Reactions to the List: 100-51

[JKWebb]

Hey, good showing for Piper. Anyone who knocks him can't do so without seeing his Portland run. But that's not the entirety of his case.

Yeah I'm glad to see him here, and wish it was higher. I love the guy. As I mentioned before, I took more than just the in-ring into account when making my list, and his promos and ability to connect to an audience were off the charts. I too have really loved the Portland footage I've seen, and think it will add to his case as a wrestler.

[Matt D]

I really love the MSG Piper vs Perfect match too.

[Danish Dynamite]

I really love the MSG Piper vs Perfect match too.

 

Hell yeah :-)

[JKWebb]

 

 

Last night I had the thought that while the influx of voters may have created some results that aren't necessarily representative of the views of many at PWO (Angle's high ranking, for instance), it may end up being sort of a blessing. This list will get sent around, and if it was just all of our favorites, it might get dismissed out of hand. Now that it has some great showings by both the widely accepted "greatest ever" and by some PWO favorites, it might lead to people genuinely looking in to wrestler's they might not have before. Like, I think someone may see this list and check out Virus, or Sangre Chicana, because they are surrounded in ranking by more popular, mainstream choices. That's a potentially really cool happy accident.

That's a great way to look at it... I agree!

It'll also confuse people way more than one without such wrestlers, admittedly. How do you even begin to dismiss this juggernaut of contradiction?

Well, I was agreeing with the idea that it would possibly convince others to check out some of the names they haven't looked into before. I know I'm checking out more wrestling because of this list.

[Matt D]

Trust me. The confusion is a good thing.

[JKWebb]

Trust me. The confusion is a good thing.

Totally

[Grimmas]

Been busy today and am currently out. Will reveal final few names in 2-3 hours.

[stunning_grover]

2 Cold Scorpio... He probably should have been included in my top 100. He's now like my #102 or so. If I ever update my list again, he will probably be in the top 100.

 

Atsushi Onita... I had him at #95

 

Manami Toyota... She's my #18, which is possibly too high... I should probably re-evaluate her work at some point

 

Roddy Piper... Good to see him this high on the list... I had him at #97

 

 

That means 44 wrestlers that are in my top 100 have appeared in the final results so far...

 

56 wrestlers of my top 100 haven't appeared in the final results yet...

 

 

...

#8 Masa Fuchi [#111] (high vote)

#9 Sangre Chicana [#95] (high vote)

...

#14 Chigusa Nagayo [#110]

#15 Fuerza Guerrera [#155] (high vote)

...

#18 Manami Toyota [#89]

...

#27 L.A. Park [#96]

#28 Mr. Gannosuke [#277] (high vote)

...

#31 Mayumi Ozaki [#133]

...

#36 Jaguar Yokota [#114]

...

#41 La Fiera [#164]

...

#48 El Samurai [#212] (high vote)

#49 Kyoko Inoue [#217]

...

#53 Tsuyoshi Kikuchi [#148]

...

#55 Great Sasuke [#116]

...

#57 Yumi Ikeshita [#384]

...

#60 TAKA Michinoku [#180]

...

#62 Shinobu Kandori [#146]

...

#65 Dynamite Kansai [#125]

#66 Dan Kroffat [#254]

...

#69 Perro Aguayo [#140]

...

#71 Bison Kimura [#420]

#72 Devil Masami [#135]

#73 Cuty Suzuki [#385]

#74 Kerry Von Erich [#98]

#75 Dennis Condrey [#199]

#76 Pirata Morgan [#117]

#77 Super Astro [#283]

#78 Leo Burke [#296]

#79 Jinsei Shinzaki [#400]

...

#82 Masato Tanaka [#175]

#83 Javier Cruz [#502] (high vote/only vote)

...

#85 Psicosis [#183]

...

#88 Marty Jannetty [#272]

#89 Espectrito [#370]

#90 Masa Saito [#160]

#91 Sabu [#149]

#92 Scott Steiner [#162]

#93 Jacques Rougeau [#339]

...

#95 Atsushi Onita [#89]

#96 Carlos Colon [#103]

#97 Roddy Piper [#83]

#98 Stan Lane [#260]

#99 Big Boss Man [#171]

#100 Ron Starr [#403]

[Scarlet-Left]

Drops for me, so far:

 

6. Roddy Piper

 

15. The Undertaker

 

48. Kerry Von Erich

 

55. Manami Toyota

[Danish Dynamite]

Drops for me, so far:

 

6. Roddy Piper

 

15. The Undertaker

 

48. Kerry Von Erich

 

55. Manami Toyota

 

Yes! Piper at #6. I love that! I had him at 83, but I'm such a fan and not just as a post mortem tribute crappy thing. Always loved the guy. I'm a wrestling fan and film buff, so the bubble-gum chewing kick-asser from They Live will always be close to my heart

[El Dragon]

So far my hits from the top 100.

 

29. Cesaro-87

 

47. Sami Zayn- 88

 

48. Shinsuke Nakamura- 94

 

59. Virus- 99

 

64. L. A. Park

 

66. Ron Garvin- 90

 

79. The Undertaker- 84

 

81. 2 Cold Scorpio- 91

 

That leaves me at only 6 of my top 50 off the board (Christian at 39, Satomura at 46, and Waltman at 49), so apparently I'm much more of a conformist then I realized.

[tim]

Taking the "snapshot" approach to this list, Taker making it vs. not making it in 2006 makes sense. Over the last 10 years his estimation among hardcore fans has increased a ton. The starting point for that, funny enough, is probably the 2006 match vs. Angle.

[ohtani's jacket]

89. Atsushi Onita

Onita's an interesting guy. I like the story of him being on the bones of his arse and crawling his way back up from the gutter. And he looks cool in pictures and shit. But as for his work... Nothing people say about his selling, facial expressions or flair for the dramatic ring true for me. He reminds me of some kind of B-grade Hong Kong action star and his matches for me are like the pro-wrestling equivalent of a VHS rental copy of American Kickboxer IV or something else kept slyly next to the porn section. I don't see how people can bitch about Hogan or Undertaker and turn around and vote for Onita. Seems like a paradox to me. NB: In five years time, I'll probably be telling people he's better than Misawa and Kawada.

88. Sami Zayn

I don't get this guy at all. I'm sorry, but I don't. I mean I get what people like about him, but the same things people like about him would get panned if he were anything other than a indie-turned-WWE developmental guy. Would he have made this list if he were a Dragon Gate guy or a Joshi worker or a modern luchadore? Having said that, I'm sure the vast majority of people who voted for him don't have the same prejudices against those styles. But man, I can't believe people get upset about Harley Race's piledriver on the outside but not the kind of spots a Sami Zayn does.

87. Cesaro

It would be easy for me to dismiss Cesaro as too high, but he's uncharted territory for me. I've seen bits and pieces of his work but I need Jimmy to give me a big list of the best Sheamus matches and what not. Until then I reserve the right to reserve judgement.

86. Hiroshi Tanahashi

Those pics were so deliberately and intentionally unflattering ;p I've written enough about Tanahashi in the past. Pretty much this generation's Manami Toyota or Shawn Michaels. Not as good as his biggest fans claim, not as bad as his detractors would have you believe. Whether you like him or not, you can't deny how prolific he is. The guy pumps out the matches.

85. Manami Toyota

How fitting! Toyota and Tanahashi would make a great GWE selfie. Y'know, it's been 20 years since Manami Toyota was in her prime. I don't think anybody really needs to defend her anymore or explain why they don't like her. It's all written in stone somewhere. What I will say is that I discovered I like her immediate post-prime a lot more than i ever thought I did. I'm talking '97-02 or so. But then again I took an "I'm all in" approach to Manami Toyota which I think is the only way to go with a worker like her.

84. The Undertaker

Parv's line about him being the best ever at sitting up was one of the funniest one-liners in the history of this website. I kind of see Undertaker as a guy who evolved from a guy you'd wish would go away to a guy who was better than we thought he was. Somewhere along the way he started thinking he was even better than we thought and devolved into a guy you'd wish would go away. I imagine the next stage in the odyssey as Undertaker on his death bed and this monolith-type thing appears before him with the WWE insignia on it before suddenly and inexplicably he appears in the Gobbledy Gooker's egg on Thanksgiving Day 2090, boom, boom, boom, boom. I dunno, he wears makeup and thinks he's John Wayne.

83. Roddy Piper

I was never really a Piper guy and find a lot of his shtick irritating to be honest. He's like a stand-up guy who'll either have you in stitches or make you feel a bit tense (as in that this "isn't really funny" uncomfortable sort of way.) He had some really good matches, but you need to cherry pick them as opposed to a lot of other candidates where they come thick and fast. I don't have a gripe about his placement, though.

[cad]

Atlantis still hasn't shown up. Mark me down for "pleasantly surprised." Even if he pops today he'll still have done better than I expected.

[Parties]

Lot of my #95-110 folks in this round.

 

Scorpio: I was the #100 vote, but he’s not a sentimental/personal pick so much as a really deserving worker behind 99 others on that day. He could be higher on my list and his high-end stuff in WCW and the indies is textbook. Great deadly flier who’ll crush you with his dives and could give athletic credibility to any place he worked.

I was also the #97 low vote on Cesaro. He’s the only guy on my list really making his case in the present-day prime of his career, but as we’ve said elsewhere he’s been a WOTY candidate for years running now.

Didn’t vote for Garvin, but I like him. Had Onita at #70. Would never vote for Tanahashi, Zayn, Taker, or Angle. They’ve all had great moments, but the consistency isn’t there to be this high on the list. Hadn’t seen enough Toyota to rank her.

Piper was my #100 for quite a while but fell off in the end. Oddly enough it was Cesaro’s last-minute placement on my list that Piper fell off: still not sure if that's the right call, but it was on Mania Sunday. He’s great and I dig that people have come to see him as a genuinely talented wrestler beyond his mic and character work.

[KB8]

 

84. The Undertaker

Parv's line about him being the best ever at sitting up was one of the funniest one-liners in the history of this website. I kind of see Undertaker as a guy who evolved from a guy you'd wish would go away to a guy who was better than we thought he was. Somewhere along the way he started thinking he was even better than we thought and devolved into a guy you'd wish would go away. I imagine the next stage in the odyssey as Undertaker on his death bed and this monolith-type thing appears before him with the WWE insignia on it before suddenly and inexplicably he appears in the Gobbledy Gooker's egg on Thanksgiving Day 2090, boom, boom, boom, boom. I dunno, he wears makeup and thinks he's John Wayne.

Outstanding.

[Death From Above]

 

 

I imagine the next stage in the odyssey as Undertaker on his death bed and this monolith-type thing appears before him with the WWE insignia on it before suddenly and inexplicably he appears in the Gobbledy Gooker's egg on Thanksgiving Day 2090, boom, boom, boom, boom. I dunno, he wears makeup and thinks he's John Wayne.

 

This must happen.

 

I don't care what it takes.

[Childs]

I'm having good luck with my vendettas today so Rude and Mutoh, I'm looking at you. Time to go.

 

Love the Ravishing One but he's gone far enough on one great year and creating a miracle with Warrior.

 

Mutoh's best is certainly GWE worthy but if you care about consistency at all, it's hard to think he should go any higher.

[goc]

 

89. Atsushi Onita

I don't see how people can bitch about Hogan or Undertaker and turn around and vote for Onita. Seems like a paradox to me. NB: In five years time, I'll probably be telling people he's better than Misawa and Kawada.

 

I voted for all 3 (with Taker being much farther down my list than Onita and Hogan)

 

EDIT: Rude is still in? Yea he's officially been over rated then.

[soup23]

I'd take Angle and mutoh going away myself.

[Bierschwale]

If you want to shit on 'Taker's matches with HHH or whatever, fine. But I love this "how many CLASSICS emerged from his feuds with The Great Khali and Giant Gonzales and post-stroke Gordy and fucking Kama Mustafa and Bundy and why wasn't his Skyscraper run memorable?" attitude. A million Kane matches. A few hundred thousand Big Show matches, almost none when both were at reasonably full health.

[MasterJonBurr]

I think Rick Rude belongs. Beach Blast 92 is as good as it gets in my eyes and I felt like he was damned good no matter where he was working. Dragged an absolute classic out of Chono and his tag team with Manny Fernandez was outstanding. Worked well with all sorts of WWF underachievers and when he made the jump to the worker's haven WCW, he was suddenly one of the best in the world. Whether you believe his injury was real or not, it was the reason for his downfall and, otherwise, he probably continues ripping it up. VOTE RUDE, 2026 SWEATHOGS!

 

Yours,

JHHBjr

[goc]

If you want to shit on 'Taker's matches with HHH or whatever, fine. But I love this "how many CLASSICS emerged from his feuds with The Great Khali and Giant Gonzales and post-stroke Gordy and fucking Kama Mustafa and Bundy and why wasn't his Skyscraper run memorable?" attitude. A million Kane matches. A few hundred thousand Big Show matches, almost none when both were at reasonably full health.

And Taker/Big Show did manage to finally have a really good match. Sometime after Big Show's return when he was in pretty good shape. He never did manage to do that with Kane though.

[MikeF]

 

 

Hey, good showing for Piper. Anyone who knocks him can't do so without seeing his Portland run. But that's not the entirety of his case.

So, the entire Portland run was great enough to counter 20 years of supbar in-ring work ? I really have a hard time believing that.

Piper was great in Mid-Atlantic.

[Jmare007]

Tanahashi's placement should end the debate about whether the anonymous/leecher votes would change the results about this poll in a significant way. I mean, if there is one guy that should've gotten a big boost out of a "non PWO" vote was him and he only made half the ballots. And 93.2% of the voters "considered Mainstream Japanese Wrestling (AJPW, NJPW, etc...)" when submitting their list.

 

I had him at 50 but I'm happy with his ranking. How many post 2000's guys are left besides Angle, Joe, Punk, AJ and Bryan?