Strummer Posted October 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 Dave has said the end goal for Brock was always to put over Roman but they are still freaked out by the crowd reactions for Roman and wouldn't dare do it now. But it's still the end goal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 What exactly is the end-game with Brock? Shinsuke Nakamura. I doubt it happens, but it should. As great as Nakamura is & as much as I love him, I don't have any faith in WWE to get behind someone that speaks broken English. At least not on the main roster. RAW is all about 20-minute dialogues, especially if you're a main eventer. If you're in the main event, where someone that is feuding with Brock would need to be, you're going to have to be able to open RAW with a boring-ass, 20-minute Authority promo. I also don't have faith in WWE to actually utilize managers as mouthpieces anymore. Which is a terrible shame. Dutch would have been great. Paul Heyman should be great but we saw what happened when he was with Cesaro. I like the idea of Nakamura beating Brock more so than the speculative Samoa Joe encounter but I guess I would be fine with that too. Anyone can be choked out! I really want both Nakamura & Samoa Joe to work out on the main roster. There's no reason Nakamura couldn't be IC champ for like two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 I understand why people are pissed but honestly no one from the main roster is going to be presented as relevant and an actual star. I don't really have much emotional connection or think much of most of the people they've acquired through the indy raid so I'll take a match they will actually build and present as important over Owens vs Zayn or whatever. Also it's come to a point where even if they did the same thing with 95% of the people they have on the roster I still wouldn't care. Also at this point Reigns is pretty much a midcarder more over than his push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 Also at this point Reigns is pretty much a midcarder more over than his push. It's funny how people act like he's gotten this never ending super push (that's included a bunch of midcard PPV matches) at the expense of others yet the people who complain about his push don't seem to have any problem with the fact that the last time Seth Rollins was in a PPV match that wasn't for the WWE Title was February 2015. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Jackson Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 As usual, the Monday Night Wars continues to be the only thing in wrestling history that actually mattered. I always wonder who is even left for them to drag back for the nostalgia pop. With ratings the way they are, you'd expect them to be shitting themselves and hot-shotting some guys to the top but instead, it's into the chequebook and back to the past. Again. The match will probably be morbidly fascinating and it may be cool to see Goldberg again but this, once again, is an indictment of how badly the current roster has been squandered where no one is even as believable match for Brock. Could you imagine Vince bringing in Bob Backlund to feud with Rock in 2000? That's what this is like in terms of the gap between Goldberg's peak and today. I can imagine a Bob Backlund vs Rock feud in 2000 and I'm imagining it would've been awesome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FMKK Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 Dave has said the end goal for Brock was always to put over Roman but they are still freaked out by the crowd reactions for Roman and wouldn't dare do it now. But it's still the end goal Just have him cheat to beat Brock and fucking turn him. If they turn him heel and book him like a badass for 6 months, the crowds will end up cheering him. I have no idea how the smark audience can boo him but deify Seth Rollins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted October 5, 2016 Report Share Posted October 5, 2016 Dave has said the end goal for Brock was always to put over Roman but they are still freaked out by the crowd reactions for Roman and wouldn't dare do it now. But it's still the end goal Just have him cheat to beat Brock and fucking turn him. If they turn him heel and book him like a badass for 6 months, the crowds will end up cheering him. I have no idea how the smark audience can boo him but deify Seth Rollins. Roman was chosen by management after being hand picked for training and never paying his dues. Seth worked his way from the indies and got pushed to the top from hard work and not at the expense of someone better like Daniel Bryan. Not what I believe, but that is the reasons (I think) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaufman316 Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 I'm not the target audience, but I agree. Yuck. I also think this is going to mean very little. Goldberg peaked before a lot of fans were even born. He's a relic from an era long gone. Plus, the fanbase has changed and I'm not even sure it would get over now. The average WWE fan in 2016 would rather watch Brian Kendrick and Sami Zayn than Goldberg and Brock Lesnar. I recall reading that Goldberg's DVD sold well above expectations, and that his video game appearances have been part and parcel with further success and exposure for him and the game franchises. Maybe there's something to that? Vince has typically been receptive to workers who move merch (excepting Those Darn Millenials). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeg Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 I think current fans fall into two camps- First, people who watched Goldberg in WCW and WWF/E and remember what a shit show his match his whole WWF/E run was and how horrible his WM match against Lesnar was. Second, people who are too young to know who Goldberg is/was. Its not like Sting where the older fan base always was hoping for a WWF/E run. Goldberg got his WWF/E run and it was disappointing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeg Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 Dave has said the end goal for Brock was always to put over Roman but they are still freaked out by the crowd reactions for Roman and wouldn't dare do it now. But it's still the end goal The crowd reaction for Roman is their own fault. I honestly lost count at the number of things they did wrong in handling his push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 About an hour ago on twitter. According to his sources. This is pretty big if true. Dave also alluded to this on WOR yesterday. Hopefully this means they've dropped the Shane program for Brock. Saving that for Mania... Definitely my first thought when I saw Survivor Series for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Ewiak Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 Goldberg vs. Lesnar isn't a match to sell to the current crowd, who'd be more entertained by Zayn vs. Kendrick in a flippy match. It's to appeal to the 35 year old Dad who was downing beers and watching Goldberg spear fools as a teenager and watched some of the Lesnar UFC matches. In other words, to juice the Network numbers in the 4Q instead of just WM. I also question why Lesnar's end should be Nakamura. Nak's great, but he's a mid to late 30's non-English speaking guy who's already kinda broken down who will be likely out of the WWE within a few years. The guy who takes down Lesnar should be somebody who will be around at WM in 2025 in the main event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strummer Posted October 6, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 Dave seemed to be implying that Vince sees Shane v Brock as the mania match. Sounds like this match is simply to promote the video game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 I hate to harp on results. I really do, but when I first heard this I rolled my eyes because I can't imagine Goldberg coming back just to put Brock over. However, it is the only result that makes big picture sense. The match itself - with this Brock in this wwe - could and should be really good it if happens, but it is one of those cases where wins and loses do matter some. If Goldberg is willing to come in and put Brock over, I am all in, otherwise this just seems like it kills what is left of Brocks momentum and aura for next to nothing. A one off DQ or double count out would be equally unsatisfying. Brock's endgame probably still should be Reigns, unless they were willing to switch focus to someone else. I always thought Zayn could do it, but they don't seem interested in that and he is far away from climbing the mountain in a way that makes that payoff worth the build. They painted themselves in a little bit of a corner with him, but they could still pay it all of with any number of guys (Rollins, Styles, or Ambrose among the first I think of), but the problem is they really need/want a face for it and most of the best guys for it are heels or real grey area characters right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Jackson Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 Goldberg will put over Lesnar after like three F 5's, and Brock will probably bleed for him and sell it like he won a war. Nothing wrong with that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 oops.... repeat post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 I hope you are right. My response to the finish says a lot more about me than him (or anyone involved). I obviously don't know the dude. I always just read a subtext of "I want a big win" into his discussion of "the right situation" when he talked about a comeback. Regardless, I hope he comes back and I hope we get a Brock match. I think it sounds like a ton of fun. It would be hard to be a lot worse than what they did at Mania, so at least they could improve on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NintendoLogic Posted October 6, 2016 Report Share Posted October 6, 2016 I figured that "the right situation" meant a dumptruck full of money and some degree of creative control to prevent him from being booked like a complete goof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmmnx Posted October 7, 2016 Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 I really wouldn't mind seeing Goldberg against Roman or Rusev. I don't know if I want to see anyone against "suplex city" Brock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted October 7, 2016 Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 I figured that "the right situation" meant a dumptruck full of money and some degree of creative control to prevent him from being booked like a complete goof. After the Goldust Wig Incident I'm sure he would want veto power on any angles he's put in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted October 7, 2016 Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 I hate to harp on results. I really do, but when I first heard this I rolled my eyes because I can't imagine Goldberg coming back just to put Brock over. However, it is the only result that makes big picture sense. The match itself - with this Brock in this wwe - could and should be really good it if happens, but it is one of those cases where wins and loses do matter some. If Goldberg is willing to come in and put Brock over, I am all in, otherwise this just seems like it kills what is left of Brocks momentum and aura for next to nothing. A one off DQ or double count out would be equally unsatisfying. Brock's endgame probably still should be Reigns, unless they were willing to switch focus to someone else. I always thought Zayn could do it, but they don't seem interested in that and he is far away from climbing the mountain in a way that makes that payoff worth the build. They painted themselves in a little bit of a corner with him, but they could still pay it all of with any number of guys (Rollins, Styles, or Ambrose among the first I think of), but the problem is they really need/want a face for it and most of the best guys for it are heels or real grey area characters right now. Whether it's Sami Zayn or not, I really do like the idea of a smaller guy cracking the code and doing a great underdog story, but they don't tend to push small guys proactively, so that's a tough one. I think Reigns is the best bet of the options they have, but I also feel like that's going to make the resentment even worse if they treat it as a babyface moment. It doesn't have to be Sami Zayn and at this rate it shouldn't be, but it would help if it's someone that fans perceive as being held down, correctly or incorrectly. If Daniel Bryan was healthy, he'd be perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strummer Posted October 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 So six months away and we seem to have a few locks for mania. Shane v Brock and Rollins v Hunter are set in stone. Most likely Cena v Taker or Cena v Styles for one last run at the title. Reading between the lines with Dave it seems the plan is for Reigns to chase the title again but honestly him v Owens does not seem like a big match. At least now. Bayley v Sasha? Becky v Nikki? On second thought I wouldn't mind a Cena v Ambrose title program as those two have crazy good chemistry together and I don't know if anyone on the roster other than maybe AJ bring the best out of Cena (at least promo wise) than Ambrose. And throw in a Shaq v Big Show celeb match Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted October 7, 2016 Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 Out of all that I'm definitely most interested in Shaq vs. Big Show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted October 7, 2016 Report Share Posted October 7, 2016 So, Mania already looks dreadful with all those dream/nightmare matches. Hey, if they do Sasha vs Bailey, they should steal the show at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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