Guest TheShawshankRudotion Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 I think he was doin somethin else other than smokin a cig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest brian Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Too clean to be a blunt. Had to be blow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sass Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Yeah, that shit looks more "trendy" in H-wood than someone smoking a giant doobie. The reaction and the look on the face of the guy sitting next to Leo when he realized they were on camera was great. "Oh shit man, put that shit doooowwnn..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheShawshankRudotion Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 The constant wiping of his nose sorta tips one off. The question we had when watching is was whether or not the ring on his finger was related. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cam Chaos Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Some guys have better ones than others (Frank Mir snapping Sylvia's arm like a twig for starters). That's actually a bad armbar. He should have inverted his elbow, not snapped his forearm. It wasn't so much an armbar so much as a guy putting all his weight on the other person's forearm while pulling their wrist against their cup. Mir is actually quite sloppy. He couldn't finish Wes Sims even with the arm triangle locked in. Even his coach Sergio Penha has commented on his lack of work ethic in training which to an extent explains his questionable cardio. Babalu's Against Wiuff was pretty nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Thread Killer Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Mir is actually quite sloppy. He couldn't finish Wes Sims even with the arm triangle locked in. Even his coach Sergio Penha has commented on his lack of work ethic in training which to an extent explains his questionable cardio. Oh my gawd, finally somebody agrees with me about Mir. UFC was promoting him as the Golden Boy, (which is why I loved it when Ian Freeman knocked his ass OUT) but I never saw him tested against anybody really good...mind you Pride has all the top heavyweights locked up. I think that Dana White badly wants a poster boy. For a while it was Tito, and he wanted it to be Mir. Mir was young, good looking, cocky, handsome, and from Vegas so he was over with the fans. I honestly think if you put him in there with somebody like Nog, Cro-Cop, or Fedor, he'd have been destroyed in two minutes. I always said about Mir...don't believe the hype. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 No one's saying Mir is as good as any of those people. But he's good by UFC heavyweight standards. Frankly they need him back pretty badly right now to get some talent in the division. Arlovski will beat him though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cam Chaos Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 UFC's heavyweight division could be better if they were willing to pay the fighters a decent amount to fight.TUF wasn't created just to have a reality show, it's so they could make marketable fighters hungry for the big time without having to pay them much for their services. "Ninja" Rua was offered by PRIDE to compete in the UFC as part of a talent exchange, as were Fujita and Sakuraba before that. BTT have offered fighters to compete in the UFC but what they have offered in return would barely cover travel costs for them. UFC did not want to pay any of them what PRIDE pays them and therefore nothing ever came of the negotiations. PRIDE is more than capable of paying any UFC fighter to compete in their promotion which is why we have seen UFC fighters compete in or sign with PRIDE. THe UFC don't have the top talent that PRIDE has because they aren't willing to pay for top talent, they'd rather take guys successful in minor league promotions, make them go through the TUF system to test them as well as get their faces out there and then give them a contract that appears to be decent but in fact ends up being quite low in the long term. Mario Sperry compared it to the World Series vs the World Cup: the UFC likes to promote itself as being the best in the world with the best competitors but the majority of people competing aren't from around the world, they are American so it is not a World Series, but a National Series, however that doesn't stop them promoting it under that name. PRIDE on the other hand does involve teams and competitors from all over the world and a good performance earns as much credit as a win in most instances. Mir apparently turns up when he wants, trains as long as he wants to and leaves when he wants. His coaches apparently told him to take his regime seriously and take better care of himself after he won the belt but he ignored their advice, took time off to enjoy his win and continued to ride his bike around town even though they told him his riding would be the death of him. Thankfully their prediction was off and he survived even though his leg was shattered. However he's no longer champion and I doubt he ever will be now Arlovski is recognised as UFC HW champ. Arlovski has better hands, a solid ground game, constantly improving wrestling, trains like a demon and comes to fight in top condition everytime. Mir has a ground game that is effective for the first round against lesser skilled opponents. I don't think such a fight would be very competitive. Also now with Forrest Griffin there is no need for Mir as posterboy so unless he sorts his shit out I can't see him getting the belt back or receiving the recognition he used to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 UFC doesn't have the financial resources of Pride though. They pay what they can but at the end of the day they've got to make a profit and have been a niche sport until recently. If they can build a solid fanbase and add buyrates you'll see fighters make more. I'm sure they'd love to pay their top fighters six figures per fight but it just can't happen. No one has said it here but the hate that the TUF gets is absurd. A lot of people act like these are just guys they grabbed off the streets. Most of these guys were coming to the UFC sooner or later. They just choose a way to make them bigger names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest brian Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Show did a 2.0 and a 3.7 in the 18-34 demographic according to MMAWeekly (and Da Meltz). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cam Chaos Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 UFC doesn't have the financial resources of Pride though. They pay what they can but at the end of the day they've got to make a profit and have been a niche sport until recently. If they can build a solid fanbase and add buyrates you'll see fighters make more. I'm sure they'd love to pay their top fighters six figures per fight but it just can't happen. No one has said it here but the hate that the TUF gets is absurd. A lot of people act like these are just guys they grabbed off the streets. Most of these guys were coming to the UFC sooner or later. They just choose a way to make them bigger names. The problem I feel with the UFC is they overpay some fighters and underpay others. Guys that haven't went through TUF get maybe 2k + 2k win bonus for their first PPV fight, TUF guys get 12k + 12k. That's a large difference simply because the audience is more familiar with one than the other even though both guys may be equally talented and have equal experience in minor promotions. Their top fighters do earn six figures. However they often earn more than the champions. Couture makes 5 times as much money as Arlovski when he wins even though Arlovski is HW champ and Randy is now only a contender. The Fertitta brothers are loaded and can pay more, they just choose not to right now unless a fighter plays hardball. Also the UFC has dropped talented fighters for one poor performance (see Salaverry) and even fighters that have been back to winning ways over petty shit (see Lindland). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 Opps, double post. Read below. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted November 8, 2005 Report Share Posted November 8, 2005 You're paying for a name not skill. Chris Leben will bring in more buys and viewers than a Joe Riggs should so he should make more money. Why spend that 12k on someone that will bring in a few hardcore fans or spend that on an TUF fighter and drag in several thousand from people that watched the show. It's smarter of the UFC to spend on guys that will give a greater return. Lindland is solely to blame for his firing. Had he not worn the shirt he'd still be employed. If you disobey the boss you're going to get canned. As for Salaverry, it was in his contract that he was gone after a loss. Considering it was their first Fight Night he needed to perform and he didn't. It doesn't mean that he won't be back. As far as how much the money the owners have. Business is about the bottom line. The UFC's highest buyrate ever was 150,000 buys and that was several years ago. They aren't going to flush their fortune on the UFC. They have to pick and choose or you end up like WCW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheShawshankRudotion Posted November 9, 2005 Report Share Posted November 9, 2005 They were paying Lindland more than what they thought he was worth, I imagine the shirt thing was just an opportunity to let him go. Lindland is not a marketable fighter, and he's too damn good to risk putting against the top guys. Would you rather have Rich Franklin or Matt Lindland as champion? I like Matt, but I can see why UFC would let him go. I hope Lindland ends up in PRIDE. Salaverry deserved to get let go. UFC sent the message that if you don't bring it, they won't bring you back. This mentality led to what we saw on Saturday. Those guys saw their opportunities, and they didn't just go for the win, they went for the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Thread Killer Posted November 10, 2005 Report Share Posted November 10, 2005 I'm not going to argue that PRIDE doesn't pay more than UFC, because they clearly do...but I think there is more to it than that. Let's not forget that PRIDE does not test fighters for steroids (which is fine because I don't think they're illegal in Japan) but UFC does because they have to as mandated by the athletic commission. I honestly think that the major reason PRIDE has not sent any fighters to UFC, and the reason PRIDE still hasn't run the show in Vegas that they've been talking about for YEARS is because the PRIDE guys would have to piss in a cup, and DSE doesn't want that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cam Chaos Posted November 10, 2005 Report Share Posted November 10, 2005 DSE actually does drug test them, they just don't release the results. That wasy they can have a fighter's balls in a vince come negotiation time. Apparently Dana doesn't take Sakakibara's calls anymore which has made their efforts to promote a PRIDE event with Zuffa's help very difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Thread Killer Posted November 11, 2005 Report Share Posted November 11, 2005 Strange, I remember Zach Arnold reporting earlier in the year that they don't test for roids. Ah well. I have been off PRIDE for quite some time anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest brian Posted November 11, 2005 Report Share Posted November 11, 2005 Drug testing vs. steroid testing. They'll test for illegal substances, but not steroids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts