Steenalized

I've heard those numbers before and in a way they're hard to believe, though I trust they're legit. I have a coworker who's from east/central Arkansas and can rattle off Memphis wrestlers from the mid-late 70s with no issue even though she is in no way a wrestling fan since then. That show was a big, big deal from all the sources I've heard.

I don't know if it's the board or my keyboard/computer but I'm having a hell of a time trying to use the quote function or copy/past here, so I'll try to make it clear what I'm responding to via italics. Apologies for any typos. Brackets with ellipses are to save me some typing. Whether I like the gimmick or not is irrelevant. 99% of people would agree that the evil foreign heel gimmick is at best dated and regressive, at worst xenophobic and cheap. The facts it makes for boring television is even worse. No. 99% of people do NOT think that. You think that. A handful of other people probably think that. A large section of people here do not think that, nor do the WWE live audience, especially on the point of making boring television. Well no. His television segments are repetitive, whether you enjoy them or not [...] Except you're using 'repetitive' as a pejorative, not a normative time. Yes, his matches were repetitive in that they always ended with him going over (until now) and working the back (which his finisher is designed to target the back, what an idiot he is in there). Yes, his promos were repetitive in that they were about putting him over and making him lookg strong. That does not mean that they were boring or ineffective to most people. Again a worthless response [...] Because currently your argument boils down to: Given how you talk about him, I'm not going to make you think he's a good worker and I'm sure as hell not going to be convinced by your "oh he's repetitive" talk that he's a bad worker. I think Tenryu is the greatest Japanese worker I've seen. Some people think he's boring as shit. DIfferent strokes, and all that. But if you're going to argue Tenryu was an ineffective worker, which is what you're doing to Rusev, then you need more than "I don't like these aspects of him." That's fine for your opinion on him, but not a universal presentation of his merits as a wrestler. The crowds sure as hell care. Can't agree with this. Can't remember a match of his that was molten, where the crowd really cared about the result one way or another. He got the crowd to care about matches with lame duck Big E and dead as a door nail Swagger. And overdone face Sheamus. Cena too, of course, though I'll grant that almost all of Cena's opponents get reactions. You can count on one hand [...] than any face on the roster. This is a non-point. Lesnar is treated as an unstoppable monster and isn't really a heel given the crowd reactions, the Heyman promos, and how he's treated. Bray, after his loss to Cena and poor follow up feuds, is dead in the water as a character. Rusev could go either way, time will tell. Really don't get [...][ He wasn't getting crazy crowd response against Mark Henry and Big Show. No one gets a reaction against Big Show, he's so past it in the crowds eyes, but he got as much as anyone else has in the past few years. He did get reactions against Henry, but again Henry is treated in such a start and stop matter that these are basically midcard, past their prime acts that were short showdowns to put him over. Look at how he's been since then. Well, don't, you'll just say the crowd give him crickets and the gimmicks suck and the matches are boring. The crowds weren't dead for those matches either, which is saying something given at least 3/4ths of the roster gets no reaction on a given night.

He also had that moment where he lost his shit when the Russian flag unfurled wrong. Little things like that which show his commitment to the character.

That's so damn ridiculous that USWA was doing that well and yet was considerably down from where it was at one point.

To address those in order: -That's a point of you just not liking him/his gimmick. -See above -See above -Partially see above, but also as I mentioned there are ways to spin it and keep it going, and there's more to it than "I'm Russian, Russia's great, America sucks." That's the baseline of it, yes, but there's a bit more to it (the WWE online promo was a great example) and there are ways to expand from there. -See what I just said. -Lots of guys try to get cheap heat. He actually gets it, and not just with the flag waiving and 'America sucks' shtick. He actually gets heat in his matches, which is far more important and indicative of his standing as a heel. -Time will tell how he makes his way out of this, but there are a lot of factors involved, including if he beats Cena at ER and how he beats him there. The problem is that every heel that gets to the top at this point, save Rollins who is oddly their golden boy in many ways and Brock, who isn't really a heel anymore, gets zero chance to shine. They lose once then get shuttled back down to nothing programs, if a program at all. See Bray last year going into a heatless feud vs. Jericho. Cesaro got a huge reaction at Mania and the next night because of all the smart and European fans at Mania. That died out pretty quickly, albeit the booking didn't help. Cesaro also didn't have the sustained crowd push like Rusev has had for months now.

The arguments from people who don't like Rusev seem to come down to "I don't think he's very good so I'm glad he'll get shipped back down the card." I don't mean to fight a strawman here, I'm really not seeing much else do it. The gimmick may or may not have a short shelf life, but given the huge reactions he's getting it hasn't exactly run its course yet. Not to mention it can survive through some tweaks, even if it has to go beyond a purely-anti-American gimmick. I don't even think it's only an anti-USA gimmick either. That's at the root of it, but he's also working the gimmick of being an unstoppable elite athlete, training and working harder than anyone else. They can work it in the future too where he's a heel who is willing to forego his principles when it's advantageous, so Rusev the wrestler isn't dead in the water even if Rusev the Russian is. My problem with these anti-Rusev arguments is, like I said, they come down to 'I don't care for Rusev, so fuck it.' I get that to some level, I don't give a damn about Bray Wyatt and would prefer him off my TV. The problem is that the WWE has a major issue of being able to produce quality, top level heels. If Bray actually could have stuck as a heel, then I'd be happy enough to at least have a legitimate heel around as much as I can't stand his promos. Rusev on the other hand has shown some excellent character and promo ability and has gotten top level heel heat that the company needs so badly right now. It's better for the WWE for him to be strong and hated then for him to become yet another heatless midcard act. What are they going to do, push Rollins as the sole heel at this point when he's definitely struggled to get reactions at time? Lesnar isn't a heel at this point. Reigns could turn heel, but the crowd might still sink him with apathy, rejecting him as the chosen one who they do not want.

Given if that's a 3.68, I see the point about it being obtainable someday if things get hot, but for the time being that's a heck of a climb to get there, especially consistently. Not that it's a 'fair' measure in someway, everyone in TV is getting a lower rating save for sports.

And as for Ryback, I still think he has the skills, the look, and the crowd is getting behind him again. He could get a title run some day, a good one at that, though I don't see it being particularly soon either. With Rollins holding the title, he has Reigns, Lesnar, and Orton to come after him immediately. If Ryback gets a title shot, it'd just be to save time until one of those other three gets a shot. Still, I'm high on Ryback and given his look, Vince can get behind him.

What rating do those Raw numbers come out to? Dave was saying on the Raw recap episode from yesterday/Monday night that he didn't think they were going to hit a 4.0 unless something big changed.

Lord, I fear that comedy gimmick career path, but it seems all too real. Cena couldn't afford to eat that loss though, so this has to be.

Loved the show, all almost 3 hours of it, but you saved the best for last with that Danny Meltzer recap. Had to stifle my laughter hard as I sit here in my cubicle.

The loss to Rusev at Fastlane isn't high profile when you compare it to the rematch win at Wrestlemania. It's like when Brock jobbed to HHH at Mania then got the rubber match win at Extreme Rules. Wins/losses at Mania are a bigger deal than B shows.

He wore the same thing back when he was WWE champion around Summerslam 2013

Cool to see some new talent getting to go over tonight, but I wanted Axelmania to last a bit longer. Probably died last night, all things considered.

Shine as in have the bright lights on them, not that they're all going to excel. And I'm pretty sure Bryon is being intentionally subdued, given how like a half dozen people just got wiped out by Lesnar. EDIT: And what Will said. It makes him come off as boring, but it does beat constant arguing.

More NXT regulars getting to shine as Byron takes the booth on a lone. Loss' shadow promotion theory looking pretty good right now as we get a little taste.

I want Brock on my TV again and again. This is how you make someone look like the biggest destroyer in the world.

Brock is one scary man. Booker T and JBL looking absolutely dead brought it home/

What am I missing???? Kalisto involved in the tag, Neville video package.

Big showcase there for Kalisto.

Since Fujinami went in and there's talk (at least on the reaction show if nowhere else) of different wings to the WWE HOF, what are the chances we get a Tenryu induction? He even has a Wrestlemania to manufacture a moment out of.

It'll be an eventful Raw, reason enough for me to watch something I watch just about every week anyway. But I am always interested in seeing where things go the day after Mania.

When did the big budget cuts start, September/August? I wonder how far back they had to start earmarking money and making plans for some of the things THAT big.

I hope they go easy on Reigns too after his awesome performance last night, but I don't think it's a huge deal even if they crap on him. The post-Mania raw crowd isn't indicative of how the rest of the WWE audiences will react, at least after about 3 weeks, a month tops.

All this, and we don't get Reigns vs. Big Show and/or Kane. Well, we still might, but it won't be the headlining feud for the title.