Undertaker DVD

[goodhelmet]

I find it funny you used the quote boxes when bitching about it to me before. Just an observation.

 

The Hell In A Cell match was more than just an excuse for Kane to show up. It was Taker taking out his anger on an HBK who had pissed him off throughout that 1997 television AND the Summerslam match. I actually like the HIAC MORE after watching Ground Zero than I did before. The only glaring problem is the Kane intro.

 

You failed to comment on the Brock matchup.

 

I don't understand your Cena comment since I already said I didn't like the match.

 

 

Then what is Taker's best match of all-time?

Right now, I am leaning toward the One Night Only match. It cuould also be one Of the Hell In A Cell matches. Still, the point remains... SS '98 is NOT Taker's best match.

[Loss]

I'd probably say Undertaker's three best matches are with Austin (Summerslam '98), Bret (One Night Only) and Lesnar (No Mercy '02). The Bret and Lesnar matches are about on the same plane, with the Bret match featuring really smart wrestling and the Lesnar match featuring some of the most violent-looking spots ever displayed in a WWE ring.

 

Off topic, sort of -- as pushed as the Undertaker is, I really think they missed the boat on him with his comeback in 2000. 'Taker has shown throughout his career that he'll step up to the challenge and become game to be carried when he's surrounded by workers that are determined to have good matches. It baffles me that to this day, Taker has never faced Benoit, Guerrero and Jericho in singles matches. 'Taker and Benoit I think would have especially had awesome chemistry, especially in 2002 when both were near the top of the card on Smackdown and 'Taker started incorporating more submission stuff into his moveset. I think they had a chance to make him Stan Hansen for WWE -- the old, tough veteran who sees his star falling, but isn't going down without a fight. He should have been the guy that all the up and comers had to go through to achieve anything, and they could have done dozens of big matches with him in the veteran role. Yeah, they had him as the company vet anyway, but he was never trying to prove anything. They briefly got it right in 2003, and his character was as great as it's ever been at that point, but then they threw it all away by putting Vince over him at SurSer and going back to the dead man gimmick. There was a time to do that, but I think toward the end of his full-time run, Taker was showing a little more life, and they should have saved the dead man return for when it was really needed to keep him relevant. Now, he's barely around, only his entrance music is over, and he's a footnote on the big picture.

[Guest Askewniverse]

It was like watching a great boxing match with Austin sliding out of Taker's Tombstone and hitting the Stunner on him and getting the win.

Just a minor nitpick, but that wasn't the finish. Austin countered Taker's "old-school" with a low blow and followed up with the Stunner.

[goodhelmet]

Loss, didn't you already assert that Taker's best match was the One Night Only match?

[Loss]

Yes, and that still rings true, in that it gets my nod as best Undertaker match ever. I can also see why some would choose the match with Lesnar though, and they're both very close. The Austin match is a distant #3, but it's definitely #3 for me.

[Al]

I find it interesting that the Undertaker's best matches occured late in his career. Real improvement or better opponents? Probably a combination of both.

[goodhelmet]

OK, and this is what am I trying to get from you... is the Summerslam match the best Taker match ever?

[Loss]

No. Not even close.

[Loss]

I find it interesting that the Undertaker's best matches occured late in his career. Real improvement or better opponents? Probably a combination of both.

I think he could always go to a degree, but the WWF moved more and more toward a wrestling-based product as his career progressed and to his credit, he was able to at least keep up. I think he's done of his best work in the latter stages of his career, but 'Taker also slowed down his wrestling style dramatically in the early 90s under instructions from management, just so he'd fit his gimmick. With the gloves off, no pun intended, he probably would have had more standout matches from 1991-1995.

[goodhelmet]

It also doesn't help that some of his biggest profile matches were against slugs like Yokozuna, Brian Lee, and Giant Gonzales.

[Guest brian]

There's a couple of things that I figure helped Taker later in his career. The main events swung over to Hart, Michaels, Austin, Benoit, Angle, etc. He got alot of time with either top flight wrestlers or really good bumpers. As a whole, the main event style shifted and his character, at points, shifted with it. There were things his character became more responsive to at certain points in time, such as less gimmicktry and more bumping, so in some matches Taker was able to give a little more for his opponents.

[Guest Sass]

Now I need to watch all of these Undertaker matches since I haven't watched ONO '97 and his Lesnar matches in years. I also need to go back and check out his matches against Cena in '03 and Angle in '00 and figure out who he buried worse.

[goodhelmet]

I think the Cena and Angle matches were equally devastating.

 

I think the Angle match was compounded by the fact that Jericho and Benoit lost the same night when it was a show pushing the new guard. For Cena, it was decent but I think people rave on it because it is a decent match from a guy who had few of them for as long as his career has been. Also, I think when he beat up Cena, it was at a time when they really needed to put more top guys in the mix and it took another two years before Cena was accepted at that level. For Angle, he came around much quicker.

[Loss]

It would have taken Angle even longer had Undertaker and HHH (and even Austin) had their way. Not surprisingly, Rock was the only guy really willing to go all the way in putting Angle over.

[Guest Bruiser Chong]

My thoughts on what's sure to be a hit or miss DVD set:

 

Disc 1:

 

- No Debut. I think his freaking debut is worth including. Plus the match was a good one, since it involved the likes of Bret Hart and Ted Dibiase.

- The RR '94 Casket Match. Awful match and remembered for bad reasons. Where's the Survivor Series rematch; a match that was actually good AND saw the Undertaker win.

- Nothing with Jake Roberts. The match that resulted was bad, but this was the program that finally pulled the trigger on the face turn.

- The wrong Mankind matches. Granted they had some good ones and you can't have too many in the same set, but the Boiler Room Brawl at Summerslam '96 was excellent and featured the Undertaker's long-time manager turning on him. Then where's their Survivor Series '96 match? It featured a retooled 'Taker and was one of the sleepers of the show. I think this disappoints me more than anything else.

- Nothing with Vader. These two had some great matches in 1997, but there's no acknowledgement of it here. For shame.

 

Disc 2:

 

- No Summerslam '98 match. This is an underrated match that I think signaled the end of Takers two-year run of excellent programs and wrestling matches. Instead we get stuff like...

- HiAC. Okay. It's one of the most famous moments in WWE history, but I'm sick of it. It's available on so many other DVDs that even a passive fan has to own it on at least one DVD.

- The Inferno match. It's already on the old Undertaker disc. No need for it here.

- The inclusion of the parents' caskets burning segment. A low moment for the company. So, of course, it's here.

 

Disc 3:

 

- The WM XVII match. This is such an overrated piece of crap. It's aided by camera tricks and effects. Plus it's already available many times over on other DVDs.

- The Hogan match. I know this was the one where he won the title, but what a terrible match. Where's the triple threat match from July of that year with Angle and Rock? It was a great one, but since Taker lost, it's not here, I guess.

- The Cena match. Would've been a good one, but Taker destroying Cena, only to actually beat him, set Cena back after some great progress had been made with the character.

- The last two matches in the set are utter crap. One's an overbooked mess with Vince blading like crazy in an attempt to avoid the unavoidable (the match sucking). The other was a huge letdown, with Taker just coming back with the old music and Chuck Norris' hat. Hardly worth an inclusion.