Homogenization of Styles in Modern Pro-Wrestling

[RyanClingman]

Paul Cooke recently wrote an article for the site entitled 'The Homogenization of Pro Wrestling', which brought up some interesting points that are pretty relevant to the kinds of discussions that take place on PWO.

 

In particular, he questions whether the modern equivalents of Ultimo Guerrero, Tiger Mask, Gran Hamada, Guerrero, and Mysterio -- who merged styles and ways of working in certain respects -- have now become the norm as far as the global landscape is concerned. There is also a big question as to whether or not WWE's acquisition of talent and creative restrictions, to whatever extent, will and have caused a fading of one pro-wrestling's greatest assets -- its diversity as an art form.

 

The article can be found here.

[Loss]

I thought this was a fantastic read and I agreed with virtually all of it. It actually felt very similar to a couple of things I've written before:

 

Homogenization of wrestling styles

Wrestling On Fast Forward

 

But it expanded further on those ideas.

[Bierschwale]

The two cheap answers:

 

1) More traditionalism-driven revivals of styles. I mean, I'm not going to call Karissma-Zoom Driver matches the shining path forward, but they're trying.

 

2) More new influences. Does pro wrestling need wushu exhibitions? Probably not, but why shouldn't we find out?

[Jingus]

Does pro wrestling need wushu exhibitions? Probably not, but why shouldn't we find out?

It's been done. Low-Ki and the other northeastern Puerto Rican spot-fu artists used to steal a bunch of spots from martial arts movies. Look at the first Ki/Red match from ROH for some good examples. They're not the only ones, Jack Evans was the first guy to introduce me to Tony Jaa movies, long before he had any name recognition in this country.

 

As for the mixing of styles: we do live in an awfully weird time, when even the WWE is blatantly influenced by so many regional styles. On any given episode of Raw you'll see standard Titan Sports main event brawling, indy-style spot monkeyshines, faux MMA, probably a little bit of third-generation strong style, probably some lucha libre, maybe a little bit of Southern work-the-crowd tomfoolery, maybe even some European catch. It really is nowadays a rather astonishing melting pot of wrestling from different times and places, all haphazardly thrown together and then given the standard WWE Style new coat of paint.

[GOTNW]

It's interesting though the "wrestling is AMERICAN" talking points are rather tiresome when we know it isn't the case. But I guess nothing different should be expected, especially when the european catch scene has been dead for so long and the guys that are trying to revive it now are using just another branch of cosplay wrestling. Obviously US played a major role in it spreading so much (like they do in everything) but you'd think with America supposedly being so "great" they wouldn't have such an inferiority complex over everything.

[Tim Cooke]

It's interesting though the "wrestling is AMERICAN" talking points are rather tiresome when we know it isn't the case. But I guess nothing different should be expected, especially when the european catch scene has been dead for so long and the guys that are trying to revive it now are using just another branch of cosplay wrestling. Obviously US played a major role in it spreading so much (like they do in everything) but you'd think with America supposedly being so "great" they wouldn't have such an inferiority complex over everything.

Did you even read the article?

[GOTNW]

 

It's interesting though the "wrestling is AMERICAN" talking points are rather tiresome when we know it isn't the case. But I guess nothing different should be expected, especially when the european catch scene has been dead for so long and the guys that are trying to revive it now are using just another branch of cosplay wrestling. Obviously US played a major role in it spreading so much (like they do in everything) but you'd think with America supposedly being so "great" they wouldn't have such an inferiority complex over everything.

Did you even read the article?

How about you cut the passive aggressive bullshit out and just get straight to the point.

[Tim Cooke]

 

 

It's interesting though the "wrestling is AMERICAN" talking points are rather tiresome when we know it isn't the case. But I guess nothing different should be expected, especially when the european catch scene has been dead for so long and the guys that are trying to revive it now are using just another branch of cosplay wrestling. Obviously US played a major role in it spreading so much (like they do in everything) but you'd think with America supposedly being so "great" they wouldn't have such an inferiority complex over everything.

 

Did you even read the article?

How about you cut the passive aggressive bullshit out and just get straight to the point.

My question is legit. If you read the article and the take a way was AMERICAN JINGOISM, I don't know what to tell you.

[GOTNW]

My opinion on the article is vastly different from the one I have about the tiny bits in it that depict wrestling as an american creation. Doesn't mean those bits shouldn't be commented on.

[Tim Cooke]

My opinion on the article is vastly different from the one I have about the tiny bits in it that depict wrestling as an american creation. Doesn't mean those bits shouldn't be commented on.

Factually, wrestling was an American export, for Japan, Mexico. Article even talks about Euro guys coming to the US and not vice-versa.

 

So I'm not sure what these tidbits are that you are talking about.

[GOTNW]

 

Factually, wrestling was an American export, for Japan, Mexico.

My original post didn't even dispute this.

 

I often throw lazy comments so I guess this is that biting me in the ass now. So I'll answer it properly. We get this:

 

 

Early pro wrestling champions including George Hackenschmidt and Stanislaus Zbyszko made their marks in Europe and the United Kingdom before also rising to prominence in the United States.

and also this:

 

Although largely an American creation

 

Despite the fact that pro wrestling is generally considered an American creation

 

If you interprete the first point like you did (it doesn't even explain what it is they were doing in Europe) it doesn't add up. We know pro wrestling changed dramatically since it originated in France in the 19th century of whenever but if americans didn't invent pro wrestling (which they didn't), then what exactly did they change? They popularized it, sure, but rarely do I see people address these things. Maybe there are proper answers on wrestlingclassics or somewhere. Loss answered that on twitter by mentioning championships, commentary and stuff like that, but those are really sports ideas and the idea that americans are the only ones who could possibly think of them are laughable, and it's questionable whether they were the ones to first think of them (I really can't fathom there not being a "wrestling champion" of some sorts before wrestling spread to the US, it's just human nature to want to decide who is the best/strongest etc.)

[RyanClingman]

I thought this was a fantastic read and I agreed with virtually all of it. It actually felt very similar to a couple of things I've written before:

 

Homogenization of wrestling styles

Wrestling On Fast Forward

 

But it expanded further on those ideas.

 

The 'Wrestling on Fast Forward' article was an absolutely fantastic article -- it is now linked to at the bottom of the article.

 

 

 

Factually, wrestling was an American export, for Japan, Mexico.

My original post didn't even dispute this.

 

I often throw lazy comments so I guess this is that biting me in the ass now. So I'll answer it properly. We get this:

 

 

Early pro wrestling champions including George Hackenschmidt and Stanislaus Zbyszko made their marks in Europe and the United Kingdom before also rising to prominence in the United States.

and also this:

 

Although largely an American creation

 

Despite the fact that pro wrestling is generally considered an American creation

 

If you interprete the first point like you did (it doesn't even explain what it is they were doing in Europe) it doesn't add up. We know pro wrestling changed dramatically since it originated in France in the 19th century of whenever but if americans didn't invent pro wrestling (which they didn't), then what exactly did they change? They popularized it, sure, but rarely do I see people address these things. Maybe there are proper answers on wrestlingclassics or somewhere. Loss answered that on twitter by mentioning championships, commentary and stuff like that, but those are really sports ideas and the idea that americans are the only ones who could possibly think of them are laughable, and it's questionable whether they were the ones to first think of them (I really can't fathom there not being a "wrestling champion" of some sorts before wrestling spread to the US, it's just human nature to want to decide who is the best/strongest etc.)

 

 

When you refer to wrestling's origins in France, you are referring to touring shoot grappling outfits right? Isn't it widely agreed that what we would not consider the traditional working aspects of wrestling originated in the United States in the late 19th and early 20th centuries?

[GOTNW]

 

Isn't it widely agreed that what we would not consider the traditional working aspects of wrestling originated in the United States in the late 19th and early 20th centuries?

Well fixed bouts based on showmanship would certainly pre-date that from my understanding so what would the "traditional working aspects" even be?

[Loss]

It's more than championships and commentary. It's the whole concept of booking and guys doing programs.

[fxnj]

Working wrestling matches goes all the way back to Ancient Greece and Rome when people would accept bribes to give up matches. If you watch the films available of stuff from the 1920's and earlier, though, you'll see matches just look like the guys are shoot wrestling until a possibly predetermined finish. I think the modern working style was invented in America around the 1920's when people got tired of watching several hour long amateur wrestling matches.