Loss Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 He sums things up pretty well here, actually. I?m getting a lot of Q and A questions asking me about current WWE and TNA booking ideas and let me say that as of right now I?ve actually TAPPED OUT and stopped watching! I am taking a break from watching wrestling in an attempt to save my sanity. This will likely only last a few weeks and I?ll keep up to date by reading online reports but all three shows RAW, SD, and Impact have with 1 segment or another pushed me over the edge. RAW: The Foley heel turn was my breaking point with this show but booking and jobbing GOD certainly contributed a great deal of stress to the proverbial camel?s back. Turning a long standing (OVER) baby face to lay out a person who has not been a meaningful part of RAW television in? forever, makes no sense to me. This is not a shot at Dreamer, just a statement to where his on camera character stand on RAW. It just seemed so forced. It was, like we know where we have to go, and there is no logical way to get there but we are going to go there anyway! SD: If it weren?t for the Benoit ? Fit Finlay match a few weeks ago, I?d have given up a lot sooner, but the continual burial of Rey Mysterio has done me in. I have never seen a baby face champion so poorly treated. He has been destroyed 4 weeks in a row. He?s doing more jobs than I did on WWE TV and he?s the World Champ! Rey is such an amazing, one in a million kind of performer, if they don?t want the title on him just beat him for the title, don?t completely destroy him and the World Title in the process. Impact: I?ve tried real hard to support this show, but the Kevin Nash interviews and pending X-Division feud has put me over the top. This may top the Rey Mysterio burial. This is as close to sabotage from within as you can get. I?m sure people within TNA will say, ?No wait, when it all plays out it will be great.? But I was told that about the Jackie Gayda angle and that went absolutely nowhere. This angle will destroy the X-Division. Just standing in the ring with Nash will hurt them, because all the guys are going to look like little kids. I should know I did it in WCW (and I?m bigger than most X division guys) remember how much that helped my credibility. If the pay off at the end of this angle is a Hogan ? Kidman type ?putting over the younger guy? type finish, someone should lose their job!! The only way this could work at all is if Nash completely sacrifices himself and gets beat handly and clean the first time out, and I don?t see that happening. I love this sport too much to watch all of this go on. I look forward to the ECW re-launch because if Heyman and Dreamer have creative control I may finally have a show I can watch without shaking my head!!!! Also note that my thoughts are not a reflection on any of the boys working on the three shows just the current creative directions. All these guys bust their ass and work hard and have my respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bruiser Chong Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Wait, Foley turned heel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted May 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 He tried, anyway. It hasn't really worked, because 2006 WWE fans don't really give a shit about Tommy Dreamer and Terry Funk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DylanWaco Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Actually it has worked reasonably well. The problem is that the fans haven't gotten behind ECW at all..but they have been booing on cue when Foley has been really working the heel tactics and verbiage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bruiser Chong Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Uh, what was the explanation behind that? Foley was the last guy I figured could ever go heel again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 The build for the Foley-Edge WM match included Edge reminding Mick that he's never had a "WrestleMania Moment" in his career yet. Foley now says their WM match was the best hardcore match ever and he doesn't want people from ECW tarnishing the term hardcore with their antics. It really was a pretty well planned turn by WWE standards, but they goofed by turning Mick heel before establishing ECW was returning (God forbid WWE promote 2 PPVs at the same time) so the crowd was pretty "WTF?" at first. I think now that the fanbase is realizing ECW is coming back (at least for ONS II) it's making more sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted May 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 I get the feeling sek is not so much calling Storm someone great as he is calling Benoit someone overrated. Is that accurate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 You may be right, but I get the feeling you're in the wrong thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted May 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 Oh. Yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest savagerulz Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 I?m a fan of Lance Storm and usually agree with what he has to say, but not this time. Mick?s heel turn is like a continuation of his ECW heel turn. It makes sense if you remember the history of Foley?s late-1995 through 1996 ECW gimmick of hating Tommy Dreamer for turning down the job he loved and wanted back (WCW). When Foley left ECW he was still in the anti-hardcore feud with Dreamer, so it only makes sense for continuity (which is rare for wrestling, I know) he?d still have a problem with Dreamer. And with Funk, they have a storied rivalry that was also linked through the Dreamer-Cactus feud (Funk turned face to stand behind Tommy Dreamer in his feud against Cactus Jack & Raven. Leading to a classic tag match.) The Funk-Foley segment was also great. I?m sure to those unaware of their ECW moments (which means most wrestling fans, since this was when ECW was basically just in PA, OH and FL.) it looked confusing, but those who got it loved it. Lance was either in SMW or Japan at the time all this took place, so he must have been one of those who missed it. But quite frankly I?m proud of the WWE writers for looking back at ECW history to relaunch it. He?s right about Rey. Rey is getting buried but I don?t care. He never should have been world champion, and him winning it cheapened the title long before he did jobs to Henry and Khali. What did Lance want? For 5?6 (yeah right) Rey to go over men who are 7 feet tall plus or close to 500 pounds clean? Sorry, Lance, but that would do more harm to wrestling than Rey jobbing as champion. Nash -- Come on, the Nash interviews were priceless. I don?t like Kevin Nash as a wrestler, but he?s one of the funniest people in the business. He was clearly making fun of himself in his interviews with Shelly, which goes against his reputation of being a egomaniac. The angle has gotten people talking, which is more than you can say about pretty much everything else that TNA has ever done, so in that regard it?s already a success. Getting beaten up by a 7 footer when you?re as small as the X Division guys isn?t embarrassing for them or going to kill their heat, it?s just realistic. In a shoot, Nash could probably take every X Division wrestler but maybe Samoa Joe and Lo-Ki (as long as he doesn?t tear a quad.) Nash is being made to look like a cowardly, delusional heel picking on guys half his size, so I fail to see how this is damaging the X Division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 I get the feeling sek is not so much calling Storm someone great as he is calling Benoit someone overrated. Is that accurate? Even though this was in the wrong thread, I feel the need to reply. I don't think Benoit's overrated, he just took advantage of the positions he was put in possibly more than anyone else in wrestling. Since most guys blow chances handed to them on silver platters, it's a testament to his character that he busted his ass in situations like in WCW where it probably didn't matter if he had his working boots on or not. WCW really never had any main even plans for Benoit until when they were trying to keep him from jumping and gave him an obvious "please don't go" title change. Benoit certainly has a bigger moveset than someone like Lance Storm, but they were both the same in terms of ability to engage a crowd for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted May 26, 2006 Report Share Posted May 26, 2006 He's way off on the Nash thing. For starters the Jackie Gayda thing went nowhere because she got pregnant. They can't really do anything about that. As far as the Nash stuff goes. The segments leading up to the PPV were great. And so far on Impact he blindsided Chris Sabin after a match and then attacked Jay Lethal after Low Ki destroyed him in a match. And during the Lethal one they made it clear that Nash wanted no part of Low Ki during that. So I think he's assuming a lot for the worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DylanWaco Posted May 27, 2006 Report Share Posted May 27, 2006 I get the feeling sek is not so much calling Storm someone great as he is calling Benoit someone overrated. Is that accurate?Even though this was in the wrong thread, I feel the need to reply. I don't think Benoit's overrated, he just took advantage of the positions he was put in possibly more than anyone else in wrestling. Since most guys blow chances handed to them on silver platters, it's a testament to his character that he busted his ass in situations like in WCW where it probably didn't matter if he had his working boots on or not. WCW really never had any main even plans for Benoit until when they were trying to keep him from jumping and gave him an obvious "please don't go" title change. Benoit certainly has a bigger moveset than someone like Lance Storm, but they were both the same in terms of ability to engage a crowd for a long time. Were they though? Watch Benoit/Sullivan from the era when Benoit supposedly wasn't very good at "connecting" with people. Did Storm ever reach a crowd with his work like that? I liked Storm alot in WCW and I even thought he had some miracolously good matches in ECW as Impact Player, but he never had people screaming and buildings shaking the way Benoit did in that match..and once again that was BEFORE Benoit supposedly "improved" his ability to connect with crowds. On the mic I think Lance is definately better than Benoit fwiw, but in terms of conveying emotion in the ring, I don't see how Lance is in the same Galaxy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted May 27, 2006 Report Share Posted May 27, 2006 Yeah, that WCW work was all Benoit because lord knows Kevin Sullivan didn't know how to get a reaction from a crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dangerous A Posted May 27, 2006 Report Share Posted May 27, 2006 Nash -- Come on, the Nash interviews were priceless. I don?t like Kevin Nash as a wrestler, but he?s one of the funniest people in the business. He was clearly making fun of himself in his interviews with Shelly, which goes against his reputation of being a egomaniac. The angle has gotten people talking, which is more than you can say about pretty much everything else that TNA has ever done, so in that regard it?s already a success. Getting beaten up by a 7 footer when you?re as small as the X Division guys isn?t embarrassing for them or going to kill their heat, it?s just realistic. In a shoot, Nash could probably take every X Division wrestler but maybe Samoa Joe and Lo-Ki (as long as he doesn?t tear a quad.) Nash is being made to look like a cowardly, delusional heel picking on guys half his size, so I fail to see how this is damaging the X Division. I'd agree with you in that so far, I don't think this angle has damaged the X Division yet. My problem with the angle is beating Kevin Nash (I'm assuming someone in the X division will be) doesn't mean a damn thing in this day and age. It's not 1996 or even 2000 anymore. A win over Nash means jack shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjh Posted May 27, 2006 Report Share Posted May 27, 2006 I?m sure to those unaware of their ECW moments (which means most wrestling fans, since this was when ECW was basically just in PA, OH and FL.) it looked confusing, but those who got it loved it.It still makes it bad booking, even if a few hardcore fans like yourself loved going down nostalgia lane, because you still left millions of TV viewers confused. I mean Vince Russo got crucified for his penchant of booking toward the Internet fans, so I don't see why Heyman and Dreamer shouldn't get criticised for doing the exact same thing. If you're going to harken back to old ECW storylines then show the old footage beforehand, so everyone knows the backstory and no-one is left confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DylanWaco Posted May 28, 2006 Report Share Posted May 28, 2006 Yeah, that WCW work was all Benoit because lord knows Kevin Sullivan didn't know how to get a reaction from a crowd. </sarcasm> Yeah, because Kevin Sullivan was super over as the fifty something badass midget who ran a freakshow in WCW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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