Loss

That seemed like a viable and realistic option for WM until I saw how scrawny he was. I'm not sure he could get a wrestling build back by WM time and still pass wellness exams. That said, it's a built-in storyline and would be a success since the fan excitement would be there for Jericho coming back for revenge against the guy who ended his career, but it seems pretty unlikely after seeing that picture. Either way, Cena needs an opponent that would be fresh and mean something, and Edge, who would otherwise be the best option, has been done to death, and Cena/Orton just doesn't have the same appeal it may have had at one time because Orton isn't being pushed as the future of the company anymore. Cena/Batista is possible, but they'd have to unify the belts, which I know they don't want to do.

I'd say he's retired for good, wouldn't you? http://michaeljl.net/CJfrontpage.jpg

I posted this in Announcements, but no one has replied, so I thought I'd post it here just to make sure people see it. On 1/15, we will launch a new board where NMB will re-direct. It will be restricted to only wrestling folders, as we really feel that's the heart of this place, and the space the other folders are taking up can better be utilized. The board will be starting fresh, except for MMA which will be carried over, but all the NMB wrestling topics will still be available in read-only format. We are also adding a Blogs feature which I know I will be using, and I hope others of you will be as well. This is going to be a board all about the wrestling and nothing else. I'll provide the link when the website looks more presentable. Feedback and comments are welcome and appreciated.

This should really be its own thread.

I will get to all of this eventually. I got burned out on 70s wrestling and need to watch a different style of wrestling for a while until I get tired of that. Right now, I'm watching more 80s WWF than anything else. And I have all of those discs and will watch them all in full.

I swear Flair/Race was on something else. But it could be that it aired on 24/7 or something.

The descriptions of that match look really, really strange.

I'm convinced that every WWE DVD ever released from here forward by WWE will either have Flair/Race from Starrcade '83, Lawler/Von Erich from SuperClash III or that Rockers v Somers/Rose match from the AWA. They LOVE putting those matches on DVD.

TSM posters typically hate everything, so that doesn't surprise me. Cena/Umaga has indeed been built up really well, and I think the K-Fed thing didn't do any damage to the feud. It's amazing how they've decided to actually start pushing people and making them look good, though. The people in the top positions on Raw and Smackdown are pushed very hard and not made to look weak that often these days. I'm impressed that WWE seems to slowly be getting away from Even Steven booking.

I just watched Cena/K-Fed from RAW. That was tremendous! Ripping off angles from Memphis in 1982 is always a good idea. They've got to do something with K-Fed at Wrestlemania. I don't see a way around it.

Well, the house show upswing is impressive. I'm curious what is currently bringing people to the shows and if it can be sustained.

I wouldn't want to see it headline Wrestlemania, but they should do Cena/Trump v Edge/K-Fed on a B show. It would probably do really well and get some pub for their top two stars that aren't DX.

Interesting. What was it that Meltzer said has opened up a lot of eyes about the current state of WWE that Meltzer mentioned, and who was he talking about?

If that's true, all I'll think is "Wow, Cena/K-Fed would have drawn money on PPV." I still think it's a good idea to hire K-Fed and keep him around though. The rest of his life is falling apart pretty rapidly, but he could have a good future in wrestling.

Yes but do you think he would be able to look past his opinions of them as workers. Do you think Dave would have been able to book JYD in 80s WWF after what he said about him week after week in the WON? If JYD was crucial to the success of the WWF and was easy to work with, yes, I do think he would have.

I don't think Meltzer would have the issue Strummer mentioned of handling people like Nash and Sid, just because he's actually pretty fair to Hogan most of the time, and this is the same guy who burned an Observer on a pay-per-view.

Actually, I say that and then wonder if I should. I don't think I'd want Meltzer booking for his personal tastes, as it would be a strange combination of innovative spotfests, shootfights and "This-is-awesome"-style match layouts. If he booked what he thought would work, not necessarily what he would like the most, I think he could be really terrific.

Actually, the match I have listed here has Lawler getting a cheap win and is only 16 minutes or so I think.

Dave Meltzer.

I think HHH being a mark for good or old school wrestling is a work designed to deflect heat from himself when things go wrong. HHH is a mark for HHH. That's it.

To my knowledge, Vince or Steph would make those decisions, not the writers. The writers would come up with ways for DX to make fun of the Spirit Squad, but not really make the decision to beat them.

CSI writers are responsible for scripting 60 minutes of straight dialogue. Any scenes that aren't constant dialogue are blocked by the writers. Any physical scenes that require stage combat are also blocked by the writers. Scripting to that degree is not really necessary in wrestling as long as the wrestlers have a general idea of what to say and what points to hit. Overseeing the big picture and making sure that the weekly TV stays the course toward the bigger picture doesn't really require that much detail. Nor does it normally get it. Scripts of Raw and Smackdown have been posted online in the past. The match layout has not been included in any of the scripts I've seen posted, and there are no stage directions. It's just lines. For the CSI analogy to work, that would have to mean that the writers were scripting every move in every wrestling match, every word the announcers say *and* all of the dialogue. Yes, that would require a larger staff. Does it take more than one person to say "These are the matches we want to do at the next PPV, and here's how we'll get there"? People fantasy book online all the time doing things like that and it's typically not a team effort. I don't think the problem with current wrestling is so much that it requires a staff of 4-5 people, as much as it is that they overthink things that really aren't important. Right, because Vince and his inner circle, which includes Steph and HHH, determines the long-term direction and the writers are just scripting them getting to that destination in the most low-brow humorous way possible. I've never gotten the impression that the current WWE writing staff suggests who should go over or which wrestlers should be pushed. It seems to just be a matter of carrying out the vision that some combination of HHH/Vince/Steph have come up with. They write lines for wrestlers to say, but their job doesn't really seem to go beyond that in scope. I'm still not sold on the need for writers in wrestling. Isn't having a promoter, a booker (that can be rotated frequently even) and road agents enough?

That's not surprising in a promotion booked by Vince Russo. Russo really pioneered the idea that the writers and the producers are more integral to the success of a wrestling show than the talent that appears on camera. I really think the reason writers write is to get over their own value to the company most of the time. It's why they get overly cutesy and script every word. If they were handing out bullet points and providing a loose idea of what each show should be, someone would realize this only really requires 1-2 people and not a full staff and support staff and their jobs would be in jeopardy.

Antonio Inoki v Dory Funk Jr - JWA 12/02/69 I expected to like this far more than I did. I did really enjoy the last 20 minutes, and I think they saved the match, but man, the first 40 minutes or so of this were a mess. Inoki and Dory seemed to be on different pages for much of this, and the fans and the focus seemed to be more on what was going on outside of the ring than on what was going on inside it. That said, they really salvaged the match down the final stretch and delivered some great false finishes. The match was begging at times for Dory to be on offense, but he never really ran with it. I'm an Inoki fan and a Dory fan, and I did think this was a very good match once they got going, but it took them long enough to finally get going. I'll be watching their match from 1970 later today, and I have high expectations again and know they're going broadway again. I just hope the match is as good early on as it is toward the end this time around.

I totally agree that Thesz is more of the Flair/Race style champ, but I really like that style of worker myself. I know jdw is not saying he doesn't, he's just pointing out that the perception of what Thesz was and the reality of what he was aren't necessarily the same. I actually took that as a pleasant surprise, as I was sort of expecting a super-dominant mat wrestler that didn't know how to work with an opponent, and the Rikidozan matches were much better than I expected. As far as Thesz being the best ever, I want to reiterate what I said. It wouldn't surprise me, based on a small sampling. I don't consider him so at this time. I need to pick up more footage of him.