Jetlag

It seems a few of these candidates have been nominated, with names like Jim Londos and Megumi Fuji. Pro wrestlers who are clearly extremely talented, but cannot accurately be compared to wrestlers who have a lengthy career on tape either due to lack of footage or simply only wrestling a handful of times. Who are some guys who you consider to be great based on a small sample of performances? Obviously, the French and European footage has been ripe with these types: - Tony Oliver. Greatest two match wrestler ever? Just an incredible heel. - Le Big Chief. Menacing crowbar wrestler who I would like to see wrestle Hashimoto - Jaques Couderc. Another brilliant French technician. Only one match on tape. - Clayton Thomson. Only had a few matches air on TWC but has a legendary rep and looks like a great wrestler. - Naoyuki Taira. Only really wrestled for about 1 year, but he looked quite natural at shootstyle. - Marcel Parmentier. We didn't even get a full match of his, but is wily veteran brawler act looks awesome. - Tony Martino. Only appears in two tags and looks incredible doing both technical exchanges and heelwork. - Liano Pellacani. Only 3 matches. Another incredible heel. - Seichi Ikemoto. MMA guy who looked damn good in his U-Style appearances. - Mota dos Santos. Portuguese(?) grappler who could do straight catch and crazy spring matches. Has a nice German suplex. - Aquiles. Legendary brazilian brawler. An archive dropping a motherload of brazilian catch on us would be nice.

Yeah, that's the TV episode I have and which is woefully clipped down.

There was another Meiko/Hokuto singles in 1997, unfortunately only 5 minutes aired. If there's a full version on an obscure commercial release or something I'd kill to get it, because what was shown looked amazing.

Watched some Mochizuki today: https://reverseviperhold.blogspot.com/2021/05/gwe-watching-masaaki-mochizuki.html Pretty underwhelming. He lost a lot of energy compared to his 90s days. The worst thing is he comes across as an indy guy with a kicker gimmick rather than a karate dude. I was also super annoyed with the Toryumon matches all having pointless limb work and interferences. Doesn't help that Mochizuki doesn't have much charisma. They should've kept the role of evil karate guy for Okamura, who has much more sleazy charme.

Actually, Ishikawa and Ikeda had a pretty great match as early as 1994 in Michinoku Pro They matched up two more times in 1995. @Phil Schneider didn't you mention getting a tape of one of their PWFG matches?

There's a bit of Sanniez work on YouTube already: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwzFqCFojMo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXh2X0Cjkjk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TMEIFxmj6A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsUd3TEHPjw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySZ53rWYIVQ The rest of his stuff in the archive: PEDRO CABRERA & ALBERT SANNIEZ VS TONY MARTINO & BERNARD CACLARD (08/31/1968; 35:52) GUY CAVILLIER VS ALBERT SANNIEZ (02/01/1969; 19:11) BILLY CATANZARO & GILBERT LEMAGOUROU VS ALBERT SANNIEZ & BOB REMY (03/12/1971; 42:20) ALBERT SANNIEZ & KADER HASSOUNI VS BERNARD CACLARD & PIERRE BERNAERT (02/15/1973; 28:37) ANGELITO VS ALBERT SANNIEZ (02/19/1977; 10:17) LE PETIT PRINCE & GERARD BOUVET VS ANTON TEJERO & ALBERT SANNIEZ (01/01/1979; 31:38) JACKY RICHARD & ALBERT SANNIEZ VS JEAN CORNE & RENE CABELLEC (09/08/1980; 36:05) There's also him & some unknown vs. the Mercier Brothers somewhere in the rubble. Apparently, he fought Alan Sarjeant on British TV. I'd give a lot to see that match.

I'm not ignoring her Crush Gals run. I've said I consider it overrated, and something I could live without seeing again. But people should watch for themselves. Obviously, we have a different criteria when it comes to this. If someone is a great worker, they should be able to understand what they are doing enough to translate their greatness into different setting, in my view. I love variety, and when in doubt I will probably rank a guy with a long excellent career in a variety of settings over a guy who had a great run doing the same type of territory main event over and over for 10 years. Of course Sano in PWFG and UWFi is the best, but him being good in NOAH rather than bad is a decent push ahead.

It's 2021 and I'm still finding Honda matches I enjoy. Sadly he rarely unleashed his grappling side in undercard tags, but he is really fun as an ogreish guy throwing headbutts and bulldogs and sometimes stiff lariats. A NOAH deep dive will definitely be in order for Honda.

I don't see this at all. Having good matches adds to ones case, having bad matches detracts. Having a bad match once in a while is ok, being bad consistently when you are the centerpiece of a promotion and theoretically perfectly capable of at least having a pretty decent match, to the point of where it kills peoples interest in promotions (and I'm far from in the minority in thinking this) should be a pretty huge knock. Triple Hs reign of terror was bad enough to sour many people on him forever despite him being (supposedly) great at his peak (would probably rank Asuka above him, though). The thing is, there is tons of guys and girls with strong peaks, and plenty of great work outside their peaks. The last countdown had 500 people on the list, with some huge legends like Chicky Starr being at the bottom. That's why we do these deep dive discussions of wrestlers and try to figure out how great they really were. Peak alone doesn't really cut it and that was something that was mentioned a lot during the last project. The wrestler comparisons you made are quite apples and oranges, too. Did Misawa have some bad matches in NOAH? Yes, but he also had plenty of great ones. It never got to the point where he become dreadful to watch or killed peoples interest in the company. To be fair, his bad outings did knock him down a few places on my list. Flair? Admittedly, I didn't watch WWE and WCW on a weekly basis, but I thought he had plenty of good to great matches even as an old man. Plus, he understood his role and he was never pushed as a constant main eventer at the time. Admittedly, I think I had him outside the top 50 last time IIRC. Tommy Rogers? I don't think I ranked him last time. That sad, was he ever booked in any lengthy singles matches? If he sucked in them, then yes that should be held against him. From what I can find, he had barely a handful of singles that went over 5 minutes on ECW TV in the late 90s. Not at all comparable to Asuka who had lengthy main events in singles and various tag formats left and right in almost weekly televised apperances for years. Should people look at Asukas peak work? Yes, absolutely. Never said they shouldn't. I think her peak is quite overrated, often underwhelming (especially the Chigusa singles matches) and not something I have any desire to revisit anytime soon. But they shouldn't just watch her peak and be done with it. Nor should they vote for her based on the matches they liked and dismissing the rest. If you actually watch a decent sample of all her work and still vote for her, honest to god saying that you think the good outweighs the bad and justifies putting her above 400 other workers - go ahead.

Gilbert Leduc Maybe the picture of the stoic French baby face wrestler. Generally understood to be "The Man" of French catch, and he is quite the ace character. Both excellent technician and really great at slugging it out, with a knack for matches that build up neatly. Shows up from 1957 - 1977 and looks good against a wide variety of opponents, from typical heels to giant masked monsters. We've yet to dive into the second half of that period but I have a feeling he'll be excellent from beginning to end. Recommended matches: vs. Warnia de Zarzecki, 5/30/1957 vs. Rocco Lamban, 10/30/1958 w Claude Montourcy vs. Karl von Chenok & Robert Gastel, 5/23/1957

Jack Gallagher He's been really good to great since at least 2011. Probably the best WoS worshipper of the modern era, as he comes across actually authentic doing his stuff and he just executes it amazingly well. Also adopt at shootstyle grappling and hybrid matches. Very charismatic and translated his charisma and style well into a WWE setting. Very good working both technical matches, comedy and lengthy RoH style indy main events. We probably won't be seeing him wrestling again, but hell, he is in the running for the best junior workers of the modern era. Recommended matches: vs. Oney Lorcan, 205 Live 4/10/2020 vs. Chad Gable, 205 Live 6/11/2019 vs. Takuya Sugawara, Zero1 3/21/2013

I dedicated todays blogpost to watching some Murakami: https://reverseviperhold.blogspot.com/2021/05/gwe-watching-3-kazunari-murakami.html The thing that stuck out was how natural Murakami was at his thing. He was 5 matches into his career and already bringing it in a big way. It's not just that he was a crowbar or a mechnical shootstylist, he understood how to play his character, how to set himself up and how to play off other wrestlers. He works wrestlers as different as Ishikawa, Otsuka and Greco in exactly the right ways. He's also STILL wrestling and making people excited when NOAH wheels him out, so that has to account for something.

Well, this is supposed to be the project where we nitpick each candidate to death. Evaluating the hole career should be encouraged. If we just skip over the less interesting parts it's just gonna become a cherry pick a ton. I don't know if anyone is actually gonna vote for Jim Londos, that seems more like a nomination to stir some discussion rather than being a serious candidate. Since during the first project it was actively said that you shouldn't vote if you haven't actually seen a candidate having matches. Who knows, maybe I'm just overly negative about Asuka and the next person to go through JD' and ARSION will think she is totally rad

If people want to evaluate someone fairly, they should check out their whole career and not just a handful of pimped matches. That said I think Asukas 80s stuff is largely forgettable.

I am surprised old PCO hasn't been brought up again considering he had quite the amazing resurrgence since 2018 or so, becoming insanely over with indy fans, and earning himself several dream matches and even a RoH title run. Also, he popped up in a random chain match against Franz van Buyten in 1991 or so, so that's something too.

I don't even hate Takada that much Maybe if Takada joined BattlARTS in 1999, hogged the main event scene by going over all the native wrestlers in boring repetitive matches, and then did the same thing to Zero1 2 years later or something.

This is easily the best justification post for voting for a certain guy I've seen in a while, only rivalled by the one in the Ultimate Warrior thread I will say that Mr. Pogo is actually quite the effective heel and a good character wrestler. Definitely better than Triple H.

I've been on a bit of a Gannosuke kick lately. People have talked about his 90s work, but I also really enjoy his more veteran work in the 2000s. People mostly remember him for the outrageous heel stuff, but the guy is a sneaky good matworker and mostly earns his paychecks being a really great old school type worker ala Tully Blanchard carrying some yokel to a good 20 minute studio TV match. Mr. Gannosuke & Hisakatsu Oya & GOEMON vs. Soldier & Mineo Fujita & Black Buffalo (WMF 3/3/2006) Really, really fun SWS style tag where everyone smacks each other hard and works a fast pace. Gannosuke is pretty great here in the Tenryu role of guy everyone wants to take down and who wolds the match together with his charisma and presence. Soldier acts like a spunky dipshit, so Gannosuke decides to break a kendo stick in half and stab the shit out of him. Really good FIP section with Soldier bleeding and all the veterans looking good. Dug Oya, who did little in the match except hit cool throat jabs and sick looking backdrops as Oya always does. There was one lariat/backdrop combo from Gannosuke and Oya on Soldier that looked like a decapitation. Everyone on the junior team looked good also and most importantly, everyone understood their role. Mr. Gannosuke & Tarzan Goto vs. Mineo Fujita & Soldier, WMF 9/5/2005 - EPIC Really great match largely thanks to the awesome veteran work of Gannosuke and Goto. These two basically treated their junior opponents like the Anderson Bros would treat a jobber team for large parts of the match. We get a really cool opening segment where they all hit the mat. Goto looks older and fatter here, but he is still so great rolling around, bumping for armdrags, working headlocks and eventually punching his opponent in the face. Soldier was in the role of spunky underdog here, he makes the mistake of challening Goto and ends up getting smacked down. Then, because Goto is Goto, physically besting an opponent isn’t enough for him, so busts out the foreign objects and Soldier is soon a bloody mess. Lord, has there ever been a match where Goto didn’t end up covered in his opponents blood? Soldier on offense isn’t very compelling, but he got in so little offense in this match and was willing to let Goto chuck tables at his head that I am willing to like him. Mineo Fujita is a bit more compelling on offense, as he has really good looking dropkicks, and he has some really fun sections where he mixes it up with Goto, who works surprisingly well against this type of opponent. However, Gannosuke catches him in a Scorpion Deathlock, and following that we get another segment built around Goto and Gannosuke destroying his back with awesome looking suplexes and slams. Lord knows I may be desensetized, but Goto trying to blow out Fujitas spine with a damn Vader Bomb to the back was absolutely sick looking. Then we get a great finishing run largely built around powerbombs and hard lariats. That kinda stuff is bread and butter for FMW workrate tags, but the body of the match here was built so well with Fujita and Soldier looking to be hanging on by a thread that I gave a shit. Also, wonderful nearfall here where Fujita catches Gannosuke in his own Gannosuke Clutch. Mr. Gannosuke vs. Mineo Fujita, WMF 7/1/2006 Apparently Fujita is Mr. Gannosukes boy, and here they go long in what probably is Fujitas career match. I respect the hell out of Mr. Gannosuke for making a name for himself as a sleazy garbage brawling heel, and riding it out in the twilight of his career in grapple-heavy matches. Again this starts with lots of cool matwork, with Fujita busting out a cool calf slicer, and Gannosuke catching him with a crafty abdominal stretch. Gannosuke ends up working over Fujita and eventually working over his arm with some cool stretches before a grand old finishing run that was well done. Fujita isn’t super special or anything but his arm selling was servicable and he didn’t have any retarded offense, which I appreciate. Brutal brutal finish. Mr. Gannosuke vs. Manabu Hara (Batos Cafe 4/3/2018) Awesome match, which may actually be the best Gannosuke singles I’ve seen, which is crazy to say about a match that happened in 2018. I guess random uploads from Japanese micro indy related YouTube channels are the new gold. I think this was during Gannosukes retirement run so he was bringing the goods. First half of the match is all matwork. Suruga is obviously younger and more athletic and pushing the pace, so Gannosuke breaks out a bunch of awesome Fujiwaraesque counters. Totally didn’t know he had that in him. Second half Suruga continues to dominate by laying into Gannosuke with kicks and palms, I also did not expect a 48 year old has-been-coasting-for-years Gannosuke to eat that kind of stiff punishment. It’s really all about whether Gannosuke is tough enough to survive and break out a counter or whether the younger wrestler will blow him away. Gannosuke is of course a really fun tricky pro wrestler, he can always turn a match around by just kicking someone in the balls or busting out his awesome Gannosuke Clutch, and he fires back with some crowbar lariats and big bombs of his own. No idea what’s been going on lately with so many awesome unexpected Japan indy matches popping up but I love it.

2020 blessed us with another small trove of prime Lasartesse footage. We can now see that he was a very unique, both violent and charismatic heel. Literally everything he did in his matches was to generate heat. It's no wonder he ended up being such a star. Has there ever been a truer heel than Jack de Lasartesse?

Survival Tobita has been quite active in the last half a decade. He is now Pro Wrestlings Harmoney Korine and runs those "Unemployment Pro Wrestling" shows which are so seedy and desperate. He a had match against Homeless Jimmy that went over 30 minutes and is a mix of blood, violence, and surreal comedy.

Like what? She single handedly killed the main event scenes of JD and ARSION. She also had plenty of shitshows in GAEA. Quite frankly, her selling is usually non existant and she is pretty dull on offense when not throwing crowbar kicks or powerbombing people through tables. Worst of all was her tendency to do the same sloth brawling and heel faction spots in a stream of matches in the late 90s and early 2000s. Her most famous match, the 1985 Jaguar match, is just a mindless sprint and Jaguar looks better. From 1995 onwards it's quite remarkable how bad she is considering she was facing great wrestlers constantly and yet her being in a good match feels like a miracle.

Lioness Asuka has to be one of the worst "legendary" wrestler of all time.

He looks amazing in the clips. His offense in the Nagurski match feels inventive by 2021 standards (check out the armbreaker in the ropes and those freaky spinning slams). Maybe if time travel becomes a thing in the next 5 years?

There is a cool Fuchi & somebody vs. C3Po & R2D2 tag in 1979. Fuchi hits a cool punch combo on 3CPO

Very cool wrestler in concept. In reality, he is pretty mediocre or just plain sucks most of the time. I mean, I like the defense of him, but I don't think he's ever been a Top 30 wrestler in his country when Japanese wrestling was worth giving a shit about. Apparently, the name "Kendo Kashin" was given to him in Austria and doesn't mean anything, which I find fitting.