Loss

Depending on the number of people participating, I may very well be asking for help when the time comes. I'll keep you all informed.

I personally think Bret/Shawn is the second best Ironman they've ever done, following Bret/Owen on 7/9/94 in Uniondale, NY, in a match only available as a handheld. I'm not a fan of that stip, so I don't *love* that match either. The best use overall I've seen of that stip was 30 minutes instead of 60 and featured Rude and Steamboat at Beach Blast '92. Watched Jumbo/Tenryu 6/5/89, Tenryu/Steamboat 2/23/84 and Rey/Juvi 6/16/95 today. All terrific matches that will be added to this list.

Fixed. That was my mistake.

Those were the matches on Bowdren's 80s list that hadn't yet been mentioned here.

08/05/82 - Tiger Mask v Dynamite Kid (NJPW) 12/13/82 - Stan Hansen & Bruiser Brody v Dory & Terry Funk (AJPW) 04/03/83 - Riki Choshu v Tatsumi Fujinami (NJPW) 04/21/83 - Tiger Mask v Dynamite Kid [2/3 FALLS] (NJPW) 08/31/83 - Dory & Terry Funk v Stan Hansen & Terry Gordy (AJPW) 12/08/83 - Riki Choshu, Yoshiaki Yatsu & Animal Hamaguchi v Akira Maeda, Tatsumi Fujinami & Kengo Kimura (NJPW) 07/23/84 - Nobuhiko Takada & Satoru Sayama v Akira Maeda & Yoshiaki Fujiwara (UWF) 08/02/84 - Cobra v Kuniaki Kobayashi (NJPW) 12/05/84 - Nobuhiko Takada v Kazuo Yamazaki (UWF) 12/08/84 - Tiger Mask v Pirata Morgan (AJPW) 06/21/85 - Tiger Mask v Kuniaki Kobayashi (AJPW) 08/22/85 - Lioness Asuka v Jaguar Yokota (AJW) 03/20/86 - Jumping Bomb Angels v Lioness Asuka & Chigusa Nagayo [2/3 FALLS] (AJW) 06/12/86 - Akira Maeda v Tatsumi Fujinami (NJPW) 07/31/86 - Riki Choshu v Killer Khan [TEXAS DEATH MATCH] (AJPW) 10/09/86 - Akira Maeda v Don Neilsen (NJPW) 11/07/86 - Chigusa Nagayo v Dump Matsumoto (AJW) 11/24/86 - Nobuhiko Takada & Shiro Koshinaka v Tatsumi Fujinami & Keiji Muto (NJPW) 02/05/87 - Nobuhiko Takada v Shiro Koshinaka (NJPW) 01/04/87 - Lioness Asuka & Chigusa Nagayo v Yumi Ogura & Kazue Nagahori (AJW) 02/26/87 - Lioness Asuka v Chigusa Nagayo (AJW) 03/20/87 - Akira Maeda & Nobuhiko Takada v Keiji Muto & Shiro Koshinaka (NJPW) 03/26/87 - Akira Maeda & Nobuhiko Takada v Keiji Muto & Shiro Koshinaka (NJPW) 08/20/87 - Antonio Inoki, Seiji Sakaguchi, Keiji Muto, Kantaro Hoshino & Yoshiaki Fujiwara v Riki Choshu, Tatsumi Fujinami, Akira Maeda, Kengo Kimura & Super Strong Machine [ELIMINATION MATCH] (NJPW Summer Fever) 10/06/87 - Lioness Asuka & Chigusa Nagayo v Bull Nakano & Condor Saito (AJW) 12/05/87 - Chigusa Nagoya, Yumiko Hotta, Mika Suzuki, Yachiyo Hirata & Mika Takahashi v Lioness Asuka, Mika Komatsu, Kazue Nagahori, Mitsuko Nishiwaki & Etsuko Mita [60-MINUTE IRONWOMAN MATCH] (AJW) 12/11/87 - Stan Hansen & Terry Gordy v Genichiro Tenryu & Ashura Hara (AJPW) 02/04/88 - Nobuhiko Takada v Hiroshi Hase (NJPW) 02/05/88 - Nobuhiko Takada v Keichi Yamada (NJPW) 03/09/88 - Jumbo Tsuruta v Tiger Mask (AJPW) 06/10/88 - Owen Hart v Keichi Yamada (NJPW) 07/19/88 - Toshiaki Kawada & Ricky Fuyuki v Shinichi Nakano & Shunji Takano (AJPW) 08/08/88 - Antonio Inoki v Tatsumi Fujinami (NJPW) 09/20/88 - Toshiaki Kawada & Ricky Fuyuki v Shinichi Nakano & Shunji Takano (AJPW) 06/24/88 - Owen Hart v Shiro Koshinaka (NJPW) 10/28/88 - Genichiro Tenryu v Jumbo Tsuruta (AJPW) 07/13/89 - Jushin Liger v Naoki Sano (NJPW) 09/20/89 - Jushin Liger v Naoki Sano (NJPW)

January or February.

I think Rudo was suggesting 1995-2005, but I may be wrong. This was requested by him and Brian, so I thought I'd start a topic for it. Of course, it will be kept totally separate from any pro wrestling lists.

Use this thread to nominate matches you've seen that you think are good that would fit in this category. We'll keep this and all other topics open for the remainder of the year so you can add matches anytime you come across something you see that you like.

I have the January match.

I may possibly need donations, but that's far in the future. All we're worried about right now is getting plenty of nominees in every category.

I'm surprised Trevor Rhodes hasn't been mentioned yet. Those who have seen him seem to be very high on him. Maybe by that time, Harry Smith will be looking to wrestle stateside as well.

From WWE.com: YEEEEEOWCH! They didn't even wish him well in future endeavors.

If Sting won, it's 03/11/93. That match took place in Germany and was a WCW World title change. I think it's the only thing available from that tour, so I'm sure that's it.

Please provide dates whenever you have them. Here are some links if you're unsure of the dates of matches that may help you. http://www.prowrestlinghistory.com -- Results of every supercard ever, and then some. Please, if you list a match from a PPV or ECW show, check here for the real date instead of just naming the show. http://www.thehistoryofwwe.com -- Go here for any WW/W/F/E stuff and if you know the year, you can select 'Edit' on your browser then select 'Find', and search for the wrestler, arena, etc and it should come up. http://www.deathvalleydriver.com -- For 90s matches, go to Best Matches of the 90s and see if the date is there if you are unsure of it. These are just a few of the resources that I know exist, but the more help I can get, the better. Some things you may not have a date for, and that's okay, but every little bit helps. I spent four hours on the nomenclature alone today, and I'm hoping to never have to do that again. That's all.

Actually, you nominated three Styles matches. I don't recall anything about any other TNA matches. I'll add them in. EDIT: I stand corrected. You did mention them.

Fixed.

I'm blessed with a freakish memory, so I should be able to pull dates if you have info on the town the match took place in or even the finish or if there were any gimmicks attached. The more info you have when you don't have a date and a promotion, the better, because I can almost always track it down. Flair and Morton had a handful of matches in '86. One was a handheld that showed 35 minutes of a 60-minute draw. One showed the first 15 minutes of the match on NWA Pro in May of '86 and what's shown is out - freakin' - standing! They had a cage match on the GAB tour that Flair won by hooking the tights that only aired on Japanese TV (which I have). The first match they had was impromptu and took place in the Techwood Drive studio on TBS and ended with Morton getting the pin (with Gibson doing the counting). Is it one of those? If you can tell me some of Adonis's opponents, I can probably find matches. I'll add Patterson/Slaughter now. On Mid Atlantic stuff, if any of the matches are title changes, we can almost certainly find dates. If we can figure out an estimate on some of that older footage, we can go with that. Also, the booking (I know the date parameters for most of Flair's face/heel runs) will help. Basically, the more info you can provide, the better. I can make Portland suggestions and will do so. Problem is that I don't have dates for a lot of them and I'll have to make a lot of suggestions on hearsay. With Portland footage, I'll probably pick up the footage and then weed out the bad stuff, so something is there representing the territory. AWA suggestions that haven't been mentioned yet: 03/01/81 - Nick Bockwinkel v Tito Santana 06/28/81 - Adrian Adonis v Jim Brunzell 10/17/82 - Adrian Adonis v Hulk Hogan 09/23/83 - Rick Martel v Nick Bockwinkel 08/11/84 - Bruiser Brody v Crusher Blackwell 09/30/84 - Bruiser Brody v Crusher Blackwell 09/25/85 - Harley Race, Bill & Scott Irwin v Giant Baba, Jumbo Tsuruta & Genichiro Tenryu 11/??/85 - Ric Flair v Nick Bockwinkel (Winnipeg) 11/22/85 - Curt Hennig v Nick Bockwinkel 04/20/86 - Harley Race v Rick Martel (all 4/20 dates are Wrestlerock '86) 04/20/86 - Midnight Rockers v Doug Somers & Buddy Rose 12/25/86 - Curt Hennig v Nick Bockwinkel (Brawl In St Paul) 05/02/87 - Curt Hennig v Nick Bockwinkel 10/01/87 - Jerry Lawler & Bill Dundee v Soldat Ustinov & Doug Somers I can also recommend Lawler/Kerry from Superclash III as a nomination. Plenty of AWA matches aired on AJ Classics as well. I'll scour those lists later. IF ANYONE HAS SEEN AND CAN COMMENT GOOD OR BAD ON ANY OF THE MATCHES ABOVE, PLEASE DO SO. Thanks.

I think I have access to a version that's about as complete as you'll find. It's a definite nomination and I've added it.

I added the four-way just for you. Snow/Jannetty is a FANTASTIC choice. I have the match in full in great quality, but it's a handheld. If we have to, we'll use that one. Speaking of, anyone got any handheld nominations?

Liger/Hase is 05/06/91. Aja's partner was Bison Kimura in that match, which I have on a comp myself. It's scary that these dates just pop up off the top of my head. Do you want to nominate Liger/Hase?

In fact, if any two wrestlers on the roster need to take a long break besides HHH, those wrestlers are Chris Jericho and Kurt Angle. I'd say Booker T on Smackdown fits that bill as well if he wasn't near retirement already, anyway. The company never elevated that group of talent properly, so expecting them to put over the Cenas and Batistas of the company is completely unrealistic.

One of the biggest problems with the current method is that the TV/PPV cycle is eating talent alive. Wrestlers usually have a 6-12 month period, at most, where they're hot and they have to be pushed then or they'll never get over like they should because they're jobbing to guys equal or above them on the totem pole and getting their wins back the following week. At that point, they're just like everyone else. Everyone on the roster -- NOT just the main event -- is incredibly stale. Really, guys like Chris Jericho are the worst type of guys to be headlining PPVs at this point, because they're largely seen as yesterday's news, or wrestlers the fans gave up on seeing reach the top years ago. He maintains heat because he was a big name in the boom period, but he's seen as being below a top level player. Cena is hurt by association, especially when the world title match is a midcard match.

08/03/78 - Tatsumi Fujinami v Ray Mendoza