club

I too have recently been on an Atlantis kick. There's a tremendous rudo Atlantis performance in this trios match on this episode of CMLL TV. Starts around the 49 min mark:

I imagine I'll have both Suzuki somewhere on my list. The criticisms above are very much the same as mine for his later work, overly reliant on tropes such as strike exchanges and no-sell spots. Though he still had his moments. His matches with Ibushi and Ishii in 2020 were both Covid-era highlights. He was already in his 50s at that point. Bar his PWFG match with Sano, I do think his best matches have been in NJPW when he adopted a more regular pro style - Tanahashi in 2012 and AJ in 2014. But I also feel that this style has been detrimental to his uniqueness. These days I enjoyed a lot of his earlier (00s) pro stuff where he worked things differently, like his approach to selling, grappling, or his ability to bob and weave. So refreshing. Matches like the 03-04 with Nagata, his Muto TC match, his NOAH tag with Marufuji vs Hashi and Akiyama.

Definitely want to check out more of Jackie Sato. Her post-Beauty Pair 79-81 stuff in AJW ranges from good to excellent. Wish there was more Beauty Pair available. The only thing I’ve seen is a clipped match of theirs from 76 vs Black Pair which was ok. Ditto for her JWP run.

Thanks for expanding on this. It's a really good point, and would agree the idea is lacking in most modern wrestling. Maybe most wrestling full stop. It's also an interesting way to explore the idea of being a 'good' worker.

This perfectly encapsulates what I love about Randy Savage. Can definitely see this with Austin too. Can you elaborate a bit on why you find Dusty and Bruno so strong in this regard?

Been on an Onita kick recently and he really shines as a wild brawler from 89 to 93. GOTNW made a great post in the Shinya Hashimoto thread about the likes of Inoki and Maeda being able to work their best when able to work their own vision of pro-wrestling. Onita belongs in this category. My read on early FMW is it’s really just the story of Onita getting this improbable second chance to become a star. A punkish underdog heir to Lawler and Funk, dialling up the violence and the emoting. It plays to all his strengths and negates his weaknesses, and that of some of his opponents as well. Even FMW’s DIY aesthetic seems to accentuate Onita’s status as this working-class hero outsider defying the odds and succeeding on his own terms. A pro-wrestling version of Ashita no Joe if you will. Looking at his back catalogue I always assumed that judging him by his big matches against other big 90s names - your Chonos and Tenryus - would give a fair summation. It really doesn’t. A lot of his best stuff come from lesser names: Tarzan Goto, Masashi Aoyagi, Gregori Veritchev. Who the hell has a better match with Gregori Veritchev than Genichiro Tenryu?!

This is a really good point. Not to derail Hash's thread, but I've come to a similar conclusion watching 89-95 Onita FMW. A perfect house style to accentuate his positives and hide his physical limitations. Anyway. The Hashimoto / Tanaka match is a thing of beauty. Such a compelling demolition.

St Clair isn't a WoS guy I actively seek out, but he turns in very strong performances against people I do. His matches with Jones, Bond, Roach and Kincaid are all excellent. He had one of the better McManus matches from the 70s. I doubt he has enough to crack a top 100 list, but what else would people recommend?

My main issue with Jumbo is that with the exception of some of the Misawa feud, in every big match of his I'm more interested in the other guy. Robinson, Bock, Tenryu, Martel, Funk, Choshu, etc. There's no question in my mind that he's not excellent in the ring, and he brings out the quality of others. But I struggle to connect with him on an emotional level, which is for me what wrestling is really all about.

Re-assessing people like Martel is one of the facets of this project I love the most. Arrogance spraying heel Martel was a fixture of my childhood and based on that run I wouldn't have considered him whatsoever. The pre-Model Martel on the other hand is one of the best wrestlers of the mid-80s. A fairly basic style done really well, he's brilliant at getting over the dynamics of the match. Really appreciate that he doesn't seem to rely on routine spots too much. His matches feel organic.

Dynamite will likely make the back half of my list somewhere. Matches with Jones, Breaks, Rocco, Hara, Fujinami, Rose and Dennison are all great. The Tiger Mask stuff not so much. WWF not so much. Japan and Portland I'm looking forward to.

Elliot, thanks for all the above. Love me some Tommy Rich. There’s this weird sincerity to him, Randy Savage-like in that that he’s absurd yet believable. And like Savage, more often than not he’s this captivating presence that gives great performances, even when the matches aren’t. Also, not sure how intentional it is on his part, but I get a real sense of pathos in Tommy Rich as this guy who made it to the top then spent his career never really coming close to making it to that level again. This comp is awesome as well: Tommy Rich's Blood Battles of the South https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6rTNLFplrk

SUWA I’m not much for Toryumon or 00s NOAH juniors, but I could watch this dickhead stomp and punch all day long, and it’s a crying shame he didn’t have a longer career. I’d really like to take a look into his Toryumon stuff - hoping people here better versed in it can signpost me to the good stuff. Dragon Kid vs SUWA - 24/08/00 KENTA vs SUWA - 09/18/05 SUWA vs Mitsuo Momota - 07/16/06 Mil Mascaras, Ultimo Dragon, Kazuchika Okada & Marco Corleone vs Ultimo Guererro, SUWA, Yoshihiro Takayama & Minoru Suzuki - 05/13/07

I bloody love Victor Zangiev. He seemingly 'got' pro wrestling straight off the bat in a way none of the other Soviets of the era did. It was a shame he wasn't the featured guy instead of Hashimikov as he was far and away the more engaging worker. Would recommend Riki Choshu & Tatsumi Fujinami vs Victor Zangiev & Vladimir Berkovich from May 25 1989 and his Buzz Sawyer Tokyo Dome match.

I rewatched Jag vs Mimi Hagiwara from Jan 1984. It's a great match full stop (that crowd!), but there were moments where Yokota's selling really stood out on this watch. Mimi hits that spinning flying mare thing you see a lot in this era, and Jag comes up holding her nose. And she sells it like she's been hit in the nose as opposed to the head. Not stunned, just thrown off her rhythm. Then she takes another and sells her forehead and stays down long enough for Mimi to hit a suplex. Not thrown off her rhythm this time but stunned. Later she takes a slingshot. The norm would be to sell it as a generic 'stun'. Instead she sells her right knee. It's these little things that keep the match grounded in something relatable.

Jag's a top 20 lock for me. John Cooper Clarke had a line about seeing Ramones play for the first time: 'They made everyone else look like they weren't trying.' This is kinda how I feel about Jaguar Yokota in the 80s. She's on another level to everyone else as far as intensity, work, movement.

Is there anything else from 80s New Japan worth seeking out? I've really been enjoying his SWS era stuff recently. Mad how he switches styles depending on the opponent. He has a varied resume and a fascinating career, but the majority of what I enjoy about Sano is his shoot-style stuff, whether SWS, UWFi or Kingdom.

My favourite jobber ever. He's a highlight of UWFi along with Tamura and Anjo. Would recommend his matches with Anjo, Yamazaki, Kanehara, Miyato and Tenryu.

This is worth 24 minutes of your time:

I’ve been watching a lot of Tenryu’s stuff in between All Japan runs (so the 90s basically) and what's really struck me is his adaptability. He matches up well with just about anyone. He’s able to vary his style depending on the style and status of his opponent whilst remaining ‘authentic Tenryu’. Gnarly tags aside, he has good to great singles matches with Ashura Hara, George Takano, Tatsumi Fujinami, Nobutaka Araya, Hayabusa, Kensuke Sasaki, Tatsuo Nakano, Great Muta, Yoji Anjo, Yoshiaki Fujiwara, Randy Savage, Koji Kitao, Nobuhiko Takada, Keiji Muto and Atsushi Onita.

Is that the one where they stare at each other for 30 mins? I'd need to rewatch it but yeah from what I remember he was better than Go. I also recall a tag match at Ryogoku with BJW guys and Suwama with a lot of staring. Is this a thing with him? TBF my impressions of Fujita are almost entirely based on his NJPW stuff from two decades ago. I haven't kept up on NOAH. The best Fujita matches from that era had a 'how to slay the beast?' narrative. Tanahashi, Shibata, Chono. Great matches largely dependent on the opponent.

Fujita vs Tatsutoshi Goto from the 2005 G1 is well worth the time. Generally not a guy I'd consider though. He's been in some great matches but it's down to the other guy to create something compelling.

Wanted to highlight another Breaks/Saint match that aired on Sky in 1986. An excellent Breaks performance on a weirdly entertaining wrestling show. Starts at 1:00:30 He's a top 10 guy for me.

Reading this thread, Muto seems as divisive as ever. I love the guy. Bad first - there are plenty letdowns, particularly in the late 90s. Right then with that out the way, as a mega charismatic dude working within his limits, knowing when to hit his big spots and mugging it up he's S-tier. I’d rate his greatest hits very very highly. Some great matches in the 90s, some great spectacles as Muta, and his 00s reinvention was fabulous. He really understood his physical limitations and was able to build around them and let his star presence shine through. A match that never gets much pro-wrestling love (pun intended) is his 2007 TC match vs Minoru Suzuki. It's on GAORA's YT channel now. Well worth the time.

Love the matches with Breaks, Grey and Finaly mentioned above. Saint really does turn it up when it comes to the big matches. I enjoy the contrast between these and some of the lesser matches that he appears to treat more as affable sparring. Like he's playing a friend at snooker, or 5-a-side. He's amazing when it comes to first time viewing but I'd agree that he gets a bit same-y over the long haul. As someone to watch once every few months though he's a lot of fun. Which seems reasonable given that's how often his matches were shown on TV back then. What that means for a project like this I do not know. His Dec 72 tag with Steve Best vs Ian Gilmour & Jeff Kaye is up on YouTube now and is well worth a look. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AT2liJ_iYkI Got a kick out of their team being called The Elite.