Omori in All Japan

[MikeCampbell]

Didn't want to clog up the yearbook thread with this (where John intially started talking about how Omori was wasted during the '90's.) John (or anyone else, Ditch?) was Misawa doing the booking at the end AJPW as we knew it, or was it Baba's widow? It sure seemed like No Fear were on the verge of a big push:

 

- Omori pins Kawada in semi final tag match on 1/23/00

- Omori and Takayama lose contendership match to Vader/Hansen on 2/12 (the tag title match itself was buildup for Vader/Kobashi later in the month)

- Omori and Takayama beat former All Asia Tag Champs Honda and Izumida on 2/23

- Omori pins Akiyama and Doc in the Carnival, and loses to Kobashi in the finals.

- During non-Carny matches, Omori and Takayama get wins over Kobashi/Shiga, Akiyama/Mossman, Doc/Scorpio, and Barton/Hawkfield. They do wind up on the losing side of some six mans, but neither of them drop the fall.

- The following series saw Takayama challenge Kobashi for the TC. Although there was no real build beyond another No Fear win over Kobashi/Shiga, along with a win over Hansen/Watts.

- The tour (and AJPW as we knew it) ends with the tag titles touranment in May, where they beat Misawa/Ogawa, but lose to Kawada/Taue (Kawada over Omori).

 

- In NOAH, No Fear doesn't really do much of note as a team. Takayama KO's Taue on the Big 12/00 show, where Omori gets squashed in short order by Hashimoto. Omori loses in the first round of the GHC Tourny to Jun, while Takayama goes to the finals. They become the 3rd GHC Tag Champions in 12/01 and lose them in 2/02. No Fear breaks up a few months later and Omori buggers off the US and never comes back.

[Ditch]

Pretty sure Misawa was booking. The conflict was that he didn't want to share power with Mrs. Baba.

 

Don't forget that in '99 they won the All Asia tag titles, beat Kawada/Taue on 6/9/99, Akiyama vs Omori headlined the 9/4/99 Budokan show, and they challenged Burning at the 10/30/99 Budokan.

 

Omori had the falling out in '02 regarding his US trip. It's hard to say whether there were hard feelings before then. Don't forget that Omori beat Misawa on 12/8/00.

[jdw]

Misawa booked in general. The Babas booked big picture. The run through the 199 Dome is pretty much how Baba would/did book it:

 

Misawa --> Kawada

Kawada --> Vader

Vader --> Misawa

 

Kawada got hurt, so Taue did the job for Vader.

 

Defenses over Kobashi and Kawada are pretty Baba-ish.

 

The September Budokan was different from anything that Baba ever ran. From a Baba standpoint, that looked like Jun's spot to challenge for the TC. Just a WAG, but Misawa had this in mind:

 

10/99 Vader over Misawa for TC

01/00 Vader defends against Jun

02/00 Kobashi over Vader for TC / Jun over Misawa

 

And have Kobashi-Jun elevated to the top.

 

It's pretty clear that Kobashi-Jun was his top plan when launching NOAH, then Kobashi fell apart and he had to switch things up.

 

Anyway, working backwards from having Jun be Vader's one successful defense, that would have knocked him out of 9/99. And Misawa got "creative" in trying his youth movement.

 

Chalk it up as another example of Misawa selfishly booking to put himself over like Dusty: what looks like his first move away from Babaism was putting the next generation in a Budokan main event without the TC.

 

One of these days I'd like to figure out who first game up with the Selfish Misawa Booker trope so I can tell him that he's the dumbest puroresu fan on the planet.

 

John

[MikeCampbell]

One of these days I'd like to figure out who first game up with the Selfish Misawa Booker trope so I can tell him that he's the dumbest puroresu fan on the planet.

Not that I agree with Misawa being a selfish booker, it's been documented many times that he was always trying to pass the torch, but looking at NOAH's GHC history, it's easy to see how one could get that impression:

 

Akiyama/Omori seems like a more obvious route for the finals in terms of passing the torch. Misawa and Jun met in the semi finals, Jun beats Misawa, and then moves on to beat Omori to avenge the carnival loss from the year before. Of course, it's supposedly the 12/00 Hashimoto match that put Omori in the Misawsa doghouse, so maybe that was the original idea. Instead, Misawa wins the title, and puts over Akiyama the following July for the strap. Unfortunately, there wasn't much for Jun to do beyond that. Kobashi was hurt and NOAH would become notoriously shitty for making new top guys. Honda gets a short push before losing to Jun in September. Jun puts over Vader in October and beats him in December. The cro cop loss killed Nagata. Then he loses to Ogawa on a fluke.

 

Misawa over Takayama in 2002 was the right decision in end, based on the fact that Takayama got hurt. Misawa wins in September, has a token defense against Ogawa in December, before putting over Kobashi in March. Assuming Takayama stays healthy, Kobashi wins the title from Takayama, and then they build to Misawa/Kobashi (6/6/03 Budokan seems most likely) where Kobashi retains to cement him as NOAH's new top dog.

 

Both of the above cases feature Misawa obviously trying to make Jun and Kobashi into the NOAH ace, but on the surface it does seem like Misawa was interested in making himself champion.

 

The third reign is easily explainable. Marufuji bombed with the strap, Kobashi was out with the cancer, and there was literally nobody else. Which goes back to NOAH being notoriously shitty at creating new top guys.

[kjh]

To be fair, part of the problem was that there really wasn't a good choice for a new ace after Kobashi. Not all of the blame can be laid at the feet of Misawa's booking, but some of it has to lie on the shoulders of the talent. Also, a lot of athletes started going into MMA instead of wrestling.

[jdw]

Not that I agree with Misawa being a selfish booker, it's been documented many times that he was always trying to pass the torch, but looking at NOAH's GHC history, it's easy to see how one could get that impression:

 

Akiyama/Omori seems like a more obvious route for the finals in terms of passing the torch. Misawa and Jun met in the semi finals, Jun beats Misawa, and then moves on to beat Omori to avenge the carnival loss from the year before. Of course, it's supposedly the 12/00 Hashimoto match that put Omori in the Misawsa doghouse, so maybe that was the original idea. Instead, Misawa wins the title, and puts over Akiyama the following July for the strap.

Either Misawa or Kobashi was always going to win the initial GHC Title. Kobashi if he was healthy since he was the last TC champ and Misawa wanted to pass the title to him. With Kobashi out, it was going to be Misawa. Think about the major titles and the initial native to hold them:

 

NWA Int'l: Rikidozan

PWF: Baba

NWF: Inoki

IWGP: Inoki

Triple Crown: Jumbo

 

The #1 guy in the promotion wins it. Not in the sense that the win "makes" the person #1, but that he already *was* #1.

 

JWA was Rikidozan's promotion, hence the Int'l.

 

AJPW was Baba's, hence the PWF.

 

NJPW was Inoki's, hence the NWF and IWGP.

 

NOAH was Misawa's. He'd done enough in All Japan for Kobashi to be the first name on the list, but not enough for Jun yet to be on the list.

 

So of course Misawa was going to win it so that Jun's winning it would have more meaning: winning a belt from a defending Misawa, which only Kawada as a native did (after about a billion attempts). And... Misawa was going to do it on the biggest show of the year for the promotion, their first Budokan.

 

It was both the obvious and right thing to do.

 

 

Unfortunately, there wasn't much for Jun to do beyond that. Kobashi was hurt and NOAH would become notoriously shitty for making new top guys. Honda gets a short push before losing to Jun in September. Jun puts over Vader in October and beats him in December. The cro cop loss killed Nagata. Then he loses to Ogawa on a fluke.

Jun didn't work. Shit happens. Not a lot more that Misawa could have done for him at the time

 

 

Misawa over Takayama in 2002 was the right decision in end, based on the fact that Takayama got hurt. Misawa wins in September, has a token defense against Ogawa in December, before putting over Kobashi in March. Assuming Takayama stays healthy, Kobashi wins the title from Takayama, and then they build to Misawa/Kobashi (6/6/03 Budokan seems most likely) where Kobashi retains to cement him as NOAH's new top dog.

Takayama always was just a shirt bridge to get it back to Misawa. Misawa didn't want to put over Kobashi in a Kobashi defense: he wanted to put him over for the belt. What's missing here:

 

07/96 Kobashi over Taue to win the TC

06/98 Kobashi over Kawada to win the TC

02/00 Kobashi over Vader to win the TC

 

It's late 2002. Kobashi is back and semi-healthy. Time for Misawa to put him over for the title. Look at the booking of three straight Budokans:

 

09/02 Misawa over Takayama for the title

01/03 Kobashi pins Misawa in tag

03/03 Kobashi pins Misawa for the title

 

Pretty clear that it was Misawa's plan all along. How many times did he challenge Kobashi in that long reign?

 

 

Both of the above cases feature Misawa obviously trying to make Jun and Kobashi into the NOAH ace, but on the surface it does seem like Misawa was interested in making himself champion.

Honestly, only people who weren't paying attention back to All Japan and the early days of NOAH would have thought that. He specifically put the NOAH title on himself to put over his two younger guys that he wanted to fight for the Ace-dom. It was really obvious.

 

 

The third reign is easily explainable. Marufuji bombed with the strap, Kobashi was out with the cancer, and there was literally nobody else. Which goes back to NOAH being notoriously shitty at creating new top guys.

Rikio was the one who bombed as champ, even with putting him over Kobashi to end the long reign, and Misawa stepping in to do a challenger job to him. Count up the number of those Misawa did between 8/92 and 09/05: that would be the *first* since challenging Hansen in 3/92. Yow... seriously, that's how invested Misawa was in trying to get Rikio over.

 

He used Taue to bridge to Jun so that it wasn't so obvious that he was a failure. One suspects he would get second time lucky with Jun, but that bombed. It was only then after the failure of Riko and re-failure of Jun that he got desperate and went with Marufuji.

 

That didn't work, and what did he have? Couldn't go back to Jun. The person that he was now high on was Morishima, but he didn't think he was ready yet. If he had Kobashi, the belt would have gone to Kobashi to do a chase for Morishima. With no Kobashi and business way down, he was essentially forced into the role that he didn't want. Aging champ that would hold it long enough for Morishima's win over him to hopefully having meaning.

 

There were potentially some mistakes in there. 2005 Dome arguably burned off two potential people who could have stepped in when Rikio bombed and made for fresh matches:

 

Kenta Kobashi pinned Kensuke Sasaki (23:38)

Mitsuharu Misawa pinned Toshiaki Kawada (27:04)

 

The problem is that Misawa wanted to help stamp Rikio on the next Budokan, so he "had" to win at the Dome. In hindsight, and arguably at the time, which ever of those might be a fallback for Riko should have gone over Kobashi. He was fresh off his title reign, and in good form to do a job.

 

Of course having Rikio-Tanahashi lower on the card didn't help, but it was reality: the matches above it were the draw. Really should have let him have Jun to put him over, and move it up the card.

 

But that's really the only obvious big mistakes where he could have avoided the belt the third time: he would have needed another major star vet to have a run with the belt that Morishima circled back to beat. But in a sense, Misawa's way was for the top star in the promotion to try to put over the younger aces for the belt:

 

Jun over Misawa

Kenta over Misawa

Rikio over Kobashi

Morishima over Misawa

 

He really tried to avoid Baba-style booking that protected the ace:

 

Jumbo --> Hansen --> Misawa

 

Where Jumbo was going to get it back.

 

Misawa --> Doc --> Kawada

 

Where Misawa was going to get it back (via Hansen).

 

Misawa --> Taue --> Kobashi

 

Where Misawa was going to get it back.

 

Misawa --> Kawada

 

The one time in this generation under Baba where that happened.

 

Kawada --> Kobashi

 

Where Misawa didn't want to get it back, but Baba told him he was getting it back.

 

I'm leaving out the second Misawa --> Kawada since it seems pretty obvious that Kawada had been passed in Baba's eyes by Kobashi, and Kawada was just getting the title to drop it to Vader rather than have Misawa do it.

 

 

That's Baba's use of Misawa.

 

Misawa himself was much more direct. He put the person he hoped would be the new Ace over for the title.

 

My guess is that it was something that Zach pulled out of his ass.

 

John

[MikeCampbell]

Either Misawa or Kobashi was always going to win the initial GHC Title. Kobashi if he was healthy since he was the last TC champ and Misawa wanted to pass the title to him. With Kobashi out, it was going to be Misawa. Think about the major titles and the initial native to hold them:

 

NWA Int'l: Rikidozan

PWF: Baba

NWF: Inoki

IWGP: Inoki

Triple Crown: Jumbo

 

The #1 guy in the promotion wins it. Not in the sense that the win "makes" the person #1, but that he already *was* #1.

 

JWA was Rikidozan's promotion, hence the Int'l.

 

AJPW was Baba's, hence the PWF.

 

NJPW was Inoki's, hence the NWF and IWGP.

 

NOAH was Misawa's. He'd done enough in All Japan for Kobashi to be the first name on the list, but not enough for Jun yet to be on the list.

 

So of course Misawa was going to win it so that Jun's winning it would have more meaning: winning a belt from a defending Misawa, which only Kawada as a native did (after about a billion attempts). And... Misawa was going to do it on the biggest show of the year for the promotion, their first Budokan.

 

It was both the obvious and right thing to do.

Well shit, my candy ass just got pwnd

 

Jun didn't work. Shit happens. Not a lot more that Misawa could have done for him at the time.

Agreed. Which goes back to what I said before about NOAH's inability to elevate and cement new names. The only other name coming to mind is Omori, especially after Nagata's stock plummeted. Former partners during their formative years, generation rivals, etc. etc. Of course, that requires NOAH to give Omori a sustained push to get him closer to Jun's level. Not NOAH's strong suit.

[MJH]

Wasn't John's original point that they did nothing with him between 95 and No Fear? It's one thing for him to finish the 1995 Carnival with 0 points, that's the be expected. But he finished the 1999 one with just one point (drew with Takayama). Even if we take into account that that year's Carnival was smaller than the others and your Izumidas were taken out of it, he should've been much higher by that point.

[MikeCampbell]

Wasn't John's original point that they did nothing with him between 95 and No Fear? It's one thing for him to finish the 1995 Carnival with 0 points, that's the be expected. But he finished the 1999 one with just one point (drew with Takayama). Even if we take into account that that year's Carnival was smaller than the others and your Izumidas were taken out of it, he should've been much higher by that point.

Yes, that was his original point. My original point was that it finally looked like Omori was actually making some headway and moving up the ladder in 2000, but the NOAH split seemed to stall it and he never really recovered. Then it got sidetracked to jdw handing me my ass when it came to selfish Misawa perceptions.

 

Does anyone know why exactly Takayama was the next TC challenger? I'm not saying it should have been Omori, since he'd just lost to Kenta. But it just seems so random for that time period.

 

Also, John, when you mentioned the triple crown change history, spefically this series of exchanges from '98:

 

Misawa --> Kawada

 

The one time in this generation under Baba where that happened.

 

Kawada --> Kobashi

To your (or anyone's knowledge) is there any truth the notion that 6/98 was originally slated to be Kawada/Akiyama? It's something I remember reading years ago when I first started watching All Japan.

[jdw]

Wasn't John's original point that they did nothing with him between 95 and No Fear? It's one thing for him to finish the 1995 Carnival with 0 points, that's the be expected.

I don't think it was expected that Omori would get 0 points in 1995, unless he was hurt and forfiet all his matches (which I don't recall).

 

Jun's first full Carny was 1994 (he got hurt in 1993). He finished with 9 points in 7th. Behind the 5 of the Big 6 (Misawa went out hurt) and Ace, who he drew. Ahead of Nord, Furnas, Smith and Eagle.

 

Carny always has a number of people in it to job to make guys like Ace and Jun look okay.

 

1995 had Misawa, Taue, Kawada, Kobashi and Hasen up at the top. There was no Doc thanks to the Narita Nightmare. Then Ace. Then Jun tying with Furnas with just 6 points, which is odd. Kroffat and Spivey at 4 points, and Omori at 0. My thought would have been that Furnas, Kroffat and Spivey are specifically there to job to Omori. Then if I'm booking it, I'd toss Jun and Omori on a smaller show and have them go to a draw simply to (i) see if they can do it, and (ii) show some growth for Omori. I'd have both job to Ace, since he needed a run with Doc out. Since Kobashi wasn't in the Final, I actually would have put Ace over Kobashi to give him that run and seperation from Jun and Omori. In turn to give Jun a bit of a gap from Omori, I would have looked for two placed to give him draws (in addition to the one with Omori). I'm think probably Kawada and Kobashi, again to see how he does and show growth. You then could run singles matches with Jun later in the year where Kawada and Kobashi beat him. The 9/95 card is an obvious place for one of them since the semi was that goofy survival tag. They certainly could have put another on the 7/95 Budokan rather than run that mini-tourney. Don't really think Taue needed to the tourney (and a draw against Kobashi) to warrant a title shot at Misawa.

 

None of that really goes outside of how All Japan was booked from 1990-94, in fact it's pretty consistent with it. Instead, All Japan lost sight of Omori after he "failed" as Hansen's partner, and Jun had a pretty thankless 1994 and 1995. I understand the point of not wanting to overpush Jun. But I think by 1995 you could have rolled out some higher profile jobs. Not in the sense of going 25+ minutes, but a good 17 minute job to Kawada on a Budokan would have shown he was doing *something*. Instead, his booking on the Budokan's in 1995 was meaningless. Then boom... he's main eventing with Misawa the next year. And the important thing to remember is that 1995 became Four Corners Centric on the Budokan's with Williams gone and Hansen fading after dropping the title:

 

06/95 El Super Classico

07/95 Misawa vs Kawada TC IV

09/95 Misawa vs Taue TC (rematch from 4/96 Carny Final)

10/95 Misawa vs Kobashi TC

12/95 Tag Final: Four Corners IX (#5 this year)

 

Wouldn't disagree too much with the choices for the main events... but the undercards were booked in an uninteresting fashion, and really not in a way to get anyone else over. Though it's not like 1994 Budokan's were booked in a strong or interesting fashion. Big change from 1993 where a hell of a lot more thought was given to them.

 

Other irony: Jun's booking on at Budokan in 1993 and 1994 was actually more interesting than in 1995 when he was a year away from a push.

 

I'm running this joke into the ground, but... the cancer isn't the reason All Japan's booking when downhill. It was sliding starting in 1994. The Four Corners were just so freaking great in 1994 and 1995 that a lot of people watching Usual Suspects matches a decade later just never saw the decline: it's not there in the tapes. You can watch something like the 10/95 tag title match and think, "Holy shit is this a great draw"... and lose sight that the promotion had so little else to put on that this match was overkilled:

 

11/94 Tag League

01/95 Tag Title

06/95 Tag Title

10/95 Tag Title

11/95 Tag League

12/95 Tag Leage Final

 

No wonder why after 2.5 years they needed to move on from it: after just three times in the first year and a half (6/93, 12/93 & 5/94), the thing was run into the ground six times from one tag league to the next because they had nothing else to roll out. A big part of that is Doc going out, since no doubt there would have been Kawada & Taue vs Williams & Ace in there somewhere... probably a couple of times.

 

But perhaps a more creative (and not really *that* creative) way to go would have been after the 6/95 tag title would be to split off Kobashi from Misawa then, and elevate Jun up a year earlier. Kobashi has a partner with whom to challenge, and Misawa does. 10/95 (or 9/95) then becomes Kobashi challenging Misawa for the first time... and it's as a rival rather than his partner.

 

Not terribly hard to find Kobashi a partner. Ace is sitting there without Doc, and Kobashi & Ace have history together earlier in the decade. Or the choice they made the following year: Patriot. Or... put him with Stan, which would pop things as a Super Team. Any of those works. With Ace, you can have Ace "turn" on him when Doc comes back in 3/96. With Patriot, you have Kobashi able to help get over another gaijin. With Stan, you have a super team.

 

It never was terribly hard to fix things. You don't need to get overly creative, and frankly it's best not to. Pretty much look for what worked earlier in the 1988-94 range, think about why it worked, and do similar things in a not terribly heavy handed fashion.

 

John

[jdw]

Also, John, when you mentioned the triple crown change history, spefically this series of exchanges from '98:

 

Misawa --> Kawada

 

The one time in this generation under Baba where that happened.

 

Kawada --> Kobashi

To your (or anyone's knowledge) is there any truth the notion that 6/98 was originally slated to be Kawada/Akiyama? It's something I remember reading years ago when I first started watching All Japan.

 

Don't have a clear recollection. I'd have to look at the WON's to see if any other match was announced.

 

My guess would be "no" to it being planned for Jun.

 

01/98 Misawa vs Jun for TC (non-Budokan)

04/98 Misawa vs Jun in Carny Final

 

It doesn't seem likely that of the first five high profile matchs of the year (those two plus Misawa-Ace on the first Budokan and Misawa-Kawada on the Dome) that Jun would be in three of them gunning for championships and jobbing.

 

6/98 strikes me as the place for Kawada-Kobashi especially with Misawa planned to be off the show due to the injuries prior to the Dome. Don't think you want to run Kawada-Doc or Kawada-Taue there, and instead want to hit it with a bang.

 

We can debate Kobashi winning, and of course Jun came right back and challenged before Taue. That's probably the order I would have gone in if Kawada retained: Kawada-Kobashi, Kawada-Jun and Kawada-Taue... perhaps flipping Jun and Taue to space out Jun's TC/Carny Final matches a bit more. Beats the crap out of me what I would have done on 10/98 since I wouldn't have wanted to run Kawada-Misawa. Perhaps since Kawada is the Five Crown at that point (he and Taue won the belts from Kobashi & Ace and held it the entire year), if you're that committed to Kobashi & Jun joining hands, you let them challenge on a Budokan. They challenged for the first time on 10/11/98 in Nagoya. You wouldn't want to do it at the 10/98 Budokan since it leads right into the Tag League... but then again, you are going with Vader & Hansen vs Kobashi & Jun in the Tag League Final. Could perhaps have done:

 

06/98 Kawada-Kobashi

07/98 Kawada-Taue

09/98 Kawada & Taue vs Kobashi & Jun

10/98 Kawada vs Jun

12/98 Kobashi & Jun vs Vader & Hansen

 

With Jun pinning Kawada to win the tag titles on 9/98 and set up the TC the next month. You *could* go Kobashi-Jun as the semifinal on 7/98, with then shaking hands at the end to join hands and announce their partnership. Of course they'd try to steal the show. And I really didn't like the Kobashi & Jun team in terms of growth for Jun. But if you're wedded to it, bingo.

 

Keeping the belt on Kawada allows you to go Kawada --> Vader in 3/98, and have given Kawada his "long" run with the belt rather than the one-and-out reigns he typically had. And keep it away from Misawa.

 

Business was bad after the Dome, so Baba made a quick change. I tend to think business was bad prior to that, and business decisions going back 4 years were worse in leaving the company in a bad spot.

 

 

On Takayama, I suspect if Misawa stayed and smoothed things over with Mrs. Baba, it would have been Kobashi-Jun in June. With everyone knowing Misawa & Co were leaving, Misawa looks to have booked a throwaway TC challenge. Beating Takayama on a smaller, non-Budokan card gave away nothing of what Misawa would use in NOAH. In turn, it did give Takayama a bit of a positive bump.