goc

Killer Brooks is such a weird case. Anytime I've seen anyone who was in the business like Gary Hart, Mark Nulty, James Beard etc write about him in a book or on wrestlingclassics.com it's filled with nothing but praise about how he's a great hand and can lead anyone to a good match. But I've never seen anything even CLOSE to a good match from Killer Brooks. He's the shits. One of the most hyperbolic wrestling commentary moments I can remember is Gordon Solie on an episode of 1983 Georgia Championship talking about a Killer Brooks vs. Johnny Rich TV match as something that could "main event any arena in the world"

There are people who still think WWE is worried about a "good storyline"? Do they even HAVE storylines anymore? Like the only one I can actually recognize as a storyline is the Rusev/Lana stuff.

So you really think WWE spent all that time on a Nikki title reign just for her to lose the title right before she would have broken the record? Come on now.

This was good for Adrian Street being Adrian Street but it didn't do a lot for me. I do always love Street's interactions with the referees though.

Ok now you gotta watch the Pat Rose match and do a comparison of who did a better job carrying the green guy.

What CREDIBLE new source has actually reported that? I'm going to need something a little more legit than fucking wrestlezone. It's the usual petty WWE bullshit of making sure that someone who pissed them off has a record broken. Same thing as Randy Orton winning the WWE Title so Brock Lesnar would no longer be the youngest champ ever.

If I had a ballot I would vote: JYD Ivan Koloff Big Daddy Jim Breaks Jerry Jarrett

I would try and see if they can't get Mayweather to come back again. Especially with him saying he's retired (although I doubt it sticks) they could sell it as the last time to see him in a ring. Of course his drawing power is even bigger now than it was at WM24 so he might be out of their price range.

I have higher standards and would never have liked that post. It isn't realistic enough because it assumes the party throwers wouldn't be intelligent enough to know better than to invite him. I guess you're just easily entertained Mad Dog.

Let's not get crazy about "what killed the territories" here. A huge part of that is WWF made themselves look like the major leagues and everything else in turn became second rate. That and the dirty tactics like buying up the local territories TV time and getting them locked out of arenas. Even well booked territories died off. EDIT: But let's not derail this thread any more.

Phil I'm not not sure if you're on twitter to have seen that Bruce plugged your reviews on segundacaida yesterday.

But Memphis being the last surviving territory kind of disputes your theory.

Cliff Notes Version: -Sheik Adnan paid for a video to be played where he revealed he was behind Abdullah the Butcher's attack on Ron Starr and Bruiser Brody's attack on Jim Duggan. Adnan vowed to break Jim Duggan's body and spirit for running him out of Texas -Jim Duggan vowed to beat Bruiser Brody and anyone that Adnan pays to come after him. -Lord Alfred debuts The Avenger, the man he says will finally get revenge on Steve Pardee for the humiliation he's inflicted on Lord Alfred -The Avenger defeated Juan Reynosa in a squash -Mike Masters talked trash about Steve Pardee, Lord Alfred, The Avenger and Mike Jackson -Tiny Anderson ate a candy bar behind Mike Masters' back while he was talking -Mike Masters & Tiny Anderson defeated Jimmy Doo & Mike Fever -Roy Lee Welch announced he will be facing Eddy Mansfield in a Chain match this Sunday -Eddie Gilbert & Ken Lucas started their intention to become Southwest Tag Team Champs -Mil Mascaras announced he is bringing in Mando Guerrero to be his partner against Jose Lothario & Mr. Mexico this Sunday night -The Fabulous Ones vowed to get revenge on David Von Erich for ruining their World Tag Team Title match by beating he and Tully for the Southwest Tag Team Titles -The Fabs defeated The Canadian and T.G. Stone -Jose & Mr. Mexico talked trash about Mil Mascaras & Mando and vowed to expose them as false idols -Steve Stack cut off their interview when Mr. Mexico started to slander Omar Atlas -David Von Erich bashed The Fabs and said after he and Tully beat them THEY will be the ones to take the AWA World Tag Team Titles from The Wild Bills -David Von Erich defeated Ron Starr to become the 1st Southwest Television Champion Scheduled for Sunday, September 11th at the HemisFair Arena in San Antonio, TX Southwest Tag Team Titles: The Fabulous Ones vs. Texas Dynasty Bruiser Brody vs. Jim Duggan Mil Mascaras & Mando Guerrero vs. Jose Lothario & Mr. Mexico Chain Match: Roy Lee Welch vs. Eddy Mansfield Eddie Gilbert & Ken Lucas vs. Terry Adonis & Bruiser Costa Steve Pardee vs. The Avenger Mike Masters & Tiny Anderson vs. Mike Jackson & The Masked Wildfire The Canadian vs. Jimmy Doo Yin & Yang vs. Mike Fever & Ali Bey

Taped at The Junction in San Antonio, TX on 9/5 Southwest Championship Wrestling airing on Saturday 9/10 in local markets -Show intro- Steve Stack: Fans we have another exciting hour in store here on Southwest Championship Wrestling! In today's main event we'll see Ron Starr facing David Von Erich in the finals of the Southwest Television Title tournament! We'll also show you footage of how The Fabulous Ones won their match against the AWA World Tag Team Champions the Wild Bills but didn't come away with the titles, we'll talk to Lord Alfred Hayes about his newest charge and much more but before we get to any of that I was told by the producer of this show that we received a sizable amount of money and a video tape in the mail with a request to play the tape at the start of the hour. I personally have not seen the tape myself but the producer has cleared it for broadcast and told me it contains information about the attack of Abdullah the Butcher on Ron Starr last week here on TV and the attack by Bruiser Brody on 'Hacksaw' Jim Duggan from the HemisFair Arena. Let's show that tape now: Steve Stack: Fans I imagine Jim Duggan is going to have something to say about that and I'm gonna try and get him out here to talk to me while we take this break so don't go away! -First Commercial Break- Steve Stack: We're back and I'm standing now with 'Hacksaw' Jim Duggan and I know you just heard what Sheik Adnan had to say about you and why Bruiser Brody showed up at the HemisFair Arena Sunday night and attacked you. What do you have to say in response to that? Jim Duggan: Sheik Adnan couldn't get the job done himself so now he's going to use his money to bring in other people to try and do it? Well bring it on tough guy! I'm not afraid of Bruiser Brody, Abdullah the Butcher or any man walking the planet! He's right when he says that Brody helped me make the transition from football to wrestling but he and I were never really friends and I don't have any problem getting in the ring with him and showing him who the better man is! Send Bruiser Brody down to the HemisFair Arena this Sunday night so I can show you just how much your little war is going to cost you. Adnan you might as well take all your dirty money and flush it down the toilet because that's all it's going to amount to trying to break me brother. No one is going to break the Hacksaw! -Jim Duggan leaves the interview area and Lord Alfred Hayes and his masked man enter while Steve Stack is talking & Steve Stack: What a war that's going to be! 'Hacksaw' Jim Duggan against Bruiser Brody this Sunday night at the HemisFair arena! And now let me bring in another man who will be wrestling this Sunday night, the newest wrestler to be managed by Lord Alfred Hayes. Lord Alfred Hayes: That's the best introduction you could give us Steven Stack? I should know by now to expect nothing but incompetence from you anyway. Now let me do the proper introduction. Since my arrival here in Texas I have been embarrassed, humiliated, tarnished and besmirched by that insufferable, deplorable, despicable youth Steve Pardee. And now in this man I have found my Avenger. Steve Stack: So now we know that he is going by the name The Avenger, is there a reason that he in concealing his identity with that mask? Lord Alfred Hayes: Why yes Steven, there is a reason. And that is because if he were to wrestle under his more well known identity then no one would have the guts to step into the ring with such an experienced competitor. This man has been in the ring with Killer Kowalski, Reggie Parks, Karl Gotch, Wilbur Snyder, Pampero Firpo Eddie Sharkey, Verne Gagne and many other well known names in the annals of wrestling history. But while those men are nearly all at home resting in their rocking chairs and happily retired, The Avenger is only reaching the peak of his abilities. That is the kind of stamina that Steve Pardee and the rest of Southwest Championship Wrestling have to deal with. And now I have the pleasure of accompanying him to the ring and showing everyone watching this television program just what The Avenger has in store for Steve Pardee this Sunday night. Steve Stack: Alright let's send it down to the ring now where Juan Reynosa is already in the ring waiting for action against the masked Avenger. Steve Stack: It looks like Lord Alfred Hayes has brought another rough brawler here to Southwest Championship Wrestling, despite his talk about wanting to show the fans of Texas the art of scientific wrestling. Fans don't go away because when we come back we're gonna see Mike Masters & Tiny Anderson in action together and also talk to Mike Masters about his match with Steve Pardee and confrontation with The Avenger from last Sunday night. -Second Commercial Break- & Steve Stack: Welcome back to Southwest Championship Wrestling! I have with me now two men who we'll see teaming together shortly on TV here today against Mike Fever & Jimmy Doo but before they go to the ring I wanted to get a word from Mike Masters about what took place this past Sunday night in his match with Steve Pardee. Mike, we saw you lose by disqualification after the interference of The Avenger and then you saved Pardee from the attack by The Avenger & Lord Alfred Hayes but after that was over you attacked Pardee and put him in the Full Nelson. Why did you help him only to attack him right after? Mike Masters: Because I wasn't helping him to begin with! I attacked The Avenger for costing me my match and then that chump Steve Pardee offered me a handshake and I responded by putting him in the Full Nelson because I wanted everyone to see what would have happened if it wasn't for Lord Alfred Hayes sending another one of his grumpy old men out to interfere in my match. Steve Stack: Do you have any plans to challenge The Avenger in response to his interference in your match? Mike Masters: Right now I'm focused on training up Tiny Anderson here and making him a worthy partner so that he and I can take the Southwest Tag Team Titles. But if The Avenger comes into my path again then I won't hesitate to beat on him and sending him running just like I did the last time we were in a ring together. Steve Stack: Well if you don't mind I'd like to ask Tiny Anderson a few questions about how his training with you has gone over the past month. Mike Masters: I do mind! Tiny Anderson doesn't have anything to say about his training that I didn't tell you here last week. He's in the gym every morning with me, on the treadmill, on the exercise bike working to get rid of the big spare tire he's carrying around. Soon I'm going to have him lifting with me and maybe eventually he'll have a body that looks half as good as mine. While Masters was ranting about his training regimen, Tiny Anderson quickly ate an entire candy bar that he had hidden in his tights and dropped wrapper on the floor Steve Stack: Well this Sunday night you two will be facing someone who has caused a bit of trouble for your protege lately, Mike Jackson, and his partner The Masked Wildfire. Mike Masters: Mike Jackson is a nobody! He doesn't scare me or Tiny Anderson. If you didn't notice, Tiny Anderson beat him last Sunday night at the HemisFair Arena in the middle of the ring. This Sunday night I'm going to have Tiny Anderson finish him for good and you'll never see his ugly mug here on TV again. Now if you're done asking me asinine questions, we have a match to get to. As Mike Masters starts to leave he sees the candy wrapped lying on the ground Mike Masters: What is this Steve Stack?! Is this what you do our here during the commercial breaks, stuff your face with candy? I better not see anything like this out here again during my interview time or I'm gonna have YOU in the gym with me on the treadmill and the exercise bike! Steve Stack: That's not mine that's - Mike Masters: Shut it! I don't have time for your excuses, let's go Tiny! Steve Stack: Fans I don't have to tell you who was out here eating that candy bar, let's just send it to the ring for the next match. Steve Stack: That's another win for the somewhat lopsided team of Mike Masters and Tiny Anderson! We'll see if they can replicate their success this Sunday night against the team of Mike Jackson and The Masked Wildfire! Ladies and gentlemen don't go away because when we come back we're going to talk to Roy Lee Welch about his upcoming Chain Match this Sunday night against Eddy Mansfield! You won't want to miss it! -Third Commercial Break- Steve Stack: We're back on Southwest Championship Wrestling and I have with me now Roy Lee Welch! Roy you asked the promoters of Southwest Championship Wrestling to sanction a chain match between you and Eddy Mansfield for this Sunday night and they've granted your request. What exactly has made you ask for this specific stipulation? Roy Lee Welch: Well Steve, anyone who has been following what's taken places between Eddy Mansfield and myself over the past 2 months knows that he always seems to have a chain hidden somewhere on him, not just in his matches with me or against me but almost every time he comes to the ring. Last Sunday night I knew what to expect from him so I brought my own chain to the ring with me and when I saw him wrapping his chain around his fist while referee Juan Reynosa was knocked outside the ring, I was ready to fight fire with fire. Unfortunately we both ended up landing punches at the same time and both of us were laid out with chains wrapped around our fists when Juan Reynosa got back into the ring and he threw out the match. Well this time I don't want there to be any hiding or any games to be played, the referee is going to tie one end of a chain around each of our wrists and we can both use it as a weapon as much as we want. I know he's gonna whip me and beat me with that chain but I plan to do twice as much to him as what he does to me and I'm gonna come out the winner. I'm tired of going around and around with Eddy Mansfield, with count outs, disqualifications, bringing in different partners, I'm ready for this thing to end once and for all. And when I wrap that chain around my fist and punch his lights out it WILL be all over for Eddy Mansfield, Steve Stack I can promise you that. -Roy Lee Welch leaves the interview area while Eddie Gilbert and Ken Lucas come in & Steve Stack: Well that Chain Match is just another one of the big matches you're going to see this Sunday night at the HemisFair arena! With me now is a team who we'll also see in action this Sunday night, Eddie Gilbert and Ken Lucas! Guys I'd just like to congratulate you on your first win as a team last week against Ali Bey and Mike Fever! Ken Lucas: Thank you Steve! I knew that Eddie Gilbert had the first inside him to be a great team mate for me but he even exceeded my expectations not just in the ring with me last Sunday night, but here on TV last week when he beat Charlie Cook in the middle of the ring and sent him out of Southwest Championship Wrestling. Steve Stack: That was a very impressive victory, no doubt. This Sunday night you two are facing another team that we saw make their debut as a pairing last Sunday night at the HemisFair in the team of Terry Adonis and big Bruiser Costa. Do you have any thoughts about your competition this Sunday night? Eddie Gilbert: Steve you know there are a lot of great, tough teams here in the area and they just keep coming because this is one of the hottest areas in wrestling right now. But my partner Ken Lucas here has been a Southwest Tag Team Champion before and I hope that he and I can prove ourselves and he can wear that belt around his waist again with me beside him. As far as Terry Adonis & Bruiser Costa go, we've only seen them in action once before but we know they used to team together up in Canada. They may have some more experience together than Ken and I do but we feel like we're ready and we're gonna give them one heck of a fight this Sunday night. -Eddie Gilbert and Ken Lucas leave the interview area and Mil Mascaras comes in Steve Stack: Before we go to break I'd like to talk to this man here, the man with a thousand masks, Mil Mascaras about what took place last Sunday night in his match with Omar Atlas against the team of Jose Lothario and Mr. Mexico. Mil first of all, how is Omar Atlas doing after suffering that Spike Piledriver? Mil Mascaras: He is doing ok Steve Stack, he's not able to wrestle for a few weeks but there was no damage to his vertebrae. He suffered a stinger but he will be back and I know he is going to be looking for revenge against Jose and Mr. Mexico when he does come back. But for me the fight must continue on. Steve Stack: I heard that you found yourself another partner for another tag match this Sunday against Jose and his protege, do you mind telling us who you've found to team with? Mil Mascaras: Since Jose has been parading that impostor around in the colors of my country, I am not the only man he has offended. This Sunday night I will have with me a man from Mexico City, Mexico and a member of one of the most famous wrestling families, not just from Mexico but from anywhere in the world, the Guerrero family! Steve Stack: Wow! Mando Guerrero is going to be in San Antonio this Sunday night to be your partner against Jose Lothario and Mr. Mexico? Mil Mascaras: That's right Steve, Mando called me after he heard what happened to Omar Atlas and offered to come and be my partner. So Jose, that's what you have to deal with this Sunday night! The Guerrero family was a friend to you for years but since you turned your back on our people they have turned their back on you! And with the help of Mando Guerrero I am going to rip that mask off and expose that impostor as the fake that we all know he is! Steve Stack: What an announcement, just another match added to an already loaded lineup this Sunday night! Make sure to buy your tickets now to see Mil Mascaras and Mando Guerrero team up to face Jose Lothario and Mr. Mexico, Jim Duggan against Bruiser Brody, The Fabulous Ones take on The Texas Dynasty for the Southwest Tag Team Titles, Roy Lee Welch vs. Eddy Mansfield in a Chain match and much, much more! You won't want to miss it! And you won't want to change that channel because when we come back from this next commercial break we're going to take to Jose and Mr. Mexico and we'll also see The Fabulous Ones, Steve Keirn and Stan Lane in action, don't go away! -Fourth Commercial Break- Steve Stack: Welcome back to Southwest Championship Wrestling! I have with me now the men who will finally get their rematch this Sunday night against The Texas Dynasty for the Southwest Tag Team Titles, The Fabulous Ones! Stan and Steve, first of all let me tell you what a travesty of justice I think it was how you two were robbed of the AWA World Tag Team Titles last Sunday night. Stan Lane: Well thank you Steve. We agree with you, everyone at the HemisFair Arena knows we had The Wild Bills beaten in the middle of the ring and we are about to win the World Tag Team Titles when David Von Erich ran down to the ring and attacked us causing us to win by disqualification. And since the titles can't change hands on a disqualification we got robbed of the belts that should have been ours. Steve Keirn: But that's ok. Because that was only a temporary setback, we're gonna get another shot at The Wild Bills we just have to do one thing first. That's take the Southwest Tag Team Titles from David Von Erich and Tully Blanchard and that's exactly what we're gonna do this Sunday night. Stan Lane: You two tried to avoid it, Tully ran away and hasn't been in the area in weeks and David's been hanging out on the beach with Sunshine but all that stalling is coming to an end this Sunday night. We're gonna give you two the beating that you deserve and when it's all over we're going to walk out the Southwest Tag Team Champions and we'll once again be the number one contenders to the Wild Bills and the AWA World Tag Team Titles. Steve Stack: Well gentlemen let me wish you like this Sunday night! And now let's head down to the ring where we're going to see The Fabulous Ones in action against The Canadian and T.G. Stone! Jose Lothario: Don't give us any introduction Steve Stack! We don't need one from a biased announcer like yourself, the leader of the Mil Mascaras fan club. These people know who I am and they should know that this man beside me is Mr. Mexico, the role model of every man, woman and child from the great country of Mexico. Steve Stack: Ok then Jose let me ask you about the things we just heard from Mil Mascaras. He says that Mando Guerrero called him and offered to be his partner for this Sunday night. You have been a friend of the Guerreros for over twenty years, you have teamed with Gory Guerrero and all of his sons including Mando at various times over the years. What do you think about Mando specifically calling Mil Mascaras and offering to be his partner to battle you and Mr. Mexico? Jose Lothario: I think it shows just how jealous and scared the rest of the Mexican wrestlers are. They are scared that my protege is going to steal the hearts and minds of all their fans and expose all of them as the weak, pitiful examples that they are for our people. Mr. Mexico is the epitome of everything that is pure and good. He doesn't drink, he doesn't smoke, he came to this country and put 100% into learning the language and becoming part of the culture. He didn't hide in a barrio full of people who want to live in the past, he integrated the right way and people like Mil Mascaras and Mando Guerrero are afraid of being exposed as the false idols they are. Steve Stack: Alright Jose, well let me ask you why you seemed to want to end the career of Omar Atlas last Sunday night? A Spike Piledriver is one of the most dangerous moves in all of professional wrestling. Mr. Mexico: That was MY idea Steve Stack! I wanted to end his career because once again these people were cheering a man who is a terrible role model. Jose told me that Omar Atlas has 7 kids back in Venezuela and he abandoned them, he never calls or writes them, he never sends home any money! He is Steve Stack: Now I'm not going to allow you to come out here and slander him like that! I know Omar Atlas and everything you just said about him is a lie! Jose Lothario: Steve Stack, you can just dismiss yourself right now! We're tired of you calling us liars, so you get Rapido out here and he can finish this interview! Steve Stack: This is my show and I'm not going anywhere, I think you two have talked long enough and Mr. Mexico: No Steve Stack! We are not going to be silenced! Steve Stack: Yes you are! You've slandered enough out here today, I'm sending the show to a commercial break and when it comes back you two are going to be gone! -Fifth and final Commercial Break- & Steve Stack: We're back on Southwest Championship Wrestling and before we get to our big main event of Ron Starr vs. David Von Erich in the finals of the Southwest Television Title tournament, I wanted to get a quick word from David about his match with Ron Starr here today and his match this Sunday night against The Fabulous Ones. David Von Erich: First of all this match today is going to be a piece of cake. You saw what Abdullah the Butcher did to Ron Starr last week, there is no way the man isn't walking around with broken ribs. He refused to go to a doctor because he knew he'd get pulled from action if he did but that's going to be the biggest mistake of his life because getting in the ring with me at less than 100 percent might just lead to the end of his career. Steve Stack: Well you might just be right about Ron Starr's ribs, he refused to talk to me about whether or not he was injured in that attack and I heard the same thing about him refusing to go to a doctor. Be that as it may, he's still going to put up quite a fight. But we have limited time so let me just ask you WHY you interfered in the World Tag Team Title match between The Fabulous Ones and The Wild Bills last Sunday night? David Von Erich: It's simple Steve Stack, they never should have been in the ring with the World Tag Team Champions. The only team that should have gotten a shot at those belts were myself and Tully Blanchard because the Southwest Tag Team Champions are the number one contenders to the AWA World Tag Team Champs. So why did The Fabulous Ones get not one but TWO shots at the World Tag Team Champions? Since I couldn't very well get Stanley Blackburn in the ring and smash him with one of the tag belts I had to settle for The Fabs. But make no mistake, Tully and I are going to beat The Fabulous Ones this Sunday night and after we do WE are going to be the ones who take those World Tag Team Titles from The Wild Bills. Now if you'll excuse me I have another belt to add to my collection. Steve Stack: Fans I'm sorry I didn't have more time to ask David about his interference in the World Tag Team Title match but we have to send it down to the ring now for today's main event, the finals of the Southwest TV Title tournament! Steve Stack: What a valiant effort by Ron Starr who surely wrestled that match with broken ribs! David Von Erich did what he said he would though and The Texas Dynasty continues to control every title here in Southwest Championship Wrestling! Make sure you come down to The HemisFair Arena this Sunday night to see if The Fabulous Ones can stop their domination and take away the Southwest Tag Team Titles! You'll also see Jim Duggan vs. Bruiser Brody, Mil Mascaras and Mando Guerrero vs. Jose Lothario and Mr. Mexico, Roy Lee Welch vs. Eddy Mansfield in a Chain match and much much more! It's going to be another huge night of action at the HemisFair Arena so make sure you have our ticket and join us right here next week for more Southwest Championship Wrestling!

Yea the opening parts of this match were really good. Dr. Death & Butch Reed trying to tackle each other leading to Reed outsmarting him the second time was really great and the stuff with Reed mocking DiBiase's less than gun-like arms had made laughing out loud.

You seem so jaded from your indy wrestling experiences that I'd be shocked if you still get any enjoyment out of wrestling.

You don't see real sports referees getting knocked over so the visiting team can break the rules either. Or conveniently looking the wrong way every time a team fouls/holds/goes offsides/a million other rule infractions. Wrestling isn't a real sport expecting wrestling referees to act like 'real sports' referees is pretty silly. Besides, I've seen referees break holds for pulling hair/tights after asking the crowd if the heel cheated so it's not like it's never ever resulted in something happening.

Because it gets the crowd involved. It makes them care more about the cheating. It's one of the good parts of territory wrestling that's missing.

Today's upload was Butch Reed & Jim Duggan vs. Dr Death & Ted DiBiase. I just finished watching it and thought it was a ton of fun with a really hot finish.

Charlie Cook, The Nightmares, Bob Armstrong, Dutch Mantell,The Flame, The Fabs so many of my favorites here on this episode. I really liked this week's show with the Scott Armstrong stuff and then Bob Armstrong showing up at the end of the show to save Harley Race. I'm hoping for a Bullet/Race vs. Mantell/Flame match to come out of that.

Not a gif but this is amazing:

Just going to come in here and echo everyone who said that Wahoo vs. The Spoiler was awesome. I don't think I loved it quite as much as shoe or Phil but I still thought it was really damn good. The bump Wahoo took on the floor when Spoiler pulled him out of the ring got an audible groan from me. The fact that it played on Houston TV just blows my mind. I can't imagine a young wrestling fan in Houston and then moving to see wrestling TV somewhere else. That would have had to be a giant letdown.

So I watched the most recent episode of iMPACT to see Chris Masters vs. Drew Galloway (which they ruined with typical LOLTNA booking) but the contrast between their World Champions was pretty striking to me. They cut ECIII loose but he's SO MUCH better than Seth Rollins at the long heel champ opening promo that it's ridiculous.

I seem to remember Duggan hitting someone with a 2x4 that bent one time also.