WHAT ARE YOU WATCHING?

[Guest Hunter's Torn Quad]

Mod's note -- If this topic makes no sense, it's because all the match reviews were pulled out afterward and posted in the match reviews folder that we didn't have at the time, but that we now have. Check it out, it'll make much more sense than this thread. -- Loss 05/02/05

 

Last match I watched was the Kojima v Tenzan Triple Crown v IWGP Title match from Feb 20th. For me, this was ***** easy, regardless of what some troll said. I seriously do not see anything else this year coming close to beating this out for MOTY.

[goodhelmet]

*****, really? No offense, but I really want to see a breakdown of this match and why it stands out from the rest of the great matches out there to have the highest honor that can be bestowed upon a match. Just saying it is ***** is meaningless. What makes it *****?

[Guest KingPK]

I'll go into more detail once I watch them again, but I watched 7 Dynamite Kid-Tiger Mask matches from April 82-April 83 recently and....I just couldn't get into them upon repeated viewings. Maybe it's because it's basically the same match every time (a flurry of activity followed by long rest periods), or because I know absolutely no Japanese and couldn't understand the commentary (which could have been informative to me), but some of the matches weren't all that great (incuding the......8/30/82 match I believe, which is the one that's restarted, but they end up brawling outside again). The match at MSG was pretty good, as they got an apathetic American crowd right into it and had them applauding at the end.

 

People call these matches "must see" for Puro beginners, but I'd point to matches like Benoit vs. Sasuke ('94 J-Cup final, which is on the Benoit DVD, I believe) and a whole shitload of Jushin Liger matches (4/30/92 vs. El Samurai, vs. Dick Togo 96' tournament final to name a few) for people to watch to get the best of Japanese wrestling.

 

Also, I watched Benoit and Ohtani vs. Black Tiger and Great Sasuke from the '94 NJ Jr. Tourney, and it was a very good tag match with Benoit and Ohtani's great selling and good pace.

 

And from the WWF, I watched the Final Four match. Great wild brawl, but not much else to it.

 

There you go Will, I FINALLY gave thoughts on those matches you sent me.

[Guest Hunter's Torn Quad]

*****, really? No offense, but I really want to see a breakdown of this match and why it stands out from the rest of the great matches out there to have the highest honor that can be bestowed upon a match. Just saying it is ***** is meaningless. What makes it *****?

Why was it ***** ? Because I felt it was. It was one of the few matches I've seen that I've felt something special from when watching, and when I get that feeling from a match, I know it's a classic for me. I can't explain it more than that, and I don't really care to. I'm not a person who needs to go into minute detail over each and every moment in a match to justify how I rated it. All I need to justify to myself what I rate match is how I feel about it. If you want to go into detail over a much to give your rating of it meaning, go right ahead.

[goodhelmet]

There you go Will, I FINALLY gave thoughts on those matches you sent me.

Well, it is about time!!!!

 

As far as the DK-TM matches go, you fall in line with alot of the smarter fans' criticism of the series. The thing that made them stand out was the time in which they happened, not the actual work. When I view them, I watch them as a history lesson so it makes them easier viewing for me. I will agree, however, that there are clearly better matches out there to introduce someone to puro or even Jr. wrestling.

 

 

HTQ...

Why was it ***** ? Because I felt it was. It was one of the few matches I've seen that I've felt something special from when watching, and when I get that feeling from a match, I know it's a classic for me. I can't explain it more than that, and I don't really care to. I'm not a person who needs to go into minute detail over each and every moment in a match to justify how I rated it. All I need to justify to myself what I rate match is how I feel about it. If you want to go into detail over a much to give your rating of it meaning, go right ahead.

You can explain why you felt that way, but as you already indicated, you choose not to. I guess that is just the big difference between myself and Loss and other wrestling fans.

 

"OMG Owen vs. Bret was *****!!!! "

 

"Why?"

 

"Because I said it was! "

 

[Guest Hunter's Torn Quad]

I said it was ***** because I felt it was. I'm not saying that to say, "It was ***** because I said so", but because it was something I felt. Does nobody watch wrestling matches for the emotions they bring out anymore ?

[Loss]

This is going to seem insane, but I'd actually place War Games at Wrestle War '92 ahead of Flair/Steamboat at Wrestle War '89. War Games manages to tell a story quite well -- there are at least 10 feuds in place that need to be settled and they're all brought together for one epic match. The action is brutal and believable all the way through, and the crimson masks on Austin and Dustin were especially gory. They tried new things that got a huge pop, and they even provided some great continuity with the Sting/Nikita mini-story. Wrestle War '89 fell flat to me because it didn't have the energy or flow of the previous Flair/Steamboat matches, and it was largely stationary, where Clash VI, which was almost twice as long, had more nonstop action. When I think of Clash VI, I think of Steamboat dropping 16 elbow drops on Flair's leg in a hellacious spot, and when I think of Wrestle War, I think of Steamboat working an armbar for what seemed like forever and both wrestlers acting a little too stoic for my liking. I do see what you're saying, I really do, and on the surface it makes sense, but when we have seen good-great matches with the strap/chain/bullrope like Sting/Vader or Austin/Savio, I think it's fair to hold others to the same standard.

[Tim Cooke]

Smackdown main event was pretty good for a TV match. Orlando Jordan sucked ass, to the point that Eddy decided he would really just stop doing anything but almost everything with Eddy/JBL and JBL/Rey was really good. JBL should have petitioned for Eddy as his WM opponent since Eddy makes him look like a million bucks. And Rey's selling in this match is just another example of how he is the Kawada of the WWE in 2004-2005.

 

Tim

[MyOwnSummer]

I downloaded the SuperJcup 1994. I've seen various matches from it before but not the entire thing. I don't really know anything about Puro, so other than the obvious people like Taka and Liger (along with the Gaijin of course) I don't know who some of these guys are.

 

I'm not very good at giving an in depth review of matches like alot of you guys are, but I'm enjoying what I've seen so far, and I definetly will be looking for more Puro. Are the other SuperJCups also good?

[Guest Steffie]

Mankind vs. Underdaker, Hell in a Cell match. I've always liked the extreme side of wrestling (ECW for example) and this match was just amazing, though it was basically just Foley get the crap beat out of him

[Guest Some Guy]

That match and the first HiaC are the main reason I don't like the Undertaker. He did absolutely nothing in the Foley match (he bladed off a tope and that was about it) and *HE* was the guy who got more over out of it (the fans were chanting "Undertaker" not "Foley". Foley was still greated with apathy until Mr. Socko came around. After Socko the fans started to care about all the bumps he took, before the sock they didn't give a shit for the most part.

 

In the HBK match Taker did a little bit more but that was the HBK show, yet Taker gets the heat out f it because he beat the fuck out of him for 80% of the match.

 

Taker has been in 5 HiaC matches and the only one that he did much in was the Brock match and that wasmostly him punching and selectively selling his twice broken right wrist that Brock worked over for about 5 minutes with chairshots and such.

 

The Bossman one just sucked all aorund because it had too crappy workers who didn't do anything in the match.

 

In the six way all he did the whole match was toss Rikishi off the cage, which spots from that match gets shown in HiaC highlights? Angle carrying the whole match? Nope, it's Taker tossing the fat guy onto the truck.

 

"Taker" is a actually a really telling name for the guy because he gives almost nothing to his opponents and takes all the credit and most of the heat.

[goodhelmet]

I'd have to review some tapes and whatnot but I think the fans latched onto Foley before the sock.

[Guest Some Guy]

Not really to any great degree. He was pretty over as a face in the summer of 97 while feuding with HHH, then they switched him to Cactus Jack and that was pretty over, they they turned him heel and into Dude Love, and then into Mankind. All the switching from gimmick to gimmick and doing clean jobs on PPV after PPV hurt his heat a lot. Even Foley admits that he wasn't over until the Sock and that he thought the business had passed him by. Had they done anything to capitalize on the bumps at KotR by turning him face and pushing him during the summer then maybe he would've gotten over again, but instead he jobbed in next 5 PPVs. Although he did make it to the finals in the Surivor Series tourney, by that point the sock was around and he was getting over again.

[Guest Steffie]

That match and the first HiaC are the main reason I don't like the Undertaker.  He did absolutely nothing in the Foley match (he bladed off a tope and that was about it) and *HE* was the guy who got more over out of it (the fans were chanting "Undertaker" not "Foley".  Foley was still greated with apathy until Mr. Socko came around.  After Socko the fans started to care about all the bumps he took, before the sock they didn't give a shit for the most part.  

 

In the HBK match Taker did a little bit more but that was the HBK show, yet Taker gets the heat out f it because he beat the fuck out of him for 80% of the match.  

 

Taker has been in 5 HiaC matches and the only one that he did much in was the Brock match and that wasmostly him punching and selectively selling his twice broken right wrist that Brock worked over for about 5 minutes with chairshots and such.  

 

The Bossman one just sucked all aorund because it had too crappy workers who didn't do anything in the match.

 

In the six way all he did the whole match was toss Rikishi off the cage, which spots from that match gets shown in HiaC highlights?  Angle carrying the whole match?  Nope, it's Taker tossing the fat guy onto the truck.

 

"Taker" is a actually a really telling name for the guy because he gives almost nothing to his opponents and takes all the credit and most of the heat.

I'll bet he'd be more than happy to make YOUR monkey ass famous too.

 

Speaking of Undertaker, my all-time favorite match was Undertaker VS Undertaker, not for the quality of it but for the novelty of it all. The buildup was interesting to me and the idea of seeing two Undertakers battling it out was something that I absolutely couldn't miss. It may have been a slow, plodding, worthless excuse for a match, but I'll be damned if it wasn't a stroke of genius.