Loss

Sparky Plugg is on the race tracks. "Ol' Sparky is on his way to the World Wrestling Federation!"

Vince interviews Luger in an empty arena. This is where Bryan Alvarez would make a joke that this is all of the fans that bought a ticket to see Lex wrestle. AMIRITE. Anyway, Luger, 2008 Hillary Clinton hairstyle and all, wants in the Royal Rumble, but is getting some roadblocks from Yokozuna's camp based on the Summerslam '93 stipulations. Jack Tunney will be making a decision soon. Can you imagine any stipulations from four months ago being remembered and the central focus of an angle now? Me neither.

This was an excellent TV match. It really stands out for the time because they spent so much time working holds. I wouldn't call this an example of great working of holds like you'd find on a random episode of AJ Classics in the 1970s or early 80s, but in the context of U.S. wrestling in 1994, this is really good. They spend most of the match on the mat working headlocks, hammerlock reversals and other basic mat holds before Austin finally takes over and locks in an armbar from a spinning toehold position. Not sure what to call that, and it shows how bad Tony and Jesse are as a team when they can't even give it a name or sell the importance of the holds being used. This is worth seeing for seeing what we would have gotten out of Austin had he been used more on top at this point. You'd probably see a lot of mat-based title matches. The problem was that he was wrestling like your Classic World Champion, but wasn't being pushed like your Classic World Champion, so 1994 Austin matches were never going to quite meet their potential. Plus, Austin was still putting the pieces together of his personality, although it's pretty evident by this point that he's a future star. I could have easily watched this for another 15-20 minutes, but the 12-13 minutes we got were lots of fun. More buildup than payoff in terms of match structure, but really good buildup.

This remains a tremendous video package, and I love how they made Starrcade '83 look like archived ESPN footage. This is the same video package that opened Starrcade '93 on pay-per-view, with a brief clip of Flair's post-match celebration tacked on the end.

Razor's gold chains are missing and he's pissed off! IRS stole it. It's a shame Repo Man wasn't around to act as a middleman. Well, maybe shame is putting is strongly. Pretty typical Razor promo, with him speaking at a terribly slow pace. 1994 WWF is a weird beast, where feuds around the IRS repossessing jewelry from cocaine dealers cast the drug dealer as wronged and out for revenge. Vince must have been on a libertarian kick.

I actually wanted to include some GAEA at the time, but the only match recommendation sources I knew of - PUNQ and Lorefice - didn't give a single match higher than ***1/2. So yeah, I acknowledge that not representing GAEA (or LLPW, or Jd') is a bit of a gap, but there were no recommendations out there at that point. We will do a supplement at some point. Not sure what format it will take or how many discs it will be, but 1996 GAEA will have representation for sure.

It's ridiculous to expect the gimmick to already be over. It hasn't had enough time. I'd be curious how fast Umaga got over if we looked back at his 2006 matches. When I saw the gimmick, my first thought was that it was a pretty okay idea that needed time to work. It's going to take a few months, although there should be some difference after getting a win over Cena (which is a match they did WAAAAYY too soon).

Yes, that's proven by the fact that John Cena gets a unanimous reaction from the remaining audience.

But ... that very thing (that people believe even though they know they probably shouldn't) is one of pro wrestling's most endearing qualities. This begs the question of what to actually consider a shoot. Guys hitting each other for real I still consider a work if the outcome is decided upon in advance, which probably means works have happened in every sport at some point.

So some folks don't like FIP. Let them, especially if they're willing to explain why they don't like it. That's kind of the point of discussions on a Pro Wreslting Discussion Board. We all have things that we like that not everyone else does... or things we don't like that quite a few other folks like. Jesus... the whole Davey Richards Sux Cox Brigade is largely in response to another brigade thinking he Fucking Rulz!!! If it's a discussion that one actually gives a shit about, it's useful for people to explain themselves. It's vastly more embarassing if they don't explain themselves. John This is a dramatic departure from your typical approach to this stuff. Not to mention that anytime I like something you don't, or dislike something you like, I get an earful. You don't "let me" enjoy stuff that you don't that I'm willing to explain all that often. Misawa/Taue. Muto/Hash. The LA FMW/Santo six-man. The Dangerous Alliance 8-man from '92. Do you "let me" just like what I like in these cases? Not really. When I make a post that you think fails to mention down time in the first fall of that UWA six-man, do you "let me" just make the point without getting that point in? Not really. And you shouldn't. That's the purpose in discussing all of this. I have stated my claim on face in peril so many times that there is nothing I can possibly add at this point that I haven't already said. I don't see the point in going through that entire argument every single time the topic comes up, because I think it's this unnecessary need for innovation and reinventing the wheel that I find puzzling. I also think this is the mindset that gave us Vince Russo and eventually killed a lot of my interest in continuing to watch modern stuff. I think it's so insanely self-evident that "new" in wrestling almost always sucks, and that innovation in wrestling is a terrible, terrible thing. It's so ridiculous that I can barely be bothered with it, and it shocks me that not everyone sees it the same way sometimes. It truly is the wrestling equivalent of someone saying the sky is green to me. You have said over the years that opinions can be wrong. You also enjoy using the analogy that anyone who has the opinion that Sid is a great worker has a wrong opinion. This is my Sid is a great worker. Nintendo Logic is perfectly allowed to say there has never been a great Southern tag, but that's a pretty sweeping statement, and I don't understand why you're not responding to him for saying something you very obviously do not agree with. Instead, for some reason, your focus is on me dismissing the opinion. You started the woodpile for things to get tossed on, remember?

Oh geez, the infamous "bait & switch" match. I remember this kinda sucking, I wouldn't say cut it because of the circumstances surrounding it but I wouldn't put it in the essential pile either. If this does make it on, you guys gotta include some clips of Robin Hood for full effect or maybe spread it out across the set, you know, have part 1 on disc 1, part 2 on disc 17, really capture the moment. That's actually a hilarious idea. I'm not sure if anyone actually recorded the match past Nitro going off the air though. I hope someone did. I skipped that accidentally, but we have the finish to both Shawn/Sid and the Rumble from that show.

Regal/Iaukea was a title change that tried to directly copy the Rock/HHH title change from Thursday Raw Thursday a few days earlier. This set will nicely pick that up.

Me, as was mentioned in that other thread.

I stand by it. How many people in this thread have criticized FIP, a Southern tag staple? Nintendo Logic took it to the extreme, but he wasn't the first person to pile on.

Thank Bix. I haven't seen it myself, or at least I don't remember it, but it was his recommendation.

Tarantino is all about respecting the traditions of the genre. There is nothing that matters less to Vince Russo.

Wrestlemania X-7 was the biggest show I've ever attended live, but my most memorable live experience was definitely seeing Steve Austin vs Vince McMahon in a cage. Just an amazing moment to be a part of live. The second most fun experience I've ever had watching wrestling live was an NWA TV taping I attended in 1989. Flair/Funk, Sting/Muta and Luger/Doc were the untelevised big matches, but they taped several weeks of TV during that taping, so there were matches like Flair/Bill Irwin and Flair/Rotunda throughout the night that were lots of fun, and I also really liked the Pillman/Gilbert/Irwin/Cuban Assassin four-corners match. That was also the taping where Doom debuted (taped just four days before Havoc when they had their PPV debut), and everyone in the crowd figured out that they were Ron Simmons and Butch Reed about two minutes in. Gary Hart and the Great Muta were sitting in the bleachers watching the whole show, and Tommy Rich was playing all of the entrance music. There was a small hole in the wall where you could see the locker room that I peaked into. The SST and Humperdink were playing cards and Ric Flair walked by to straighten his tie in the mirror. I remember thinking it was weird that they were in the same dressing room. That building was at the Fairgrounds in Arkansas, and was also the site of some fairly famous UWF TV tapings, like the one where the Freebirds broke Doc's arm before his match with Gordy. It was small and the wrestlers had no problem leaving the locker room and going elsewhere in the building. At a house show a few years later, which was headlined by a really great Blonds vs Steamboat/Douglas match, I remember going to the concession stand and Cactus Jack was in line to get a corn dog. That show was right after Vader regained the title from Simmons, so we were surprised to see Vader with the belt.

I just wanted to bump this to say that I think OJ's greatest contribution to this thread - even more than match recommendations - has been in providing some explanation of the lucha libre mythology. Good work. That's the beginners guide I needed when I started diving in back in 2005.

I think they should get rid of the ring. Wrestling promotions that rely on a ring to have matches are clearly uninspired and are clinging to an archaic tradition for no real reason. Also, why are there three counts? Could someone really be put in a compromising position for three seconds in a real fight? Faces and heels are tired. Fans who like to cheer babyfaces and boo heels are thinking too much inside the box. And why do they have championships? Everyone knows wrestling is fake, so it's not like winning a title symbolizes anything. I look forward to a more innovative time in pro wrestling -- one where the unbroken gets fixed and what has worked for more than a century is declared old hat.

This thread is getting a little ridiculous. There has never been a great tag team match in the U.S. Every institution in wrestling sucks. Embarrassing.

The issue is more that it wasn't a real job, it was a tribute show job, and everyone knows that. It reads like Shawn thinks him putting Rey over for the first time is a bigger deal than Eddy dying. I don't think there's anything wrong with Shawn's outlook, but having a conversation like that is more awkward than anything.

This is tremendous. Keep it coming. As for your question, I'm working on it.

Referees never getting any smarter or more resilient is also an interesting one.

Benj, you MADE MY WEEK.

Yeah, the idea of wrestlers having a finishing move always felt too comic book/trading card-like to me -- similar to how every comic protagonist has a weakness. I guess it has marketing value though. Randy Orton using the RKO as his normal finisher and throwing out the punt in rare cases/big matches is a great compromise that I can live with.