Matt D

I will say that for both Andre and Tiger Mask, I think it's a combination of far more footage being more easily available so people could "see for themselves," (which helps Andre's earlier career) combined with criteria changing (which hugely helps Andre's later career). Past MAYBE John Tenta, I think Andre is the deepest and cleanest opposite of Tiger Mask there is.

I have more to say about Andre vis a vis Tiger Mask and perceptions (though I'd argue: really, out side of the people who did the 80s DVDVR project and a few people who talk to then, has the perception changed on Tiger Mask? Has it changed on Brody past us? Etc.), but I've got family stuff going on til tomorrow. We'll see where the conversation is then?

It's us basically.

I think that is way off to be honest. All through the 90s and 00s Andre's work was considered poor with but a few exceptions. It's only in the last few years that it's been reexamined and the small things are far more appreciated now than they were years ago. It's About as far opposite of Tiger Mask as you could possibly get.

Charles can you elaborate on the Tiger Mask point?

I think it's more that he punches people in the face hard?

Ultimate Warrior in six mans was always pretty amazing.

I think it's a pretty open category. I think the issue of contention is more interesting if it's about Super Porky.

Andre. It's not just that he was Andre but he's a wrestler who seemed to know exactly what he was doing in the ring at every point and it was always the right thing. Henry, Quake, and Blackwell all deserve discussion though. Blackwell might have given too much sometimes but it was so wildly entertaining it made up for it (And he's probably the best draw of the three but between Summerslam 90 and 2012,you can make arguments), but the other two worked strictly as big men better than almost anyone.

It really wants you to say that Tony Garea is a better baby face than any of these guys.

I got way too much of a kick of randomly walking down a street in DC today and seeing the Exotic Express. I forgot they were here tonight.

Maybe he just didn't want the emails from the crazies if he didn't put it?

1979. I'm not kidding in the least.

That's Jim Ross.

At one point I tried to make a blog with my Buddy rose stuff, after PWO went down the first time but before the second. I never got very far in posting it but that was the name I was using too. It's a fine name. EDIT: It was territorial expedition. I was close.

Alright. first of all, you did a really good job summing up the match, and frankly, so did the announcers. I do think it's better than you indicate, and not necessarily just for the fact it had a clear narrative. It's in the performances and character work. Kamala, as you said was great, not just in his portrayal but also with his selling. He made everything Andre do look huge and powerful and meaningful, which anyone can do, really, but when you have a guy Kamala's size and agility doing it, it means all the more. Andre's timing was spot on and I think, save for the transition spot yes, he was so expert at knowing how long to sell for and when to come back. He was a wrestler who could use a portrayal like Kamala's to the fullest. The fans ate up everything with a spoon too. Earlier in the night was David Sammartino vs Moondog Rex. If they had worked this same exact match, it would be logical, sure, maybe, but it also wouldn't have been any good because they would have brought different attributes and tools to the table. Here it worked because of who was in the ring. It was, in a lot of ways, the right match for these two wrestlers. That it was also a logical and well performed match only helped matters. I know you weren't as into this, but every time that Andre seemed to head across the ring to hit Kamala I was excited to see what the shot would look like and how Kamala would sell it and how the crowd would react. Slow motion is fine when almost every physical touch has that level of payoff. No, it wasn't blood and violence and big giant bumps (though there were bumps and it was, at times, violent), but it used the steel cage as an actual cage, in interesting ways, and I think it's well worth watching for that aspect of it alone, even if it does have a lot more to offer.

...yeah, so there's a Duggan/Bagwell vs Arn/Flair match I just found on dailymotion that I need to watch later. Also, to a lesser extent the Arn/Flair/Sullivan vs American Males/Duggan/Pittman match which Loch Ness was supposed to be a part of. Such weird combos.

I think it's on the last DVD bio they did for the Rock where Vince himself says he didn't like the "This is Your Life" skit and has no idea why it was so highly rated. Watching it live and as a fairly experienced wrestling fan at the time, I knew there was a payoff coming. Foley would go through all this sillyness, finally the last person would be revealed as someone who would attack the Rock along with Foley. Heel turn, easy feud. You don't run a 25 minute interview segment without a payoff, right? I still think myself and every other wrestling fan sat through that because they thought there was a big angle or swerve coming at the end. Abdullah the Butcher in a box?

Duggan's shoot was hard to listen to because he's pretty one dimensional and dense and hates little guys and what not. He's genial and really seems to like the fans and what not but there wasn't a ton there. God I don't know and I'm not making the blender joke. -Did he prefer working in front of the more niche Mid-South crowd or in front of the larger but perhaps less focused WWF crowds? -Ask him about working Andre at a point of his career when Andre was so immobile, but still able to get such a reaction with his every movement because of his presence and how good he was at what he did? -He had a really good run with Yokozuna in 93, with some super enjoyable foreign matches and the very memorable knockdown challenge on TV. I don't think he's talked much about that. -Most guys prefer being a heel but he really didn't have a heel run in the most publicized run of his career. Would he have wanted one and maybe a run at hogan or what not in the late 80s/early 90s? -Maybe if he thought Slaughter was underrated as a bumper/wrestler in 91? -The various fake russians he worked with/against in his career? -Stories of working Vader? -He worked a lot in his career teaming with tag teams. I remember notable matches with Demolition and the Rockers in six mans, but also in WCW on shows with Stars and Stripes... eh, I've got nothing there. -Something about the cancer speech in wcw but he's talked about that a lot. -WWF planned SO far ahead in the mid 80s. What WOULD have been the actual plans if he didn't get caught in the car? -Compare Watts and Vince?

It's amazing how far things have turned in a few months. The optimism of earlier this year, the idea that once they got the TV deal they'd be bulletproof and the network would be all bonus!

Rollins looks like a putz for not being put in the main ladder match when they put Orton in just like that. I'm trying to remember the last logic breach that big on WWE tv.

I was excited for the Stardust talk because I had no idea what pop reference they'd get. if any. Bryan went for NES' Pro Wrestling Starman and then Dave said NO NO NO, it's Dusty Rhodes' nickname Stardust. Bryan made sure to point out that he had gloves like AJ Styles. No mention of Bowie. No mention of A Clockwork Orange. No thought that this will lead to a split.

I want a long Wyatts vs Goldust/Stardust feud. I mean I know it has to end in a turn but my god, just imagine that.

That was the most meta thing ever. He had a completely different moveset. I'm not sure WWE's ever done anything like that before.

I might have written that thing up, but I've no idea where it'd be. I'll watch the thing in the next week though.