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El-P

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  1. Well, maybe we'll end up having this Charlotte Flair vs Tessa Blanchard match after all...
  2. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    This is some crazy shit indeed. Poor girl, she can't bet balanced being surrounded by pieces of garbage of human beings like these people. I mean, chanting "Your dad's dead" at the guy who, as a professional, showed concern for the safety of a 13 years old girl ? Spectacular pieces of shit. This is downright harassement and should be dealt with.
  3. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    The MMA comparison are fine, expect not really since MMA really popped up in the mid 90's, at a point where the whole "you gotta make it believable" was a completely moot point anyway. The only popular fighting sport during pro-wrestling "classic" heydays was boxing. Blood in pro-wrestling is a total other subject, and there's probably a lot to discuss about it too. This. Also, there used to be the good old Harley Race style hardway, which needless to say had to suck a lot worse than blading your forehead in term of actual commotion. Like I said, I don't either, he's a terrific worker anyway.
  4. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    That's what workers like Bret Hart and countless others, including famous brawlers, have done their entire career. I don't think anyone ever had any issues with it. Also, blading has always looked completely illogical, anyone having watched a boxing match that drew blood in their life would know the crimson mask is bullshit. There's a reason why the most common idea about blood in pro-wrestling is that it's capsule fake blood. Hey, I enjoy stiff work a lot. But I totally see the point of view of workers who would not take that kind of shit when it goes toward the extreme. Hell, to play devil's advocate, I remember The Honky Tonk Man making fun of Steamboat's machingun-wound sell of a guy slapping his chest with his bare open hand, saying it looked completely stupid (of course I disagree, but I understand what he means).
  5. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    We're talking about from the point of view of his opponents. Yeah, I can take that dropkick, also Money Clip me all day long. His tombstones are always clean as hell too. Also, if you've watched the G1, he's not even close to be broken down, but that's beside the point.
  6. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Okada's style is pretty safe, there's maybe one tricky bump in his usual match lay-out, which is the cascading down the top rope from the dropkick. As far as leaving his opponent bruised and covered in welts, well, that's exactly the point I was making earlier in references to not being sure how comfortable I was with this. There is stiffness and there is needless level of stiffness and I'm not sure what to think about WALTER's game. If you *need* to leave your opponent bruised and covered in welts for it to be compelling, what does that really say about your work ? It was referred earlier that some guys like Bret Hart did not like the chops, which is the heart of this discussion really. For a guy like Bret, and many old school US style workers like Martel (who said about Booker T "You have to convince the audience, you don't have to convince me"), it was supposed to be an illusion. And although there is a much different mentality in Japan, guys like Tanahashi (and Okada) really seem to share that point of view. And then there's stiff work, and then there's stiff work that aims at leaving bruises and welts, which is yet another level. It's interesting to watch a guy like Ibushi who at times will kick someone hard in the chest or leg, and at other time will very obviously work light as hell and chose to do the thigh slap. Obviously I'm not a worker so I don't know for sure, but since I mentioned about those moves as "safely executed", I think it's safe to say that a nice powerbomb can lead to a simple flat back bump in which you can use the arms on the side to deflect the impact. As far as german suplexes and side-suplexes, I've seen guys like Ibushi, Naito, Misawa or Kobashi absolutely taking a head bump on purpose from guys who never drop people on their heads otherwise (it was actually one of the cheap ways Misawa would add danger to matches that had no doubt in their results otherwise, which really struck me as poor judgement on every level), so it seems there is some degree of control. And again, these are regular pro-wrestling bumps (suplexes, powerbombs) that you are supposed to take to some extent. Ending up with melted bloody flesh on your chest, not so much. And I would not blame anyone that would not want to take that kind of offense because again, if the only goal is to actually make you bleed and bruised up, you can argue that it's a shitty way to work. I'm not saying WALTER is *only* about that of course, I'm just discussing that specific, but important, aspect of his game which can leave me a bit uncomfortable at times. There was the infamous case of Sid telling Benoit he would not take the chops back in WCW I believe.
  7. El-P

    Modern Indie Wrestling

    And so there is Bloodsport 7 tonight, with MiSu vs Chris Dickinson. And then he goes against Nick Gage on Sunday. And then he goes to the next IMPACT tapings. The King travelling to the US scene has been one of the most fun happening of the year.
  8. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Yeah, nothing is tougher than comedy. And yet nothing gives you less symbolic capital in pop culture than making people laugh. It really depends on how stretchable you are though. One amazing thing about Manami Toyota was her flexibility, which made the submission holds look amazingly painfull, when really she was probably just having a good stretching seance ! Speaking of which, I really hope we get that Danielson vs ZSJ match. Just heaven.
  9. El-P

    AEW Rampage (and The Buy In) - October 15 2021

    Actually, I love that spot because the Skull End is probably the worst looking Dragon Sleeper variation ever, so winning with it is kinda flat to me, plus SANADA is always gonna honor his mentor and finishing with the moonsault is very sumoesque mentality of "I have to win doing my mentor's style". I had not seen that analogy but it's really a perfect one, and I totally subscribe to it. There is probably something to be said about some supposedly "smart" work which really isn't that smart and supposedly "dumb" work that really isn't that dumb, but that's for another time...
  10. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    I said if done *safely*. If I were a pro-wrestler, I'd want to work against Toru Yano every day and that's it.
  11. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Disagree. If done right and safely, these are much less painfull and damaging. Having your flesh turned into blue, disgusting bloody mess doesn't seem fun at all, while taking a safe german suplex (Kurt Angle style for instance) or a safe powerbomb is probably a piece of cake in comparison, as you're also in control of your own bumping.
  12. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Considering his love for classic Flair vs Steamboat, which was saturated with endless chop sequences, I guess he has nothing against it. I dunno, I totally understand workers who don't like them, because it can come off like a cheap way to get a reaction (and really now, if there was a spot that was bastardized by a guy like Flair, that's it, not that I mind it at all, but it's always funny to hear people complain about this or that move being overdone in modern wrestling...). Interestingly enough, two of the smartest wrestlers in the last 15 years, Okada and Tanahashi, despite working in the country that made stiffness the in-thing, based their style on a totally opposite approach, much more reminiscent of what Bret would do for instance in the US. And yes there are different approaches depending on the context too. You can argue most lucha chops look completely weak and ridiculous, but they absolutely work in a lucha libre context. While the infamous Kensuke Sasaki vs Kenta Kobashi epic chop exchange, which can be looked at a ridiculous display of useless stiffness from the perspective of a guy like Bret or Lance Storm, actually was awesome in the big show japanese context, and really the entirety of Suzuki vs Danielson stems from this philosophy.
  13. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Hum... when I see the bloodied, bruised chests of Walter's opponents, I'm not sure I totally buy that. Then again, I remember Meltz said once that an american worker told him that Ishii's work was actually mostly quite light (you can see it in the way he throws his elbows, especially earlier on, but some of these chops to the throat look like hell). I remember watching that Walter vs PCO match and although I did love the sheer insanity of it, the bruised meat of PCO was legit disturbing.
  14. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Vince is a sociopath. The crocodile tears when he'll die are gonna be spectacular, but he is a complete sociopath. Talk to me like that IRL and I'm flipping you off and leave immediately, boss or no boss or whoever.
  15. El-P

    Is the empire crumbling before our eyes?

    Would they even let Walter do his ├╝ber-stiff style of work in the main roster though ? I mean Sheamus or Big E. would probably take it without any issue, but apart from those two... He's a guy I'm still on the fence about. I'm not sure how comfortable I am with his style TBH. Even a guy like Ishii doesn't brutalize his opponents like he does. I dunno. Considering I have no issue with some pretty crass hardcore stuff, maybe it's just a cognitive dissonance. That being said, I can't lie about the fact him vs Danielson would probably be something quite special.
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