Loss

What's your take on the following? The WM lineup Fit Finlay's comeback The ROH v CZW feud

>>7/24/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Rey Misterio Jr. (WWE Great American Bash) This is hard to say, but I didn't think this was a spectacular match that should be talked about as a MOTY contender. I enjoyed it, mainly because I think the Eddy/Rey/Dominic angle was terrific, but that's really all this match is -- a showcase of the angle. There's hints of a match for 30 seconds at a time, but it's mostly Eddy standing outside staring at Dominic. Best part for me was Rey nearly ending up in tears after every false finish. >>8/13/05 Low Ki/Homicide vs. Joe/Lethal (ROH) Very good match, made excellent by the post-match brawl, which is probably the most heated, engaging thing I've ever seen in ROH. Out of this world. Ki and 'Cide are the best heels you'll find on the indy circuit from what I can tell, because you get the feeling they really believe in what they're doing. I like Jimmy Rave a lot, but some of his stuff still seems like an act. Anyway, Joe constantly coming to the rescue of his partner and his partner surprisingly holding his own as the match continued was great. I'm sure some didn't like the DQ finish, but they more than made up for it with the post-match brawl. There are other matches like Danielson/Gibson and Danielson/Aries that are probably better than this one, but there is a certain sameness to a lot of the ROH matches that are on this set after a while (all the Danielson matches specifically start looking exactly alike). This stood out for being unique. >>8/21/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Rey Misterio Jr. (WWE Summerslam) LOVED this match. I think this may be the best ladder match WWE has ever done, or very close. It was still very much a Rey/Eddy match in terms of the spots and the story being told. The ladder didn't swallow the match whole like we sometimes see with other pairings like Benoit/Jericho or Hardyz/E & C. And unlike the Bash, the storyline didn't swallow the match whole either. I really like the outside interference in this case and felt like it added to the drama of the match, with the wives and Dominic all showing surprisingly great acting skills. Is there some type of law in the universe that every Guerrero, whether through bloodlines or being married into the family, has to have good instincts for wrestling? Dominic is a better actor than at least half of the WWE roster. They did a lot of the typical WWE ladder spots, so there wasn't really anything new or inventive here, but I just really enjoyed the way everything came together. The whole storyline and series of matches would have been doomed to fail with any two other guys being given it, but these two made it work, and they made it work within the context of a wrestling match. Eddy is missed.

>>9/17/05 Gibson vs. Danielson (ROH) This is the first title change match from ROH that I've happened to catch the whole time I've been watching, as the rest have eluded me. I wouldn't call this my favorite ROH match, but it just might be the best I've seen. Danielson coming back with a clear head ready to conquer the world and having to overcome a guy who wrestles a very similar style connected with me. Again, very believable, and it's nice to know Gibson is always a health insurance claim away from being able to wrestle more matches like this. >>2/16/05 Kawada vs. Kojima (All Japan) Wow. Fantastic match. Now obviously, I haven't seen Kawada week in and week out in years, but this match at least shows that he's still able of stepping up in a big match situation and delivering. Based on the way some people talk about him, I thought he'd be horrible at this stage. This is another title change, like Gibson/Danielson, that I thought was foreshadowed really well, with Kojima put in some pretty vulnerable positions where he managed to overcome all of them. The finish with Kojima putting everything he had left into that lariat, knowing his time was now or never, was great. >>4/25/05 Kenta Kobashi/Go Shioski vs. Jun Akiyama/Genichiro Tenryu (NOAH) Go Shioski is the World's Greatest Terry Daniels (anyone who saw the DVDVR WWF set will know what I mean by that). I don't think this match flowed all that well, because there were a lot of awkward pauses, but the general layout of the match was strong enough that it really didn't matter. Poor Tenryu - I've never seen anyone bleed like that from chops. They teased the Kobashi/Tenryu encounter really well early on and had the entire audience roaring by the time they finally interacted, with Tenryu taunting Kobashi on the apron and throwing his drink at him. Call it a hunch, but I think those chops made him regret doing so. Tenryu is a freak of nature, still going strong in 2005. Akiyama does nothing for me, but I did like the finish a lot, because Shioski kicked out when you expected him to lose, and he did eventually lose, but was protected in doing so. Nice match. >>7/9/05 CM Punk vs. Roderick Strong (ROH) Fun watching Punk try to be Ric Flair, but it's a shame it didn't work with the audience. This has to be the single worst crowd I've ever seen for a wrestling match, mocking it the entire time with the "yay-boo-yay-boo" stuff. I did like that Punk had the jet black hair and a different look, and this angle was a really good way to get some milage out of him on the way out the door. I think this would have been better with 10 minutes shaved off; it's the quintessential Worldwide main event with someone nowhere near the champ on the totem pole putting in a surprisingly good showing. Those types of matches usually don't need more than 15 minutes. >>7/23/05 AJ Styles vs. Jimmy Rave (ROH) Who is this guy that calls himself AJ Styles and where is he the rest of the time? Far from the best ROH match ever, but this very well may be my favorite (opposite of Danielson/Gibson). Lots of hate and blood and fire, and some have complained about the finish, but considering that Styles is an attraction in ROH and Jimmy Rave is a regular, it made sense to me. Never thought I'd make this comparison with him, but Styles is Buzz Sawyer-lite, with the look of insanity and the 5 million consecutive headbutts. I am so burned out on table spots anymore, but I really liked the one in this match, and the brainbuster on the chair was fucking brutal. Really good batch of matches. Second half of Disc 3 (Rey v Eddy twice!) soon.

And yes, re-reading the review, it's a little ... EXTREME. I think I've mellowed in the past year.

Not saying there's a proper reaction. Just saying that I prefer fans that are buying what they're being sold, and I don't get that feeling from a lot of ECW. There's no "right" or "wrong", but I just don't care for it. It's like an audience full of Vince Russos.

Bill Watts' wife owns the Mid South library and sells it through UniversalWrestling.com. As far as your demands to WWE, I don't think Vince posts here (unless he's savagerulz ).

I'm curious Will. Did you dislike the "head dropping" style because it was dangerous to the workers, or did you feel that those moves were being done at the expensive of more sound, mat based psychological wrestling moves? I disliked that sort of thing, but not really for the reasons you stated. The problem is that earlier in the decade, AJ was all about using what they had at their disposal to engage the audience in a story, and later, it just became about pulling them in through headdropping, which just felt cheap compared to what they were doing before.

>>1/30/05 Mistico vs. Averno (CMLL) Really dug this one a lot. I still like Mistico despite the criticisms, but it was obvious Averno was carrying him here. Kind of a hybrid of an old match from the Crockett days on TBS and the AJPW style, which really surprised me. This crowd is so much better than the one wherever the Mistico/UG match took place. I like that crowd too, but the constant horn blowing drowns out any audience pops that may or may not be there. Anyway, this atmosphere is like a much larger armory or TV studio with teenage trash making synchronized chants and the random zoom-ins to fans dressed up like their favorites in the audience. Reminded me of the Flair fans that always wore sunglasses and suits. Teases of the powerbomb early in the match and the delivery later reminded me a lot of AJPW. I need to see more Averno, because I really, really dug him here. My new favorite match of the set thus far. >>2/12/05 Samoa Joe vs. Super Dragon (PWG) Sorry. I didn't get why it was included at all. >>6/11/05 Samoa Joe vs. Necro Butcher (IWA-MS) Loved this A LOT. I don't know if IWA Mid South always has atmosphere like this or not, but this was really great and lent itself to a great spectacle in the ring. Joe/Necro may not be Joe/Punk in terms of a pairing, but I might like Joe/Necro better in some ways just because it's so unique and the drama was just off the charts. Necro is insane to be taking some of those spots. I don't know if I'd like him against anyone else or not, but against Samoa Joe, it works really well. I have to ask though -- what's up with the Rob Naylor references? >>6/26/05 Angle vs. Michaels (WWE Vengeance) I understand why it was included, as some would have stated it should have been there if it wasn't, but there just wasn't anything here for me. Finish was done better on TV with Shelton Benjamin a few months prior, and all the good stuff I liked in the Mania match was either repeated here to less effect or was completely missing. Not my cup of Lipton. >>7/18/05 KENTA vs Kanemuru (NOAH) >>7/18/05 Jun Akiyama/Makato Hashi vs. Naomichi Marufuji/Minoru Suzuki (NOAH) >>7/18/05 Kobashi vs. Sasaki (NOAH) Believe it or not, this is the first NOAH footage I've ever seen. All good stuff mostly, but I noticed a pattern -- the first half of the first two matches were really boring, and the last half was really good. The tag match was really uneven, with a few good moments, but KENTA/Kanemaru turned into a very good match as it went on. The only problem I have with juniors matches at this stage is that the 90s were so good for juniors wrestling that it's going to take something really extraordinary to stand out after seeing so much good stuff. Not a knock on this match, it's just that this match didn't really fit that mold. Kobashi/Sasaki was better than I expected. I wouldn't say that was a must-see classic either, but in terms of working a main event style in front of such a ginormous crowd, this was definitely epic feeling. This would suck in front of an indy-sized crowd, though, and definitely wouldn't work in any environment. Not really great in the traditional sense, but not a "gold-plated piece of crap" either. I liked it, but in a pulp novel kind of way. >>9/11/05 Samoa Joe Vs. Christopher Daniels Vs. AJ Styles (TNA Unbreakable) I'm convinced that somewhere, this match is still going. I don't really care for spotfests, but if there's going to be one, wrapping it up in 15 minutes is usually a good idea. WCW understood that well, TNA doesn't. The problem with matches like this is that when it's over, you can't really remember anything that happened, what the finish was, or much of anything, because it's all about that particular moment and wowing the crowd for a half hour. I guess that's okay, but again, it's not my style. Still need to watch Gibson/Danielson from Disc 2 and Tenzan/Kojima from Disc 1, then I'll move on to Disc 3.

Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. I think this is my all-time favorite wrestling moment, just because it shocked me so much at the time.

Hard to say. It's either Mid South or Memphis for me, but I'm not sure which one.

I'll get back to it. I'm just not in the mood right now to watch such a long match.

Michaels v Angle from Wrestlemania Better than I remember it being, but damn, this is really frustrating. Kind of a great, then bad, then good, then bad, then good, then bad match. Loved: Opening 8 minutes -- Relentless matwork from Shawn, frustration from Angle, Shawn using the short-arm scissors to throw Angle off his game ... really awesome Hated: Attempts at table spots on the floor followed by Angle slam into turnbuckle Loved: Struggle for both to get to their feet in the center of the ring at the same time after the double TKO; really terrific visual Hated: The weird-ass moonsault onto the table Loved: Shawn's look of regret after lowblowing Angle Hated: Shawn spending 3 hours in the anklelock Also, why do WWE matches always have to have so many double TKO spots? Isn't one per match enough? Anyway, also watched Jay/Lethal from 5/7/05, and it's easily my favorite match so far. Joe is obviously the favorite, but Lethal seemed like he might pull it off, and Joe wrestled at a disadvantage for most of the match because of the Code of Honor stuff. Really believable wrestling with believable false finishes and a crowd that really got into the spectacle of it all. I really liked the teacher/student aspect as well, and what was cool about it was that Lethal seemed to know Joe better than Joe knew Lethal. I want to see more matches featuring these two.

Ok, watched Danielson/Spanky from 04/02/05, ROH. A million problems with this match. This is probably my least favorite Bryan Danielson match I've ever seen. For all the talk about how far ROH has come since 2002, this is the most 2002-ish match I can recall them doing in the past couple of years. This is part of a tournament and it's not the final, but it's wrestled like the final. That's problem one. Problem two is that Danielson is so far above Spanky that any attempts to make the match seem competitive just don't work at all, because it's impossible to buy Spanky standing toe to toe with Danielson. Then, there's Danielson doing a long Airplane spin and both guys immediately doing top rope move after top rope move without a problem. And Danielson dismantling Spanky's arm and torso really means nothing when all of Spanky's comebacks involve using his arms to balance himself on the top rope, and spinning elbows. Subtlety can be cool, but it should still be somewhat obvious to anyone paying attention. And when Mark Nulty is talking about the smirk on Danielson's face and how he's enjoying this, when that look is nowhere to be found on Danielson's face, it's just silly. You know, from a mechanical standpoint of working a body part and it playing into the finish, this may be a "better" match by the standards of many than Mistico/Ultimo Guerrero, but I'd rather the Mistico/UG match a million times over, and all that watching these two matches back to back did was show me that while Danielson is terrific and I enjoy watching him almost all the time, he's not the best wrestler in the world, and he still has a long way to go before he can reasonably be talked about in that category. As for Kendrick, he's just a younger, faster version of 2005 Shawn Michaels with his flying forearm comebacks and love for dives off the top rope. You either like that or you don't, and I really don't care for it.

I just received this set and skimmed it all for VQ and was very impressed. I know GH had suggested at one point that someone be weary if they plan on watching the set on a big screen TV, but I'm watching on a 52" screen with no VQ issues or pixelation at all, and I've scanned all the discs and watched about five seconds of every match. Only match I've had a chance to watch so far is Mistico/Ultimo Guerrero from 2/26/05 from CMLL, as I had about 15 minutes to spare this morning and knew I'd have time for it. It's a very good match, but I don't know if I'd consider it a contender for MOTY. Nothing wrong with it so much, it's just what it is. Clever is the best word I'd use to describe this, with UG outsmarting himself and showing a complete lack of restraint, which leads to Mistico winning in two straight falls. I'm just getting acquainted with lucha (although honestly, after watching Estrada/Cruz from 10/22/89 this weekend and the trios match from the same date, it's really the only style of wrestling I want to watch for a while, aside from this set anyway) and something really clicked with me just recently that has really made me appreciate the style more than I did in the past. The best thing I can say for this match is that while there will most likely be better matches on this set, I'm glad this was included, because the way it's worked is so smart and it's not something a lot of the younger guys featured on the set may be able to pull off at this stage of their careers. There's often a lot of talk about Mistico's high flying, which I'm sure is impressive, although it's not really showcased here. Ultimo Guerrero was the star of this match to me, with the really great characterizations and over-the-top animation. He also has the way cool fallaway slam/pinning combo from the top rope that I love. I beg you all -- give lucha a chance. It admittedly took some time for me to really get into, but it's quickly becoming my favorite style of wrestling there is, and you all know how I feel about the American Southern style. This isn't even a great match, and there are probably just as many matches in CMLL that aren't as there are that are, but there's something redeeming in every match I've watched from CMLL at this point, and this is another example of that. More later.

Flair actually said to Carlito, in 2006, on a recent Mississippi: "They don't like nappy-headed, gay Puerto Ricans in Mississippi." Wow.

Strangely, you know what I think would get Cena over as a heel more than anything, although it's not likely to happen? Chris Jericho coming back for revenge after Cena cost him his job.

Thing is, you can be a monster and still sell. That's my problem with Norton -- that he never seems to do so.

I really like that scenario, Dangerous A. With HBK going part time and HHH taking time off, RAW might even be fresh for a couple of months, although that's probably when they'd panic and bring back Hogan or bring Shawn back to do his semi-annual program. And yeah, it's a house of cards just begging to be knocked over when HHH comes back. But a top feud of RVD/Rey (former tag champs, now the top two babyfaces) against Carlito and a freshly turned Cena would be interesting at least. RVD and Cena would have some really ass matches, but the promos where RVD can point out that he never got the opportunity Cena got and the fans never turned on him would work really well.

If HHH *really* wanted to have the crowd rioting, he'd have Stephanie out with him, but Stephanie is due around the time of the PPV I think.

Um, my response was a direct response to your post, Slasher.

I have no doubts RVD will win if they do the match. I'm just really intrigued by what the announcers will say and how the crowd will react to HHH, and how he'll react to that. Unbelievable.

Apparently, the current plan, according to Meltzer on WOL sometime back, is RVD/HHH in the main event for the belt. Okay, now THAT'S something I want to see, just because I can't imagine what types of chants the mutants are going to come up with for HHH. So, I thought we'd use this thread to make predictions.