Mad Dog Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 Samoa Joe is a great wrestler. He's kind of average at first but he rapidly improves. His match with Homicide at Scramble Madness, I think, is a fairly good match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffey Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The first match that I saw with Samoa Joe was against Low Ki. They just kept kicking each other with pretty stiff shots. Then Samoa Joe, eventually, just collapsed from behing exhausted. That was the finish pretty much. I was thinking "who the fuck is this jobber" Several months later he was my favorite wrestler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The best are the sports entertainment rants and talking about how it's about real wrestling in RoH during one of their spotfest scramble matches. BTW I hate RoH's scramble matches. See, I think scrambles serve their purpose. I always include them in comps because they do represent a part of ROH just like the garbage matches and the spotfests aka "mat classics". I do agree completely that they should give the SE crap a rest. It is hard to take them seriously when moments before a decent match, Teddy Hart does a super-triple-flip with a 540 rotation off the top of a cage. Then three minutes later, the guy he hit bounces up and does something equally as absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 My other beef with the early shows was they gave the Christopher Street Connection a ton of screen time and they didn't even get into the ring until the 6th or 7th show. That and they should've pushed them when they got massively over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Metal Maniac Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The first match that I saw with Samoa Joe was against Low Ki. They just kept kicking each other with pretty stiff shots. Then Samoa Joe, eventually, just collapsed from behing exhausted. That was the finish pretty much. The finish of the match would have been a thousand times better had it been Ki who collapsed. First, I thought it looked silly for a guy Ki's size to be no-selling a guy Joe's size, especially since Joe was brought in to "take out" Ki or something like that. Secondly, they would have been able to have had a good rematch, with Ki being the uber-underdog who almost got killed by Joe last time, but is back for revenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 I think a match similar to the Ron Killings/Low Ki match from TNA would've come off well in that situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Some Guy Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The first match that I saw with Samoa Joe was against Low Ki. They just kept kicking each other with pretty stiff shots. Then Samoa Joe, eventually, just collapsed from behing exhausted. That was the finish pretty much. The finish of the match would have been a thousand times better had it been Ki who collapsed. First, I thought it looked silly for a guy Ki's size to be no-selling a guy Joe's size, especially since Joe was brought in to "take out" Ki or something like that. Secondly, they would have been able to have had a good rematch, with Ki being the uber-underdog who almost got killed by Joe last time, but is back for revenge. I was thinking the same thing. Joe is twice Ki's size, way stronger, and his gimmick was to be a hired hitman. Too bad he failed miserably in his attempts to take out Low Ki. The little bit of Ki I've seen tells me that he doesn't think much of the whole selling aspect of the business, you know the part that puts asses in seats and heat on matches. The Ki vs. Red match that this thread is based on is, to use Al Snow's analogy on lucha like watching a fireworks display. The crowd ooed and awed for the kicks but there was nothing in between that meant anything. I still haven't gotten through the Joe/Punk series, I keep falling asleep on the matches. That is not because of the matches but usually because I've been making comps until 2:00 am and then toss in the DVD when I'm half asleep. I think they are hurt a little bit by neither guy really being a heel or a face. At one point in Joe/Punk 1 they try to one up each other by seeing who can be a bigger dick to a straight edge fan. This was done to kill time because they were going an hour but it was sort of pointless, as it accomplished nothing in terms of securing a certain crowd reaction for either guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The funny thing was that Low Ki was quite the seller in TNA and got massively over as an underdog. Though he went to Japan in the fall of 2002, got a big head and became very difficult to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted May 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 I wonder if some of that is a work to attempt to get over his heel turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 I would believe more of the opposite. He's been a problem well before his heel turn. RoH had trouble bringing him back in late 2003 because he was refusing to job. He also works for far fewer indies than he used to and he doesn't have near the positive press he used to. I think it's more he's become a huge mark for himself like Teddy Hart is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Metal Maniac Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 The little bit of Ki I've seen tells me that he doesn't think much of the whole selling aspect of the business I've heard the same complaint about Ki, and it is understandable. However, I just wanted to point out that I'm fine with him selling less then he should against guys of his size or smaller. I think it's part of his gimmick - not the size of the fighter, but the size of the fight he brings, kinda thing. So if he's in there with another cruiser, and he no-sells a strike, that's one thing. But when he does it against heavyweights, that's another thing entirely. Something else that just popped into my head, about the commentary; they sure seem(ed) to like sucking Lo-Ki's dick. I recall watching...I believe it was the final match of the Round Robin, and American Dragon got Lo-Ki with a double chickenwing, you know, so he could force him to the ground and in to the Cattle Mutilation. As Dragon is trying to force Ki down, the announcers are creaming themselves, and talking about how impressive Lo-Ki's muscles look as he tries to fight against it. This wouldn't have bothered me, if not for the fact that American Dragon's arms looked to be literally twice the size of Lo-Ki's at the time. I dunno, it just seemed silly to me; it'd be like going on about "look at the height of Mike Awesome!" while he was in the ring with Nash, know what I mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted May 9, 2005 Report Share Posted May 9, 2005 It isn't that Ki doesn't believe in selling, it is that he doesn't sell very well. If you are talking about the strike exchange no-sells, I think that was a bad habit alot of the ROH guys picked up from watching some bad Japanese stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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