MoS Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 If you take nothing but the absolute best performances, then Brando might win this. However, if Dylan's consistency measure has to be followed, then there is no chance. Way too many stinkers throughout his career. Post-prime also changes things. My personal GOAT is Robert De Niro. His run from Mean Streets, Bang the Drum Slowly in the early 70s to Jackie Brown - I must be the only one who loves that movie - and Analyse This in the late 90s is surreal for how unbelievably great it is. But if you include post-prime, then the dozens of giant turds he has laid the last 16-17 years or so will count against him. If you are looking for a limited run of concentrated quality, Pacino's work from 72-79 might be untouchable. I think - and I am probably in the minority here - that with the exception of a few gems, Pacino faded away strongly after the 70s, but that run is gold. It's like Samoa Joe's 2002-2006 run. Someone like Kevin Spacey could be compared to Rey Mysterio: he has quietly been good-to-excellent throughout his career. P.S - Goodfellas losing Best Picture to Dances with Wolves makes less sense than Triple H getting a number one vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Hey :-) Right up my alley. Does great match theory then equate great movie theory? I love T2, but Arnold sure ain't the greatest actor ever. But he might be The Ultimate Warrior :-) ... Orson Welles might be Randy Savage. Planned everything to the smallest detail, possibly a genius and way ahead of his time, his best stuff still seems fresh today, he got bloated by the end, does have misfires and clashed with the guy's who paid his salary more than once. And The Rock is Dwayne Johnson... Huge star, big box office attraction, charismatic, but not really very good at the craft itself... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woof Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I'll take Philip Seymour Hoffman's career over anyone's. Never seen a performance from him I didn't like, even if the movies didn't always deliver. Took chances and constantly mixed it up, Could tackle any type of role in any type of film and make it work. Totally delivered as a lead when asked. Shined in supporting roles without upstaging the film. Was great at all the small things. A guy who could slide right into a big budget action film like Twister, or a wacky ensemble comedy like the Big Lebowski, then turn around and do serious, nuanced work in any number of low scale indy projects. Tragic that we lost him when we did because he had so many great performances left to give. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I'll take Philip Seymour Hoffman's career over anyone's. Never seen a performance from him I didn't like, even if the movies didn't always deliver. Took chances and constantly mixed it up, Could tackle any type of role in any type of film and make it work. Totally delivered as a lead when asked. Shined in supporting roles without upstaging the film. Was great at all the small things. A guy who could slide right into a big budget action film like Twister, or a wacky ensemble comedy like the Big Lebowski, then turn around and do serious, nuanced work in any number of low scale indy projects. Tragic that we lost him when we did because he has so many great performances left to give. Agree 100% with everything you said! ... Can I be slightly morbid then and say, what about longevity? He might be a no brainer for #1 if he had 20 more years on his resume. ... Fuck, that was a tragic loss :-( Philip Seymour Hoffman was a genius! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoS Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Hoffman could be someone like Eddie, in a way. Rarely the main guy, but ridiculously great in every role he did. Struggled with drug addiction, which ultimately claimed his life. Danish, I love your Rock analogy, and like your Welles one, but - and this might be an unpopular opinion - I fucking hate Citizen Kane. Well, not hate, exactly. But I think it is terribly overrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Hoffman could be someone like Eddie, in a way. Rarely the main guy, but ridiculously great in every role he did. Struggled with drug addiction, which ultimately claimed his life. Danish, I love your Rock analogy, and like your Welles one, but - and this might be an unpopular opinion - I fucking hate Citizen Kane. Well, not hate, exactly. But I think it is terribly overrated. Thanks :-) Don't know if your view on Citizen Kane is unpopular. I think a lot of people feel that way. And I totally get how it can bore people, and how it can be hard to see it living up to the hype as the greatest movie ever. All movies would have a hard time living up to that, and any movie could disappoint someone, if it's sold as the greatest ever. ... But when viewed in comparrison to its contemporaries, Citizen Kane should be considered as undeniably decades ahead of its time, creating leaps in the artistic development of movies and the film language, and inspiring countless followers. It's one of the movies that must undeniably be called "great" and "important" from an "objective" point of view. Does it float everyones boat? Absolutely not, and the general taste might move further and further away from it. But few movies have ever changed the industry or the art form so radically. So including or not including Citizen Kane on a list of the greatest movies ever definetely says something about whether or not you try to rank from a perspective of importance, influence and impossible to deny greatness, or if you vote from your heart and based on your feelings more than anything else. To me, both are completely valid, with ranking movies as well as with wrestling. Not including Citizen Kane as one of the 100 greatest movies ever if ranking based on more than personal taste and personal feelings seems a little ridiculous. Hey, I think I'm making the same case here, that Parv made for Flair :-) EDIT: Oh, and spot on with the Hoffman Eddie comparison :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woof Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Do yourself a favor and watch the DVD of Citizen Kane with the Roger Ebert commentary. It'll increase your appreciation of the film tenfold. And I was racking my brain trying to find a wrestling comp for PSH and Eddie might be the best one. Nice pull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Face Chicken Wing Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 If you take nothing but the absolute best performances, then Brando might win this. However, if Dylan's consistency measure has to be followed, then there is no chance. Way too many stinkers throughout his career. Post-prime also changes things. My personal GOAT is Robert De Niro. His run from Mean Streets, Bang the Drum Slowly in the early 70s to Jackie Brown - I must be the only one who loves that movie - and Analyse This in the late 90s is surreal for how unbelievably great it is. But if you include post-prime, then the dozens of giant turds he has laid the last 16-17 years or so will count against him. If you are looking for a limited run of concentrated quality, Pacino's work from 72-79 might be untouchable. I think - and I am probably in the minority here - that with the exception of a few gems, Pacino faded away strongly after the 70s, but that run is gold. It's like Samoa Joe's 2002-2006 run. Someone like Kevin Spacey could be compared to Rey Mysterio: he has quietly been good-to-excellent throughout his career. P.S - Goodfellas losing Best Picture to Dances with Wolves makes less sense than Triple H getting a number one vote. You are not the only one who loves Jackie Brown. I wish Tarantino would take another crack at making another move like Jackie Brown -- something that has subtle character development and actual human emotion instead of simply creating his own "Tarantino Universe" filled w/ larger-than-life personalities every new film. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woof Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Post-prime also changes things. My personal GOAT is Robert De Niro. His run from Mean Streets, Bang the Drum Slowly in the early 70s to Jackie Brown - I must be the only one who loves that movie - and Analyse This in the late 90s is surreal for how unbelievably great it is. But if you include post-prime, then the dozens of giant turds he has laid the last 16-17 years or so will count against him. You are not the only one who loves Jackie Brown. I wish Tarantino would take another crack at making another move like Jackie Brown -- something that has subtle character development and actual human emotion instead of simply creating his own "Tarantino Universe" filled w/ larger-than-life personalities every new film. Co-sign. Jackie Brown is my favorite of his films. Probably the best pure acting on display of anything Tarantino has put out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yo-Yo's Roomie Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 In before OJ with Burt Lancaster. JJ Hunsecker in Sweet Smell of Success is one of cinema's great heels. Harvey Keitel would be a very PWO choice for GOAT actor. Long period of consistency, has the great films, worked up and down the card, lots of variety, and did it all while being overshadowed by his direct peers, most of whom stopped being interesting way before he did. My money is on Buster Keaton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bierschwale Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Peter O'Toole = Flair? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Lacelle Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Raging Bull Godfather 2 Taxi Driver Deer Hunter Heat Mean Streets Goodfellas Casino Jackie Brown King of Comedy He earned the right to do all the shitty movies he wants to, that is just an untouchable list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoS Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I appreciate the fact that Citizen Kane was revolutionary for its time due to the techniques and methods used for filmmaking, but I am not sure if I will put it on my list of GOAT films because, well, it just does not entertain me to that extent. It might be due to the insane hype behind it, but I do not think that tells the whole story. The Godfather also is insanely hyped, like it was when I watched it the first time, and of anything, it over-delivered. I still randomly watch clips of some of my favourite scenes from the movie. The look on Pacino's face when he says it's not personal, it's just business, is pretty bone-chilling. At that instant, you realise that he is moving away from being the good son, and he will soon be at the point of no return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Daniel Day Lewis is a tired answer to give these days, but it's a tired answer for a reason. His work in My Left Foot, In the Name of the Father, The Boxer, There Will Be Blood and Lincoln are comfortably among the best acting performances of all time. He wouldn't be my personal favorite, but objectively I couldn't have him any lower than the top five on the strength of those performances alone. I think if you were to judge acting like that, versatility would have to be one of the biggest things to come into play. Seymour Hoffman would surely be up there, have people seen Synecdoche, New York? What a bloody mind-explosion of a film that is. De Niro has to be hovering around the top spots. Nicholson too. Haven't seen enough of Brando outside of The Godfather. Clint Eastwood would be my favorite actor were I pressed to pick one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyonthewall2983 Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 My choice would be Martin Sheen. Badlands, Apocalypse Now, Wall Street and his whole damn run on The West Wing. But especially the first two. If Terrence Malick had been more prolific, Sheen could have been for him what De Niro was to Scorsese. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 In before OJ with Burt Lancaster. JJ Hunsecker in Sweet Smell of Success is one of cinema's great heels. Harvey Keitel would be a very PWO choice for GOAT actor. Long period of consistency, has the great films, worked up and down the card, lots of variety, and did it all while being overshadowed by his direct peers, most of whom stopped being interesting way before he did. My money is on Buster Keaton. Harvey Keitel = Arn Anderson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I appreciate the fact that Citizen Kane was revolutionary for its time due to the techniques and methods used for filmmaking, but I am not sure if I will put it on my list of GOAT films because, well, it just does not entertain me to that extent. It might be due to the insane hype behind it, but I do not think that tells the whole story. The Godfather also is insanely hyped, like it was when I watched it the first time, and of anything, it over-delivered. I still randomly watch clips of some of my favourite scenes from the movie. The look on Pacino's face when he says it's not personal, it's just business, is pretty bone-chilling. At that instant, you realise that he is moving away from being the good son, and he will soon be at the point of no return. The Godfather is forever one of my absolute favorites, and could at any given day be anywhere from #1 to #5 on my list. Love it way, way more than Citizen Kane... But I gotta put them both in the top 100, just because... :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yo-Yo's Roomie Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Keitel's career seems a bit more varied than that, and then he had a really strong resurgence. Maybe someone more like a Finlay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Daniel Day Lewis is a tired answer to give these days, but it's a tired answer for a reason. His work in My Left Foot, In the Name of the Father, The Boxer, There Will Be Blood and Lincoln are comfortably among the best acting performances of all time. He wouldn't be my personal favorite, but objectively I couldn't have him any lower than the top five on the strength of those performances alone. I think if you were to judge acting like that, versatility would have to be one of the biggest things to come into play. Seymour Hoffman would surely be up there, have people seen Synecdoche, New York? What a bloody mind-explosion of a film that is. De Niro has to be hovering around the top spots. Nicholson too. Haven't seen enough of Brando outside of The Godfather. Clint Eastwood would be my favorite actor were I pressed to pick one. I know this might seem like an insane comparrison, but bear with me... Is Daniel Day-Lewis = Brock Lesnar? Works like once every four years and immediately gets the gold every time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Keitel's career seems a bit more varied than that, and then he had a really strong resurgence. Maybe someone more like a Finlay. Keitel's movies maybe, but what about his performances? ... Anyway, love both Keitel and Arn. And I actually think Finlay might be a good comparrison too :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Peter O'Toole = Flair? Not bad :-) ... O'Toole did have some major stinkers on his resume (Caligula, Supergirl a.o.), but I guess you'd call that "old man Flair" and then the last few years where O'Toole did stuff like Venus would be Flair's retirement match and some other ok stuff... I could see that. What about Flair = Jack Nicholson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Do yourself a favor and watch the DVD of Citizen Kane with the Roger Ebert commentary. It'll increase your appreciation of the film tenfold. And I was racking my brain trying to find a wrestling comp for PSH and Eddie might be the best one. Nice pull. Yes. Citizen Kane is like Once Upon a Time in the West. Deeper understanding of the many, many layers in it will build appreciation. ... So Ebert's commentary is like listening to the best of the PWOP2BN podcasts? :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yo-Yo's Roomie Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Arn is more like Robert Duvall. The consummate supporting player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 My choice would be Martin Sheen. Badlands, Apocalypse Now, Wall Street and his whole damn run on The West Wing. But especially the first two. If Terrence Malick had been more prolific, Sheen could have been for him what De Niro was to Scorsese. Too far between the peaks, but a shot at "best in the world" when at that peak. Moments of pure brilliance in the 70's. Often overlooked, but wins the more of his stellar work you see. Hmmm... I could see several wrestlers fit that description pretty well. Martin Sheen is totally underrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Dynamite Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Arn is more like Robert Duvall. The consummate supporting player. Fuck! That's excactly it!!!! Good call!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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