Dylan Waco

Minor note, but Kroffat was really good at times in dying days Montreal and Puerto Rico. When I'm looking at tie breakers that could help him

Bigelow is helped by the big ECW matches, but hurt if you watched everything like I did. Tajiri makes my ballot on the strength of ECW. So does Scorp really. Smothers is also helped.

I like Atlantis, but I'm not sure id have him as a top 15 luchador

I figured I would post this here for my own sake, but also because others might find it useful. Here are things I want to brush up on before the vote in order of importance to me: 1. Pre-1980 wrestling (excepting Portland where I have seen all of the 70's footage fairly recently, and to a slightly lesser extent WWWF). 2. Joshi 3. 90's Lucha 4. FMW 5. U.S. Indies (really selected matches more than anything) 6. 00's Japan (see U.S. Indies) 7. Europe

I think if we had more Blackwell footage he'd have a reasonable shot of rating ahead of Vader for me on the big man category. As it stands it would be hard to do, but it's worth noting that even the few throwaway studio and arena matches of his we have from the 70's are either really good or really fun, with him doing a lot of different stuff than what we saw just a few years later. Probably the craziest bumper of all time if you adjust for weight/body type. Great brawler, very good highspots for a guy his size, really good selling, equally good as both a face and a heel, and really great about timing and building to big spots and moments over the course of a match. I would put his best stuff from the AWA set (plus the Mulligan match from MACW, the Lawler match from Memphis and the Butch Reed match from St. Louis t.v.) up against the best stuff from any second tier guy in the 80's. Hard to say where he will rate, but he'll rate.

His stock dropped with me after watching the SMW and ECW. His best stuff from each stuff was great, but he did not have the hidden gems a guy like that needs to break through. I do think he was sort of the master of the bullshit four-to-five minute match both as a guy working on top and a guy getting squashed. And there is a Whipwreck match from a fancam that everyone should watch to see what Candido could be capable of on his best nights. But really he was a guy who had a lot of the tools but never quite put them together and damn sure never got real opportunities.

Right there with Colon v. Hansen for top feuds that never get talked about from the 80s. FWIW, the match did really good business on the house show loop as a co-main event often paired with Andre/friend v. Patera/Studd

Can't see it, and I have a real soft spot for the guy. Way too many off nights, mixed in with admittedly great performances. Offhand the only guy I can think of who has guaranteed a spot on my list in large part because of their post-2002 Japanese work is Dick Togo, though I may be forgetting someone

In what fantasy world did I say that Kerry was damaged as a worker by the footage explosion? In fact I said the exact opposite - Kerry's status as a worker is underrated, but we have so much more footage, showcasing so many other guys, that it is really hard for me to see Kerry as a top hundred guy because the pool is deeper. It's not that Kerry has been hurt because the performances we now have of him show him to be less than we thought, it's that we now have easy access to footage from guys that were barely even on the radar then.

It didn't convince me he was a top thirty guy. That is hardly an insult.

I want to go back and watch more of his indie stuff. Unlike Phil I did think he was the best guy in the World last year so that is something to build on, especially because he was also the best wrestler in the world for the first four months of this year. I could see finding a spot for a guy like him on my ballot if a fair amount of his indie work stacks up.

Hey if you have him over most of those guys you have him over most of those guys. I just haven't seen anything even bordering on a compelling case for him to be rated with more than a couple of those guys, and that is coming from someone who liked the write up you did a ton.

After watching some dying days WCW recently, I actually think Luger's post-prime is vastly better than people give it credit for. It's not that he was great, but with the exception of his uninspired WWF stint, I think even post 91/92 he was still an entertaining worker a fair amount of the time, and was often putting in far more effort than his situation merited. That sort of thing goes a long way with me, especially in a setting as dysfunctional as WCW where the top guys all coasted to one degree or another. I DOUBT he would make my list. I just don't think he has enough. But I still think his run in 89 is as good a run as I've ever seen for a guy who wasn't pegged into the top slot.

Could make the bottom level of my list easily. I think all things considered he was the best guy on the Texas set. What I love about Hayes is that he made his awkwardness a positive in his matches, which is not something that everyone can do. He was really the master of the short sprint (country whipping match, LLT cage match with Kerry, awesome sprint from 88 v. Buddy Roberts, et.), no bullshit one of the best I've ever seen at it. He was also much better as a face than you would think and I feel he was at least a good worker from at least 82-89. Falling off a cliff with Jimmy Jam won't help him when I'm making cuts, but I have a soft spot for guys who have been unfairly shit on for years because of people parroting nonsense

I am not planning on shitting on Dick (ew) but that I think the idea that he is an obvious top thirty guy is pretty rich. To me there are very, very few obvious guys I could put at that level, and virtually everyone of them has a much stronger resume of matches than Murdoch does. To test Will and other Murdoch advocates a bit where does Murdoch rate compared to Misawa, Kobashi, Jumbo, Liger, Hansen, Bockwinkel, Flair, Tenryu, Casas, Santo, Dandy, Satanico, Fujiwara, Fujinami, Regal, Eddie, Rey, Savage, Lawler, Dundee, Choshu, Vader, Buddy Rose, Akiyama, Taue, Breaks, Funk, Hashimoto, Finlay, Morton, Bryan and Race? I'm not saying this is my top thirty-something, but these are the sort of people Murdoch has to be seen as the equal to, or superior of, to get into the top tier. Does he fit into this group?

Brunzell is worth considering. Phil needs to drag over some Black Terry reviews

Corino should have been a top fifty worker of all time, but timing killed him. As it stands he did very well with what he had, but isn't someone I can see on a list

I love Eaton, and think you could make a case that Eaton was potentially a better wrestler than Morton, but I don't vote on potential. Morton is the best sympathy babyface of all time, to the point where "playing Ricky Morton" is an established part of the wrestling vernacular. I would actually listen to an argument for Morton in someones top ten. He was that good at what he did. Eaton was also outstanding, but he wasn't a role defining wrestler. Having said that I could watch those two put on their show at Halloween Havoc 90 a thousand times and never get sick of it. In a way it's a shame they never had a prolonged singles feud

Brock would have to have at least a half dozen more out of this world matches for me to consider him strongly and I say that as a fan of the guy. Han is different both because I've never seen a bad Han match, and because he really was the master of a style - and an incredibly difficult style at that.

I'm not sure he is arguing that Edge is versatile, but rather a weird mashup of disparate elements

When on earth did Brody trade holds with the best of them?

If Benoit had never been in main events/pushed near the top of the cards does he get in? I do to know the answer to that for sure, but what I do know is that no person in doesn't have complimentary arguments to go along with work. There are no William Regals or Virus' in the Hall of Fame

There has never been a candidate selected on work alone. Taue wouldn't be either.

Actually the only time I thought Angle was the bully jock was during his WWECW phase - which was also the last time I thought he was any good.

I'm bumping this because Orton is a guy that is loved by other wrestlers, and often talked about as a great hand. I definitely think he was a good worker, but I've never understood what about him was equal to the praise he gets from some old timers. I would be interested to see if anyone here has a laundry list of matches and/or a meaningful write up they could/would make on Orton.