacket]

Merry Christmas one and all.

 

Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin, 3/31/86

 

Cage match from the Omni. I liked this a hell of a lot more than the 3/9 match. Flair put a hurting on Garvin to start with, which was something he didn't do enough of in the 3/9 bout. Some Flair fan in the crowd kept calling for a body bag and a stretcher and "whooing" every time Flair took Garvin to school. Right on cue, Garvin hulked up, or did a Lawler, take your pick. Flair was whipped from pillar to post and both guys juiced. Twice Ric tried escaping over the top of the cage and twice there was a full moon. I'm not sure why Ric told the girls he'd wear jeans when folks saw his ass in every match. The match went into a bit of a lull after they'd finished hurling each other into the cage, and the finishing stretch wasn't much to write home about, but the fans got more bang for their buck than at the beginning of the month.

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WWW, 4/26/86

 

These Garvin promos keep getting worse. He's trying to cut a promo about Tully and Arn breaking his hand and Crockett makes him comment on footage of Flair breaking Morton's nose. That throws him off and when he gets back on track he mangles some analogy to the US dropping bombs on Libya.

 

Ric Flair promo, WWW, 4/26/86

 

This is mostly Flair cutting a promo on Morton, but he mentions Garvin's earlier promo and says he's right about one thing and that's that Regan and the Horsemen and the heroes America needs right now.

 

Ronnie Garvin vs. Tully Blanchard, WWW, 5/3/86

 

One of my all-time favourite matches. This has to be Garvin's career match. I can't imagine he had a better performance than this in regard to selling and psychology. Tully is the perfect foil as he basically wrestles exactly like Flair but the bout isn't about him like it would be with Flair. Dusty's presence adds so much on commentary and the Dusty finish is better with him standing there in his cowboy hat while Crockett goes mental about the quarters. Love this bout. Garvin does a fantastic job putting over the injury and working hurt. Tully is Tully and awesome. If he'd had more years like '85 and '86 the sky would be the limit for GWE polls. All-time great match.

 

And that's the end of disc two, but here's a little something that wasn't on the discs:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ujfew2t8Sbk

Not the complete match, but shot from a much better ringside angle than the March stuff. Some old Flair\Gavin spots, but exciting to see close-up.

[ohtani's jacket]

Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin, 4/27/86

 

This is a fuller length version of the bout Mr. Rare Handheld uploader says is from 1/19/86. He got the date wrong on that, but the bout itself is the most fun I've had watching Garvin and Flair since the early studio bouts. It's a really typical Flair bout -- the kind you either love or hate -- but I don't watch a lot of Flair these days and this was the kind of arena match I was looking to sink my teeth into. Both guys took a beating and were hobbling about on bad wheels. The fatigue at the end was immense. Flair was bleeding. Garvin was blowing hard. The nearfalls were hot and the selling was great. You knew it would end on a piece of BS, but both guys looked like they'd been in a war and to me that was a fitting blow off to their '85-86 stuff.

 

Fast forward a year and brother Jimmy is on the scene.

 

Ric Flair & Lex Luger vs. Ronnie & Jimmy Garvin, WCW, 6/27/87

 

Red hot TV match that even J Garvin and Luger couldn't bungle. Garvin absolutely laid into Flair. I'm beginning to wonder if Garvin vs. Flair isn't a better TV feud than an arena one as the intensity skyrockets in front of the TV cameras and they go at it hammer and tong. The match loses its shape as the workers tire and then all the bullshit with Precious starts, but to start with the bout was electric.

 

Jimmy Garvin challenging Ric Flair, WCW, 6/27/87

 

Pretty decent promo from Garvin challenging Flair to a cage match in Greensboro during the Great American Bash tour. They shoot the entire thing in close-up and you can see the beads of sweat on Garvin's brow.

 

J.J. Dillon accepts Jimmy Garvin's challenge, WCW, 6/27/87

 

Perfunctory segment with J.J. and the ever wooden Jim Crockett Jr. I'm sure everyone knows the wager as it's a pretty famous angle, but Garvin has to put up the robe he stole from Flair and a date with Precious.

 

Ronnie & Jimmy Garvin promo, WCW, 7/11/87

 

Knowing what's coming you can't help but watch promos like these and feel sorry for these poor fools. Like lambs to the slaughter.

[ohtani's jacket]

Ric Flair vs. Jimmy Garvin, 7/11/87

 

This is such a bad Flair match. Even clipped it stinks. The ending is super heated, though, with Garvin's knee blowing out and Flair using the ropes to force him to submit. The fan trying to climb the cage makes it even more exciting.

 

Ric Flair's mannequin promo, WCW, 7/18/87

 

One of the worst promos of Flair's career. Possibly more embarrassing than those old man promos where he'd take his clothes off. It might have been okay if he hadn't made out with the mannequin, but that was damn near a Jump The Shark moment for 80s Flair.

 

Ric Flair's date w/ Precious, WCW, 7/25/87

 

This is just terrible. It's like Russo went back in time and booked an episode of World Championship Wrestling. Dillon wants to hide in a closet and watch Flair fuck Precious? Flair tries to mack it with Ronnie Garvin in drag? Another low point in Flair's career.

 

Ric Flair promo, Pro, 8/8/87

 

Stock standard Flair promo. The glory days of '85-86 are far behind us.

 

Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin, Pro, 8/15/87

 

Flair makes short work of Rocky King and takes his frustrations out on him by holding on to the ropes and refusing to release the figure four. Garvin hits the ring, and hot diggity damn, the angles and promos might be turning to shit, but Garvin can still dish out a beating. The Horsemen hit the ring and Garvin manages to fight off all four before they over power him. The faces are predictably late, but Garvin gets his hand raised in victory, and that's a pretty good way to end disc three.

[JerryvonKramer]

It's quite exciting to see where OJ is going to land as we get closer to the title switch.

[ohtani's jacket]

Ric Flair promo, Pro, 8/22/87

 

Another stock standard Flair promo. I don't think you can say this Jimmy Garvin/Precious stuff has inspired him.

 

Ronnie & Jimmy Garvin vs. The Midnight Express, Pro, 8/22/87

 

This is a potentially good match overshadowed by the fact that Flair is joining Caudle on commentary. Flair has a number of good lines and manages to outline the psychology of the Flair vs. Garvins feud to date, but the match itself is uninspired and Flair isn't left with much choice when it comes to the moment to "intervene." Most of the Flair/Ron Garvin stuff is missed on the first sweep around, but we get a good look at it on the replay. Caudle needles Flair fairly well and Flair delivers the same sort of deranged promo as post Wrestlemania VIII. Up until now, I've thought Flair stunk in the '87 Garvin feud, but either he turned it around by playing it as the mental disintegration of the cocky World Champion or that was the plan all along.

 

Ric Flair promo, WWW, 8/29/87

 

A run of the mill Flair promo has a bit more passion behind it as the facade begins to crumble.

 

Ric Flair promo, Pro, 9/5/87

 

Flair acknowledges that he's lost it, gone out on the edge and that Garvin has really got him rattled, but that all that's done is intensify the situation. Flair acknowledging that he's looked pretty bad during this Precious mess is a neat bit of "counter-psychology" if such a term exists.

[JerryvonKramer]

I think you mean Wrestlemania 8 right, not 13?

 

VIII

[ohtani's jacket]

Yeah!

[ohtani's jacket]

Ronnie Garvin vs. Arn Anderson, Pro, 9/12/87

 

Ronnie Garvin is glory bound and it's up to the Enforcer, Double A Arn Anderson, to stop him from reaching Flair, which he tries to do with headlocks and tests of strength. It's one of those bouts where they try to wear each other down and create the sense of an epic struggle, and while it's psychologically sound, it's a bit like eating your meat and veg. Dusty provides most of the entertainment on commentary, though he does a lot more shilling than in '86. I love how he always needs a beer on commentary because the action's so hot, and in this case he wants a pretzel to go with it. He has a great line about Arn's "titty" being knocked off into front row, which leaves Caudle speechless. Dusty eventually gets involved and you'd have to be watching pro-wrestling for the first time not to know what happens next. Dusty in a jeans and a white shirt and tie makes for an amusing visual in the torture rack. Garvin gets laid out this time and there's no arm raised in victory. I can see this ticking all the boxes for Andersons psychology lovers, but I thought it was weak compared to Garvin's work with Flair and Tully.

 

Ronnie Garvin training video, Pro, 9/19/87

 

Are training videos ever a good idea? Certainly not when Tony Schiavone is cutting an awkward promo in the same room as Garvin. I think only Japanese wrestling does these vignettes well as they tend to film real training instead of staging it. The video ends with Sinatra singing "My Way" to a montage of Garvin knocking blokes out. The editor gets a nice little shot in on the "and not the words of one who kneels" line of Flair begging off, and we're set for the big one.

 

I'm gonna drag it out a bit more and let the excitement build.

[ohtani's jacket]

Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin, 9/25/87

 

Now we come to the one everyone's been waiting for. Let me put this out there right now -- this is not a five star bout. A five star bout would be one of the greatest matches I've seen and one of the greatest matches of all-time, and this is not one of the greatest matches of all-time. IMO, it's their 3/86 house show match inside a cage. They don't use the cage until late in the match and there's not much point in it being a cage match other than it keeps Dillon and the Horsemen out, but it's not completely unsatisfying in terms of being a Flair/Garvin match either. Particularly, a Flair/Garvin match with an ending. If you've followed the storyline then it's a satisfying pay-off, but only three stars or so. A five star Flair match ought to be pretty transcendent and nothing about Flair's performance goes beyond the house show matches they had in '86. He puts more passion into the post-match promos than he does the bout itself.

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 10/3/87

 

This is the greatest feeling of Garvin's life, etc. Garvin says in the cage match win that it's better than getting married or the birth of a child. I can tell you from experience Ronnie Garvin that nothing tops the birth of a child, but keep cutting those promos Ronnie.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 10/3/87

 

Flair gets all philosophical about what it means to be the champion and how it feels to have people chasing you.

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WWW, 10/10/87

Ronnie Garvin and Jim Crockett promo, WCW, 10/10/87

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 10/10/87

 

Garvin gets hung out to dry as a weak promo. He has to lean on Dusty's line about the hunter becoming the hunted a lot. He also keeps making the same mistake about his prediction about being world champ in '86 being too late instead of too early.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 10/10/87

 

Flair continues to be philosophical about what it's like to be champion and how it feels to live his lifestyle without the championship belt. Then he gets weird comparing what he's going to do with Garvin with girl on top vs. missionary position.

[ohtani's jacket]

Onto the final disc...

 

Starrcade Control Center, UWF, 10/17/87

 

It's hard not to get fired up for Starrcade when you hear that theme play. Jim Crockett makes an official announcement about the Starrcade return match and then they discuss the situation with Terry Taylor and Nikita Koloff.

 

Ronnie Garvin vs. Tully Blanchard, UWF, 10/17/87

 

Some decent action while it lasts but Tully was noticeably jaded by '87. Hearing Jim Ross' hyperbolic nonsense was a shock to the system. I think I prefer Tony and David. Ross calls this the most physical contest he's ever witnessed. Garvin knocks Tully out then takes J.J. out too. The Horsemen hit the ring and Flair busts Garvin open. Garvin is hurt pretty bad and if it weren't for the Road Warriors may not have made it to Starrcade.

 

Flair/Arn/Tully/Luger vs. Windham/Rotundo/Lightning, PPW, 10/17/87

 

According to Ross this is going to be one of the greatest 8-man tags in the history of television. The angle they work here is so poorly handled. Horner gets injured and Garvin takes his place, but the trouble is that Garvin comes to ringside prior to the Horner injury for no apparent reason. Nobody pays any attention to him, Horner gets attacked by Dillon off camera and Garvin steps onto the apron with no reaction from the Horsemen whatsoever. Once he tags in it's the usual white hot action between Flair and Garvin, but you'd think they would have set it up better than that. The match goes off the air with Ronnie kicking ass.

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 10/17/87

 

Garvin hasn't looked at all right as World Heavyweight champ, but this is the most passionate promo he's delivered during the entire feud. It's simple and direct but he cuts to the heart of the matter by labeling Flair a challenger and ex-champion.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 10/17/87

 

Flair gets all wound up and almost loses his voice. He goes on a rant about the Starrcade card and launches into a tirade against Terry Taylor, Eddie Gilbert and the UWF. Finally, he gets around to Garvin's comments and we learn a little about the pressures of being an ex-champion with a lifestyle as expensive as Flair's and his inner fears of hanging around in a bar talking to some floozy or geek and telling them he used to be World Champion. He gets that deranged look in his eye when you know he's close to breaking point then signs off with a bit of swagger about the Nature Boy coming to New York city. Not a great promo but it just about left him breathless.

[ohtani's jacket]

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 10/24/87

 

Garvin delivers another strong promo about how Flair used the world title for five years to get whatever he wanted. He says Flair used people and stepped on them for his own good and that he was wrong to do it because the title represents the people and the people deserve a real man. Someone in the crowd hollers "people's champ!" and Garvin says that's what he's aiming to be.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 10/24/87

 

Flair cuts a decent promo explaining the prestige, the notoriety and the fame wrestlers are looking to get from Starrcade (as well as the money and women.) He gets in a great line about a million bucks looking better on his side of the fence than Garvin's since Garvin would probably spend it on a pickup truck and a new pair of suspenders.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 10/31/87

 

Flair is in full on shill mode here running down the Starrcade card and claiming that the NWA is going to take New York the night before. Can't say I'm a fan of Flair in shill mode but the whole Survivor Series deal was casting a long shadow over the build-up and Flair was trying to do his best sales pitch. In regard to Garvin, he cracked a great line about Garvin's month as champion driving around in his pickup with a couple of fat broads. Whoo!

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 11/7/87

 

Garvin says Flair is in a state of panic now that his income has dropped. Garvin doesn't want to live the life of the rich and famous since he's just a plain old boy driving a pickup, but he wants to keep the title because he's worked hard all his life. The whole working class/blue collar bent on this feud is basically a redux of Dusty Rhodes being the son of a plumber, but in fairness to Garvin he worked hard at trying to get himself over as the people's champ even if they weren't taking to him.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 11/7/87

 

More shilling from Flair. Man he's been disappointing in '87.

 

Ronnie Garvin promo, WCW, 11/14/87

Garvin is wearing a Top Gun cap and a denim jacket. Garvin likes jeans and he likes his pickup truck and he's gonna keep driving a pickup truck and gonna keep wearing jeans, and apparently 180 million other people in America wear jeans too. He gets fired up about how Flair says he's a 60 minute man but only lasted 41 against him in Detroit and that makes him a liar. He's out to make sure Flair's house, his limousine and his Mercedes get repossessed.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 11/14/87

 

Flair goes on a rant about how he was born with a "golden spoon" in his month, which I guess is even more privileged than a silver spoon. Then it's into shill mode and a riff about how in this era of free agency guys like himself and the other Crockett stars are working for the number one organisation. There's nothing else happening on Thanksgiving and Garvin has to wrestle the man who is going to be five times the World Heavyweight Champion.

 

.　

[ohtani's jacket]

Flair/Arn/Tully/Luger vs. Garvin/Windham/R&R, CWF, 11/21/87

 

The disc said this was from 11/28, but the commentary talks about Starrcade being a few days later so I figure it aired on the 21st. Looks great on paper -- actually, it looks amazing on paper -- but it's fluff.

 

Ric Flair vs. Ronnie Garvin, 11/26/87

 

This was all right. I think I liked it more when I hadn't seen the entire two year build to it. It's easy to watch a match like Starrcade '87 in isolation and think "oh, that's nowhere near as bad as people say," and to an extent it isn't, but it's not some under-appreciated, under-pimped gem either. The biggest problem is that the crowd is dead and therefore it's hard for them to have a match as intense as the '85 studio bout, which remains the gold standard of Flair vs. Garvin bouts, but they don't really aim high either. You can't really argue that they go to the end of the line to determine who the better man is. They put more effort into that '86 Omni closer than they did here. Pretty much anything that was good about this was a tried and true Flair/Garvin sequence and the whole "Flair as challenger" slant sells Garvin short, IMO. Ross is terrible on commentary. The seeds of Ross at his worse during the Attitude Era were there as early as the UWF buyout and perhaps even earlier. I actually felt kind of bad for Garvin when he dropped the title knowing that a simple job like that was pretty much it for his competitive career. Perhaps the worst thing of all was that he really didn't get to show all that passion and determination that he'd conveyed during the build-up because the match didn't push the workers any further than a run-of-the-mill bout despite Ross trying to tell us it was one of the most important victories of the Nature Boy's career and the most physical contest he'd seen since the week before.

 

Ric Flair promo, WCW, 11/28/87

 

Flair's the five time Word Champion, and while he claims he's going to be more obnoxious and overbearing than ever before, he does give Garvin credit for having been a World Champion. Mostly, he runs down the Starrcade results, talks up the Horsemen results and downplays Luger's loss to Dusty. And that's the end of the feud.

[ohtani's jacket]

Some final thoughts on Flair vs. Garvin then. I guess it goes without saying that I preferred the '85-85 stuff. Garvin made the best of his lot in '87 despite not being a naturally strong promo, but Flair was disappointing throughout, and the booking of hi immediately challenging for the belt and reprising "A Flair for the Gold" from five years earlier made Garvin look two bit. As for whether Garvin was one of Flair's best opponents, I'd say he was one of Flair's best TV opponents but not really one of his better arena opponents. The '85 studio bout is the pinnacle of what they achieved together. The booking, promos and matches weren't strong enough for it to be an all-time great feud, but at the same time the journey was enjoyable when they'd slap the shit out of each other or deliver an impassioned promo. Glad I watched it, but would probably only revisit the early stuff.

[JerryvonKramer]

On the one hand, I wasn't expecting OJ to be as high on the Garvin title win as some of the rest of us.

 

On the other, I'm pleased to see him giving that 85 studio match the love it deserves, one of my all-time faves.

[thebrainfollower]

So to be clear the Starrcade match WAS the last televised singles match between them?

[Loss]

Yes. It may have been their last match period. I recently watched Garvin/Arn from 1/2/88 on TBS. The match had far less heat than it would have a year earlier and the announcers don't even play up Garvin's credibility as a former world champion who beat Ric Flair, even though they were only about a month out from the title change and news traveled slower then, so there should have been an immediacy to Garvin being a man without a belt. They obviously wanted it out of sight, out of mind, which is a shame.

[Jingus]

According to Cagematch, they only had one more matchup, Luger/Garvin vs Flair/Tully at a house show a few days after Starrcade.