King Solomon

I say Orton and Adonis are both close but no cigar guys. For me they lacked that presence a World Champ should have.

That's where hopefully someone could spot that potential. As a fan in 1985 which is when I started watching AWA after two years of WWF fandom I couldn't picture it either. Monday morning QBing this thing I could see it tho. Looking back in 81 on Steamboat and Martel I could see more traces of Canadian Rick having an edge to him. Did Martel play heel in his tag matches against the High Flyers?

I think Martel was a good heel in his Model role and imagine what kind of heel he could have been if allowed to be more gritty than the cartoonish "Model". I haven't seen the Lawler-martel Memphis match but I heard he was good in that role. In 85 he was my fave of the three world champs. I think he had that fire to play tweener/heel when going to a World Class to face the von erich boys or Florida against Dust. He could've played a more gritty version of his "Model" persona.

As much as I like Brody theres no way they title him up. I can picture him guzzling the local heroes.

Dibiase #1 Rich-No way Martel- my darkhorse pick as I think he could easily go tweener/heel

Yeah I love that they try to portay wrestling as a serious sport and the logic that they put into it. It makes it a lot easier to plan that way when you are only running one town and you can cherry pick who you bring in for your Kiel shows. One key in the WWF getting the KPLR timeslot was Geigel ceasing from taping tv shows at the studios in the fall of 83 and instead showing his less than stellar Kansas City tapes. Ratings took a dip after that and it inclined the station manager to give Vince his ear. I actully thought Matysiks show "Greater St. Louis Wrestling" was superior to the NWA's show at the studios. Matysik also good young talent like Adonis, Savage, Chavo and of course Brody, Volkoff etc. I think Matysik def waxes romantic about St. Louis and from reading his books had trouble coming to grips that the era of the one town wrestling promotion was over. Everyone was going to have to align with someone bigger. Toronto-Crockett then WWF after Crockett starved Tunney out, Houston-Mid South and then of course St. Louis-WWF. Even if Muchnick had stayed the WWF would've have still taken over the town at roughly the same time.

regarding Kevin's age, he was born in 1957.

For my taste, Kiniski and O'Connor were too damn old to be in the ring even if they could go. They both just looked awful visually and I know that during the 70's that was one of the knocks against the business was that there were too many old guys on top. I'll give the Dick the Bruiser a pass as he was still a big draw.

"showmanship" meaning within the ring as far as his wrestling style, I think it may have been Harley that said "cartoonish" or something along those lines.

I have seen very little of Terry as NWA Champ but from shoot interveiws I have heard a few wrestlers say that he brought in that showmanship that previous champs didn't have. I know Harley said something to that effect. Harley also said that one of the reasons Murdoch wasn't made champ was because at some point in the evening (outside of ring) he would turn into a clown. I guess at that time they wanted someone who carried himself well outside the ring as well as inside it.

Just watched nord- davey match right now, not a bad one but what has always bothered me about Nord was that for being so big and strong his power moves especially upper body are so unimpressive.

angle leading up to the show was great but the match was a snoozer

Not too mention that Harley was the exact type of wrestler the NWA shouldn't have been pushing once the 80's rolled around. I also didn't like any of the 70's footage I saw from him. His Starrcade match has to be one of the worse main event big show matches of the 80's. Thank God for Piper-Valentine and the tag match or that woulda been a dissapointing show.

Not too mention that Harley was the exact type of wrestler the NWA shouldn't have been pushing once the 80's rolled around. I also didn't like any of the 70's footage I saw from him. His Starrcade match has to be one of the worse main event big show matches of the 80's. Thank God for Piper-Valentine and the tag match or that woulda been a dissapointing show.

Why?! I'm watching him deck Gary Young now (circa 78?). He's awesome. I think I love Harley because he throws so many bombs. You can criticise him a la Matt D for not really being much of a structure guy and I get that criticism. But boring? I don't get that. Just seen him hit an awesome backbreaker, swinging reverse neckbreaker and a massive stalled vertical suplex in the space of 2 minutes. He's anything but boring! Maybe I need to see more from him revisited. Was just too methodical for my taste which is weird because I liked Valentine alot. I know that he was a daring bumper but just remember too many slow paced matches with him. Hated the Starrcade 83 match, never cared for his WWF work either. I was blah on the few matches I saw of his in World Class. I will be fair and re watch the Japan stuff I have of him as well as the Wrestlerock 86 match.

Harley Race is on a short list for me

lol!! I'm ready!!

In the ring I can take him or leave him. I met him tho here at the L.A. Athletic club and he was real cooll with me

because? Well, to me part of the appeal of this podcast is how analytical it is. I'm all for differing opinions, but implying Ricky Morton is terrible without really giving any reasons other than "I hate him" and turning everything into a WWF discussion really turned me off. I like how laid back and relaxed this podcast usually is, this was just different than what I'm used to. YMMV, I guess I'm just spoiled by some of the previous guests. I did enjoy the rest of the show. We're getting into the period where I was finally able to catch WCW on a consistent basis, so this will be very fun for me to follow. Yeah I didn't get the Ricky Morton and RnR hate either but to each his own I guess. I enjoyed Derek regardless but he lost me a little with his love for El Gigante. So far I have enjoyed most of the guests on these pod casts.

because?

Short but sweet and took place in the North but in the vien of a southern brawl, Martel-Hansen Superclash 85

Regarding the age thing I totally agreee with Meltzer on this. Snuka was 40 in 1983, Johnny Valentine was headlining Mid Atlantic at age 48, Ron Garvin won the NWA title at 42, Brody was 40 in 1986, Bruiser and Crusher were past or at 40 in the late 60's. Dusty was 40 in 1985. Bockwinkel was 54 when he retired. Orndorff was actually 41 when this card took place. Tony Atlas was 40 in 1984.

Prior to this I diDn't know that WCW offered to purchase the AWA. As "Dr. D" would say "That was the day two fools met, the one who offered it and the one who didn't take it"

I can't think of any, Here in L.A. people were thrilled to have the WWF replace that garbage that Labell promoted

For me it was when JCP sold to Turner that signaled the end of Wrestling as I ahd grown to love it. Even tho I was excited about the prospects of Turner being able to comepte with Vince financially I knew the gritty era of the NWA was over and that Turner would turn the company into a glitzier more corporate product. During my early years as a fan in 1983-86 I had a real feeling of wrestling euphoria being able to watch AWA, JCP, WWF, WCCW and later UWF. It seems to me at the time that these promotions would be around forever but then I noticed reall slippage the AWA once Hansen was stripped then Kerry got in his accident and World Class didn't feel the same. UWF was real good at first but then I noticed Duggan and the Fantastics leaving and Dibiase was in Japan half the time. I know that by Mania 3 it was a two horse race between Vince and Crockett and that the variety that I enjoyed for a few years was coming to an end. I was breifly hopeful with the co op between Memphis, AWA, WCCW and Continental butwhen Lawler got stripped of the AWA title that ended.