Best Shoot Style Promotion

[Guest Andy]

Hey, I'm new to this forum..

 

I was just wondering what everyone's opinions on what they think the best shoot style promotion was.

 

RINGS?

BattlARTS?

UWF and all of its other incarnations?

PWFG?

 

I'm really interested in getting in-to the style and was wondering what the best promtion is to start off watching.

 

I know of Goodhelmet's PWFG & 80s Other Japan set & Lynch's massive BattlARTS set.

 

Thanks.

 

Andy.

[El-P]

It depends what you want in shoot-style though. If you're aiming for pure shoot-style with no bullshit, RINGS had the greatest matches ever with Volk Han, Tsuyoshi Kohsaka and Tamura. But also terrible undercard full of really shitty fake looking match with horrible martial artists. And washed up Maeda. Some may argue PWFG was the greatest shoot-style promotion since Yoshiaki Fujiwara is now considered one of the greatest wrestler ever, although some don't see that at all.

If you want more glamourous fights, the second UWF and UWF-I are right your alley, with Takada coming on top in the first, and being the top star in the second. Plus a really good undercard with guys like Tamura, Sano, Sakuraba, Kakihara, some good gaijins like Lydick, the contributions of Vader, Gary Allbright, Dan Severn, John Tenta, Little Guido... Yep.

First UWF was really Maeda and co searching their way into the shoot fight style. Tons of pro-style spots, Tiger Mask coming off the top rope, you name it. Still, tons of great stuff.

BattlARTS is like a modern version of the first UWF last time I checked.

[Guest Andy]

It depends what you want in shoot-style though. If you're aiming for pure shoot-style with no bullshit, RINGS had the greatest matches ever with Volk Han, Tsuyoshi Kohsaka and Tamura. But also terrible undercard full of really shitty fake looking match with horrible martial artists. And washed up Maeda. Some may argue PWFG was the greatest shoot-style promotion since Yoshiaki Fujiwara is now considered one of the greatest wrestler ever, although some don't see that at all.

If you want more glamourous fights, the second UWF and UWF-I are right your alley, with Takada coming on top in the first, and being the top star in the second. Plus a really good undercard with guys like Tamura, Sano, Sakuraba, Kakihara, some good gaijins like Lydick, the contributions of Vader, Gary Allbright, Dan Severn, John Tenta, Little Guido... Yep.

First UWF was really Maeda and co searching their way into the shoot fight style. Tons of pro-style spots, Tiger Mask coming off the top rope, you name it. Still, tons of great stuff.

BattlARTS is like a modern version of the first UWF last time I checked.

Thanks for the response!

 

Well, the main thing I am interested in is the pure wrestling aspect of shoot style wrestling. I've seen Fujiwara, Volk Han & Tamura before and they all look good - but I haven't seen nearly as much of them as I want. I've heard RINGS has a REALLY bad undercard - I'm thinking of just buying the Tamura & Volk Han comps from ivp.

 

Is Takada any good? I've heard a lot of people shit on him whenever I look up some shoot style stuff.

 

But yeah, overall I am most interested in the mat wrestling aspect.

[El-P]

Well, the main thing I am interested in is the pure wrestling aspect of shoot style wrestling. I've seen Fujiwara, Volk Han & Tamura before and they all look good - but I haven't seen nearly as much of them as I want. I've heard RINGS has a REALLY bad undercard - I'm thinking of just buying the Tamura & Volk Han comps from ivp.

Yep, RINGS is more enjoyable throughs comps. Going through entire cards can be trying. But matches involving Han, Tamura, Khosaka, Yamamoto you can go for without thinking twice about it.

 

Is Takada any good? I've heard a lot of people shit on him whenever I look up some shoot style stuff.

Oh my god, you have no idea what huge can of worms you're opening here. I'll make it quick. 10-15 years ago, Nobuhiko Takada was considered one of the greatest wrestler of all time. In the GWE poll from the mid 00's I think he already suffered from *the* backlash. Right now, tons of people think Takada suck. Don't ask me why, I haven't revisited his stuff in years. But basically, Takada was always more pro-style at heart than shoot-style. If you like über crisp matwork, more "realistic" (whatever than means, eh !), match, Takada isn't your man. If you like glamorous epic fights with dramatic moments, Takada is your man. Awesome big match worker (again, from my recollection). Takada basically has more in common with Onita than with Fujiwara when you think about it. That's not a knock on him BTW, I love Onita.

 

But yeah, overall I am most interested in the mat wrestling aspect.

Ok then. Nobuhiko Takada isn't your man. Get into Fujiwara, Tamura, Sano, Volk Han, Kohsaka.

 

Oh, and if you have nothing against joshi puroresu, the first year and a half of ARSION was basically a female version of BattlARTS. Mariko Yoshida was Volk Han is Volk Han was a cool and attractive japanese female. She was just amazing to watch. Her matches with Yumi Fukawa are just a work of art.

[Guest Andy]

Yep, RINGS is more enjoyable throughs comps. Going through entire cards can be trying. But matches involving Han, Tamura, Khosaka, Yamamoto you can go for without thinking twice about it.

Do you know where I can get any Khosaka, Yamamoto or Sano? IVP don't have anything, and I doubt Slambamjam or Highspots do.

 

Oh my god, you have no idea what huge can of worms you're opening here. I'll make it quick. 10-15 years ago, Nobuhiko Takada was considered one of the greatest wrestler of all time. In the GWE poll from the mid 00's I think he already suffered from *the* backlash. Right now, tons of people think Takada suck. Don't ask me why, I haven't revisited his stuff in years. But basically, Takada was always more pro-style at heart than shoot-style. If you like über crisp matwork, more "realistic" (whatever than means, eh !), match, Takada isn't your man. If you like glamorous epic fights with dramatic moments, Takada is your man. Awesome big match worker (again, from my recollection). Takada basically has more in common with Onita than with Fujiwara when you think about it. That's not a knock on him BTW, I love Onita.

I have no problem in enjoying epic encounters I think a lot of people find it fashionable to hate on good wrestlers - I've seen both Misawa & Jumbo getting hate recently.

 

Ok then. Nobuhiko Takada isn't your man. Get into Fujiwara, Tamura, Sano, Volk Han, Kohsaka.

How much time is spent on the mat in their matches? I'd prefer a wrestler who is extremely focused on mat wrestling.

 

Oh, and if you have nothing against joshi puroresu, the first year and a half of ARSION was basically a female version of BattlARTS. Mariko Yoshida was Volk Han is Volk Han was a cool and attractive japanese female. She was just amazing to watch. Her matches with Yumi Fukawa are just a work of art.

I'll check out some of their work

[El-P]

Do you know where I can get any Khosaka, Yamamoto or Sano? IVP don't have anything, and I doubt Slambamjam or Highspots do.

No idea, I'll let those who know about those things answer.

 

How much time is spent on the mat in their matches? I'd prefer a wrestler who is extremely focused on mat wrestling.

Most RINGS big matches with Han, Khosaka and Tamura are extremely matwork oriented. Ditto Fujiwara in UWF and PWFG.

[Guest Andy]

Do you know where I can get any Khosaka, Yamamoto or Sano? IVP don't have anything, and I doubt Slambamjam or Highspots do.

No idea, I'll let those who know about those things answer.

 

How much time is spent on the mat in their matches? I'd prefer a wrestler who is extremely focused on mat wrestling.

Most RINGS big matches with Han, Khosaka and Tamura are extremely matwork oriented. Ditto Fujiwara in UWF and PWFG.

 

Thanks! PWFG set, all UWF sets & Han, Tamura & Khosaka sets are headed my way

[Kronos]

I have to second the suggestion for Mariko Yoshida in ARSION. From about 1998-2003, she was a submission wrestling MACHINE -- and if you like your matwork wicked-looking, then she's your gal. There's not as much ARSION on youtube as there are other promotions, but you can find some.

 

Sounds like you're gonna be busy for awhile.

[Jingus]

Do you know where I can get any Khosaka, Yamamoto or Sano? IVP don't have anything, and I doubt Slambamjam or Highspots do.

No idea, I'll let those who know about those things answer.

 

Someone give this fellow Lynch's contact info.

[Guest Andy]

I have to second the suggestion for Mariko Yoshida in ARSION. From about 1998-2003, she was a submission wrestling MACHINE -- and if you like your matwork wicked-looking, then she's your gal. There's not as much ARSION on youtube as there are other promotions, but you can find some.

 

Sounds like you're gonna be busy for awhile.

Just shoot style will keep me busy for months

 

 

Someone give this fellow Lynch's contact info.

I have his contact info In fact I'm in negotiation for the history of RINGS. Although he won't have comps for wrestlers - and if he makes a custom comp it's going to set me back a LOT. I'm looking for a ready made comp

[smkelly]

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/comps.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwfi.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwf.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/rings.htm

[Guest Tabe]

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/comps.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwfi.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwf.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/rings.htm

Hey, somebody linking to my site

 

For me, the various shoot-style groups are ordered like this:

 

1) UWFI - my favorite. Yes, it's not as realistic as RINGS but the matches are more entertaining. And Takada is great.

 

2) RINGS - far and away the most realistic. At its best, RINGS was really, really great. 1996-98 they cranked out one great match after another. And you get Volk Han, the greatest submission wrestler of all-time.

 

3) UWF 2.0 - Takada, Maeda, Tamura, Fujiwara, etc, all in one place. Loads of talent, lots of great matches. Style is more like UWFI in that it's a little flashy rather than uber-realistic. Some matches even feature pinfalls.

 

Big drop off then...

 

4) UWF 1.0 - more pro-style than anything though the 1985 stuff tends to be a lot more shoot-y. There's a lot of stinkers in this one though.

 

5) U-Style - Had all the potential to be really good but hurt by simply not running enough shows and not having enough big names besides Tamura. There's some really good stuff in here though.

 

6) Kingdom - Second to RINGS for realism. Kingdom, like RINGS, also occasionally did legit shoots. Because of the influence of MMA, they put gloves on the guys and tried to make it look more like MMA. Didn't really click very often but when it did - Sakuraba vs Kanehara twice - it was really, really good.

 

7) PWFG - Comps are the only way to go with PWFG as their full shows were NOT good. The majority of what I've seen from PWFG has simply not been very good. And that includes the Fujiwara stuff. I am definitely not a fan of his post-UWF work.

 

8) BattlArts - Way too much pro mixed in with the shoot-style for me. Granted, my exposure is extremely limited to BattlArts but that's because I simply have not enjoyed what I've seen.

 

Tabe

[smkelly]

Welcome Tabe!

[Guest Andy]

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/comps.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwfi.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/destinations/uwf.htm

http://s94991397.onlinehome.us/newsite/des...tions/rings.htm

Hey, somebody linking to my site

 

For me, the various shoot-style groups are ordered like this:

 

1) UWFI - my favorite. Yes, it's not as realistic as RINGS but the matches are more entertaining. And Takada is great.

 

2) RINGS - far and away the most realistic. At its best, RINGS was really, really great. 1996-98 they cranked out one great match after another. And you get Volk Han, the greatest submission wrestler of all-time.

 

3) UWF 2.0 - Takada, Maeda, Tamura, Fujiwara, etc, all in one place. Loads of talent, lots of great matches. Style is more like UWFI in that it's a little flashy rather than uber-realistic. Some matches even feature pinfalls.

 

Big drop off then...

 

4) UWF 1.0 - more pro-style than anything though the 1985 stuff tends to be a lot more shoot-y. There's a lot of stinkers in this one though.

 

5) U-Style - Had all the potential to be really good but hurt by simply not running enough shows and not having enough big names besides Tamura. There's some really good stuff in here though.

 

6) Kingdom - Second to RINGS for realism. Kingdom, like RINGS, also occasionally did legit shoots. Because of the influence of MMA, they put gloves on the guys and tried to make it look more like MMA. Didn't really click very often but when it did - Sakuraba vs Kanehara twice - it was really, really good.

 

7) PWFG - Comps are the only way to go with PWFG as their full shows were NOT good. The majority of what I've seen from PWFG has simply not been very good. And that includes the Fujiwara stuff. I am definitely not a fan of his post-UWF work.

 

8) BattlArts - Way too much pro mixed in with the shoot-style for me. Granted, my exposure is extremely limited to BattlArts but that's because I simply have not enjoyed what I've seen.

 

Tabe

 

Thanks for the info! I think you PMd me on Crazymax

 

I was just wondering if anyone had a best of UWFI - *UNCLIPPED* - I would totally be down for buying that.

[smkelly]

Highspots is running a buy one get one free Memorial Day special right now. They have a best of UWFI on there as one of the specials.

[FLIK]

How much time is spent on the mat in their matches? I'd prefer a wrestler who is extremely focused on mat wrestling.

OK, completely diffrent style of mat work then shoot style but you might like a lot of old school British World of Sport stuff then.

 

A great introduction match

 

John Naylor vs Zoltan Boscik

 

Not all of WOS is like this obviously but a lot is.

Tellumyort has exactly 4 billion and 17 other matches on his acount

[Death From Above]

U-Style would have been amazing if they had a deeper roster and had been able to do more. As it is, they are really more of a suppliment.

 

I can't even stress enough what that 15 minute time limit they imposed did for them. So much of UWF-i was just laying around doing fuck all because they booked 6 matches to fill 2 hours in a company with no interviews, 6-mans and angles. When it worked it was a good company, but I also thought there were a lot of times that it really, really didn't.

[ohtani's jacket]

The best shoot style is RINGS since it most closely resembles Pancrase and Vale Tudo. My favourite is UWF-2, though I'm partial to PWFG as well. No prizes for guessing the worst. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

[El-P]

. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

Nope. And you don't hate UWF-I nearly as much as I hate WWE, too much Sano and Yamazaki in it for you to truly hate it.

[El-P]

And Takada is great.

I fell less lonely.

[Guest Andy]

The best shoot style is RINGS since it most closely resembles Pancrase and Vale Tudo. My favourite is UWF-2, though I'm partial to PWFG as well. No prizes for guessing the worst. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

This has put me off getting the UWF-i set, I was going to get that and the Bryan Danielson or the 6 disk Ultimo set.

[ohtani's jacket]

. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

Nope. And you don't hate UWF-I nearly as much as I hate WWE, too much Sano and Yamazaki in it for you to truly hate it.

 

I don't much care for Yamazaki and Sano could've been so much more in UWF-i.

[ohtani's jacket]

The best shoot style is RINGS since it most closely resembles Pancrase and Vale Tudo. My favourite is UWF-2, though I'm partial to PWFG as well. No prizes for guessing the worst. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

This has put me off getting the UWF-i set, I was going to get that and the Bryan Danielson or the 6 disk Ultimo set.

 

Don't let me put you off. There are UWF-i matches that a lot of people like. I doubt that they're on the comp, however.

[Guest Andy]

The best shoot style is RINGS since it most closely resembles Pancrase and Vale Tudo. My favourite is UWF-2, though I'm partial to PWFG as well. No prizes for guessing the worst. UWF-i is to shoot style what Jerome thinks WWE is to pro-wrestling.

This has put me off getting the UWF-i set, I was going to get that and the Bryan Danielson or the 6 disk Ultimo set.

 

Don't let me put you off. There are UWF-i matches that a lot of people like. I doubt that they're on the comp, however.

 

Yuko Miyato vs. Tatsuo Nakano *** (6/11/88)

Norman Smiley vs. Kazuo Yamazaki *** (6/11/88)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Akira Maeda **** (6/11/88)

Norman Smiley vs. Yoji Anjo (8/13/88)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Akira Maeda (11/10/88)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Bob Backlund (12/22/88)

 

Disc Two

 

Kazuo Yamaazki vs. Nobuhiko Takada (2/27/89)

Yoshiaki Fujiwara vs. Masakazu Funaki (9/7/89)

Minoru Suzuki vs. Yoji Anjo (10/25/89)

Maurice Smith vs. Minoru Suzuki (11/29/89)

Chris Dolman vs. Kazuo Yamazaki (11/29/89)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Duane Koslowski (11/29/89)

Akira Maeda vs. Nobuhiko Takada (1/16/90) ****

 

Disc Three

 

Yoshiaki Fujiwara vs. Nobuhiko Takada (2/27/90)

Masaharu Funaki vs. Minoru Suzuki (4/15/90)

Minoru Suzuki vs. Yoji Anjo (6/21/90)

Ken Shamrock vs. Yoji Anjo (10/25/90)

Masaharu Funaki vs. Ken Shamrock (12/1/90)

Nobuhiko Takada & Kazuo Yamazaki vs. Gary Albright & Mark Flemming (11/25/92)

Yoshihiro Takayama vs. Hiromitsu Kanehara (12/20/92)

Nobuhiko Takada vs Naoki Sano ***1/2 (12/20/92)

 

Disc Four

 

Yoshihiro Takayama vs. Tom Burton ***1/2 (2/14/93)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Kiyoshi Tamura ***1/2 (2/14/93)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Dan Severn (5/6/93)

UWFi World Champion Nobuhiko Takada vs. Big Van Vader (12/5/93)

Kiyoshi Tamura vs. Naoki Sano ***1/2 (5/6/94)

Kazushi Sakuraba vs. Kennichi Yamamoto (10/14/94)

Dan Severn vs. Yoshihiro Takayama (10/14/94)

Yuko Miyato vs. Kazushi Sakuraba (11/30/94)

Kiyoshi Tamura vs. Dan Severn (11/30/94)

Gary Albright vs. Nobohiko Takada (11/30/94)

 

Disc Five

 

Kazushi Sakuraba vs. Hiromitsu Kanehara (8/18/95)

Gary Albright vs. Kiyoshi Tamura (8/18/95)

Billy Scott vs Kenichi Yamamoto ***1/2 (10/23/96)

Nobuhiko Takada & Naoki Sano vs Kazushi Sakuraba & Yoji Anjoh(10/23/96)

Kazushi Sakuraba vs. Yoshihiro Takayama (11/20/96)

Masahito Kakihara & Kenichi Yamamoto vs. Hiromitsu Kanehara & Kazushi Sakuraba (12/27/96)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Yoshihiro Takayama (12/27/96)

 

There's the match listing. Any standouts?

[ohtani's jacket]

There are some good matches on there, but it's not a particularly well made comp. It would be fun to make a better one.

 

I will say that the comp has some of Takada's better matches on it, such as:

 

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Akira Maeda (11/10/88)

Nobuhiko Takada vs. Bob Backlund (12/22/88)

Nobuhiko Takada vs Naoki Sano ***1/2 (12/20/92)