smkelly

"while one of the writers sacrifices his dignity with gusto by slathering oil on his repulsive, 300 pound frame and parades about in a G-String" "The more physically demanding style combined with the mainstream knowledge that pro wrestling is a complete work means they now have to hit each other twice as hard to get half the response. Careers last 5 or 10 years instead of 20 or 30." *Most of my responses are quotes so no need to cry over this, SLL* *Oh, and I apologize to those in power round these parts, as this post has little to do with wrestling* SLL, let me get this straight, because I have never seen six out of the eight films you quoted, thus not catching them, and one of the ones I had seen and didn't recognize the quotes, I am slow. That is brilliant logic. I am hoping you're not an educator like Goodhelmet, parent teacher conferences must be a real treat. "Can you believe this, I used material your child didn't know and failed them for it." You're a harsher judge than the superego. Oh, go through my post again, for someone who says I am slow for missing quotes you missed some yourself. Did you know prior to this that I had watched the movie? Again, you're judging unfairly and incompetently without qualification. I love your definitions, absolutely worth every second of my life. This, this right here. That signifies your pussified internet message board geekdom. Either that or you yourself are porcine, or you have married a Sus scrofa like woman. Only fat people get defensive when fat people are mocked or a McDonald's executive but I forgot you're a saint. Your inclinations are never detrimental, never bad. I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning that's as good as they're going to feel all day. You write as though the world is pure, that society is respectable. What do you know of life, or society for that matter? You write as though you have served in the armed forces, that you have been deployed to wretched places. Have you ever laced up a pair of combat boots and stood on the ready line? Have you watched as human beings are being smuggled as goods in exchange for drugs and munitions? Have you watched a city crumble from Mother Nature and the survivors resort to barbarism? What have you seen that makes you think that the world is a gracious and decent place? You must be a troglodyte. Because in a world this execrable, how could you have overflowing optimism and the audacity to criticize a movement that would only improve society, what is so great about society? Whatever you're high on, I would like to place an order. Oh, to relate to the notion of my disdain for the chubbies, I blame brainwashing from the military. A Marine is not allowed to be fat. It is a disgrace to the uniform and because...gasp...it is unhealthy. Your blind acceptance to this issue will not help anyone. Hmm…?But being a, what you'd call, an "obsessive and creepy" wrestling fan is kosher? Don't deny that you watch more wrestling than anything else in your life, if that's what you want to call it. You think I don't realize I could have used a better fat quote then that. It does come across as unsympathetic and morally reprehensible. Nevertheless, even if I apologize for such actions, my words will not mean anything to you, as your words and actions mean nothing to me. I mustn't have realized how sensitive of a crowd that posts here, judging by how wet in the pants SLL got by the inclusion of the quoted material. Drawing a correlation between using a quote and performing a barbaric act of murder is appalling and outright laughable to consider. You laugh at me because I'm strange I laugh at you because you're stupid! Tragedy is when I cut my finger, Comedy is when you fall into an open sewer and die. Don't be humble - you are not that great.You're attempting to say that the WWF knew about Umaga's illness prior to his death. Can you prove this, or is it another unfair incompetent judging from the almighty saint SLL? I get it though man; you hate the WWF - WELCOME TO THE CLUB. Beat another horse why don't cha. I think William Shakespeare was the wisest human being I ever heard of. To be perfectly frank, though, that's not saying much. We are impossibly conceited animals, and actually dumb as heck. Ask any teacher. You don't even have to ask a teacher. Ask anybody. Dogs and cats are smarter than we are. What undeniable evidence do you possess, or that of which you have found can substantially prove your assumptions? Nevertheless, in all seriousness, what you're asking for is a boss who constantly walks around the locker room or boardroom asking people if they're okay. Are you okay man, is that neck hurting, can I help you in any way? Do you need counseling or rehab for your drug habits?You have already shown you're ignorance to the real workings of society with your fluffed optimism, but now you are degrading men as tissue boxes that need comforting. I could carve a better man out of a banana. You still fail to accept the fact that Umaga is the primary reason he is deceased. He made the choice to continue wrestling. He made the choice to abuse his body in unnatural ways. If it comes out that he was mentally incapacitated like Benoit, I will retract my statements; I do not possess the evidence to counter my current thought though. I do place blame upon the WWF's shoulders though, I have even said that, but it isn't good enough for you. I still place blame upon the shoulders of his family and friends and co-workers. Look at what the media did to the parents of the Colombian students who massacred their classmates. The parents were blamed, and rightfully so. Umaga was a grown man, why would his company be solely responsible for his own actions and harmful vices? You haven't given an answer to that yet. Why wouldn't blame be attributed to his friends and co-workers, let alone his family? Are we not responsible for any of our actions or decisions, or is there always someone else to blame for our mishaps and transgressions? If you answer yes, how do you not accept the fact that Umaga was in control of his life and decided to destroy it, thus he is to blame above all else? Tell me why.We are dealing with the best-educated generation in history. But they've got a brain dressed up with nowhere to go. Everyone knows the associated risks, knows what it does - but nothing is ever done. Is it okay for people to become obese? Why is it okay if you answer yes? Is it okay for America to pay billions of dollars every year in health care for people who cannot take care of themselves because they are obese and refuse to lose weight and become healthier? Obesity is killing an untold amount of people in the United States every year. Deaths ranging from strokes, heart attacks, cancer, suicide and normal accidents, let alone diabetes. Is it okay that healthy people have to pay for the unhealthy because of their poor choices in life? What kind of example is that setting for future generations? I suppose that you are an advocate for felons and inmates receiving fair treatment i.e. more rights than their victims and having better health coverage than the normal law abiding citizen does. I can only imagine your stance on military combat, or the police's force continuum. For being apolitical, you sure are a bleeding hearted liberal. No worries though SLL, don't think of yourself as an ugly person, just a beautiful monkey. I am utilitarian in my moral philosophy; I want most people to be as happy as humanly possible. Imagine the relief of many people had they never gained the extra person in weight, or lost that amount of weight. Do you not want people to be happy, SLL? You take my dislike of obese people and spin it to sound as though I'd take a flamethrower to the world. How many lives would be saved if obesity were cut in half? Imagine that. Saving a life is an experience a person will never forget. I thought you were an old dead guy? Want to know what my iceberg is, what it really is? Yep, I have no idea that which I am, where my path may lead, etc ad nauseam. You use obsession like "the". Unbalanced exaggerations, unfairly judging, pseudo psych evaluations, narcissistic in presentation with overemphasis on nurturing the diseased and obese - to anti-authoritative and namby-pamby - what is being presented is a keyboard crusader. You are filled with extraordinary ideas but what contributions do you provide for society - do you donate your time and energy for abused teens, or help the homeless find suitable places to live? What do you do with your talent besides trying to tear apart a fellow poster? I cited the professions of being a steel worker and a Marine for one primary reason, because the three very different career paths hold one fundamental core correlation. All jobs possess risks, a Red Light District street walker could be mugged or beaten or raped or murdered or contract an STD, and the risks are known. If she dies, is it her pimps fault for lack of protection? No. If a professional baseball pitcher takes a line drive to the side of the face and it kills him – is it the teams fault, manager, pitching coach, general manager's faults? No. If a Su Chef slips and falls in the deep freezer while carrying a chef's knife and impales himself and dies – is it the restaurants fault that he was negligent of his own personal safety and the rules and regulations of the company? No. You still fail to grasp the concept of what I am arguing. I mention being a Marine and you take a back alley approach; I mention a steel worker and you talk about scaffolding and nets. I knew the risks of joining the Marine Corps., did I know that I would be shot three times and suffer a heat stroke? No. Can I blame the Marine Corps. or the Armed Forces or the American Government for my mangled arm and destroyed body? No. I knew the risks and signed the dotted line anyway in spite of the risks and probability that I would be deployed. One of my best friends died from falling off a high-rise structure in New York City after 9/11. It was a purely accidentally fall, no incompetence was found. He too knew the risks off working hundreds of feet above ground, but he too also spited the associated risks and worked anyway. That is my point all along. Sure, some attributed blame can be given on the part of the WWF, but it is unfair and illogical to put the ball in their court solely when Umaga consciously made the choice to be a professional wrestler and continue sacrificing his body for a paycheck and to entertain his fans. When I was shot, I originally blamed the government for taking us to war. But I realized that it was I who wanted to be deployed, wanted to go to war. If there was anyone to blame, it was I. My friend held a similar methodology as I do, he wouldn’t have blamed the company he was being contracted through for his tragic demise. He would have had enough guts to admit that blame rested solely on his shoulders. In the end, I could be eating my words. If Umaga's brain is found to be as damaged as Benoit's, as unlikely as it is, he would be an incompetent person who legally, shouldn't be allowed to make decisions for themselves. In that case, sole blame would lie upon the chests of his employers and still, his closest friends would be half-owners of the blame.

Firstly and most importantly, it is the problem of the wrestler. They have in fact chosen a career with few ups and years of unpleasant downs. Like I chose to be a Marine, having the forethought that I could very well die, and not always die from combat or from enemies, it wouldn’t be fair to blame the military for my death if I was to die in combat – I voluntarily joined. Men who choose to be ironworkers and work a few hundred feet off the ground, it is their choice to risk their lives on a daily basis – they volunteered. Of course I have resentment towards the institutions that harbor these men and women to perform for me and indirectly allow them to shorten their lives. It is the same kind of resentment that mothers and fathers, brothers and sisters, friends and family have towards the military when their Marine/soldier/air men/sailor dies in combat or in training. They are looking for a source to blame other than the actual person to be blamed, the person who chose to defend their country. Sure, that sounds fucked up especially coming from a Marine, but that’s life and reality. None of my other hobbies does it either, wrestling is just a fucked up industry. Fujinami has always been old school. Moreover, you’re obviously just looking at New Japan – think All Japan when Choshu came aboard and started the movement of spot/spot/spot ad nauseam until the finishing sequence. You contradict yourself nicely in the middle of this diatribe. The industry is in a crisis because what was the new fade (strong style & head dropping) has become passé, worn and faded, they (puro) are in need of something new to revitalize their crippled industry. They are desensitized to head drops; they need something new and fresh to rekindle their desires and applauses. Misawa could be all about nostalgia, and juniors aren’t supposed to be the main event in Japan, it isn’t Mexico or the North East United States. Shinjiro Ohtani and Jushin Liger were two of the best juniors New Japan had to offer in the 90s, and they were never consistently successful when placed in the main event slot – hell Ohtani sucked ass as a heavy. I never say the WWE, so that could have confused you. I should have placed a comma after the 80s as well, another possible confusion. I wasn’t talking about wrestling in the 80s, I was saying if wrestlers (today) wrestled as they did in the 80s the fans would chant boring. Therefore, your dribbling insults afterward are in effect, canceled. And…what’s your point? I didn’t say the opposite of that, now did I? Simply pointing out: independent promotions like the leading US promotion gives the rabid fans that attend their shows the ultra violence they want, mainly stiffer than normal exchanges and dangerous looking suplexes. That is an original point of mine – the fans crave something and they get it.However, I believe what you’re alluding to is that because a promotion such as ROH features the strong style and head drops and hasn’t become a worldwide corporation like the WWF so it isn’t truly relevant that all fans want those similar qualities in their promotion. One person compared to how many others that look like male models?Yokozuna got over, Rikishi got over. How many others? Would you statistically be able to say that there is a good/great ratio between the built bodies and the flabby bodies? I’m venturing to say no – probably a 95/5 ratio, maybe lower for the fat bodies. So yeah. I’ll give you that one, but add there are exceptions to everything, but primarily, if you look through the history of the WWF, muscular men are the biggest stars and have held that title belt the most. Bruno wasn’t chiseled like HHH or Hogan, but he that aura like Thesz, the “don’t mess me with me motherfucker”. First, there was the notion I am homosexual. Now I am a fan of incest.What is your quote advertising? That because I dislike fat people that I am gay and enjoy some good ole fashioned family loving. Sure, the match did happen, I’ve seen it, probably millions of people have as well – does it make it realistic though, no. Unless Umaga was just a machine there is no way in hell he worked that style of match for that long with that body without using unnatural methods to gain the stamina and endurance it requires to work a match of that length. When I saw that match, I saw a man (Umaga) doing something virtually impossible for a man of his size, which drew me to my conclusion that he must have been using methods that are unnatural. Did you online friends here give you a hi-five in a PM for this one? No? Awe, they should have, it was cute. That is a tough question. Back in the golden age, a man was a man. Now it seems as though men are a dying breed. What exactly are you suggesting with that feminine approach? The WWF hire psychiatric personnel and have their entire roster medical screened and examined prior to every match?Now, if the WWF had knowledge of any existing injuries or ailments and still allowed the man to continue doing his function, than yes, responsibility would be in their laps then. Is that the fact now, who knows. Has that been a factor in any of the deaths, possibly yes. Are you done being an arrogant self-righteous jerk? Are you a troglodyte? Are you ignorant to the American society? Are you being willfully dense? If the chips mean society, then yes we would destroy each other – state of nature. I am apolitical as well, want to be friends? What is the point in placing blame on the WWF? To possibly save wrestlers from themselves and the big bad WWF? Get a grip man, there will be no change in the system unless the government makes them change. It is good to see you’re one of those kinds of people though; it is always someone else’s fault. Blame should come from this order: Umaga, his family, his supposedly close friends, his other co-workers including road agents, and finally the management of the WWF. All of these deaths have always “come by a surprise” – that is bullshit. Wouldn’t you notice if one of your co-workers who you travel with is becoming quiet, reserved, and wanting to be alone? Well, nobody did with Benoit. Yet all of the boys in the back come out and say he was such a fantastic friend and blah blah blah. They are shitty friends then for not telling him to lay off the heavy stuff and lose some weight (which I am guessing is the overlying reason he is dead). You know, be a man and speak the truth even if it hurts – none of that pussified crap of we’re all beautiful snowflakes and beauty is on the inside. Grow up. Like in the military if someone dies from an overdose or suicide, they always look at the case in the following order – rack mate or roommate, fire team leader if in a combat related MOS, squad leader, platoon leader, platoon sergeant, platoon gunnery sergeant, platoon first sergeant, platoon executive officer, platoon commander, and so on. Blame will never be attributed directly to the top. We all are/have at one time or another. Although you have come across as a snobbish dick in the majority of your post, I like your tastes in movies, as I am assuming you were cleverly using that from the warden on Shawshank Redemption.

But he has that rebellious thing going on that young girls dig, least forget his noted drug habits. The man comes and goes as he pleases, does motocross, is in a band, and paints – it writes itself. While Cena doesn’t take Foley or Sabu style bumps, he does take unordinary bumps for the number one face in the promotion. In addition, the things that make the three you mentioned marketable are their bodies, but that isn’t breaking any new grounds whatsoever. Thank you. That is pretty much a given. I wonder if he had diabetes. Lawler must be an anomaly. I still heavily doubt the man never did drugs or abused pills or drank booze. If that is actually provable, and he didn’t, he is truly an anomaly of professional wrestling – certainly during the 70s and 80s and in Memphis of all places. I’ve already responded to this but wanted to hit on a few areas of interest.Dyno did what he felt was necessary to have an edge on his peers and he did for a short time. He, like many after him couldn’t recognize the cues to hang ‘em up and he has paid dearly. Health typically doesn’t crash and burn overnight; it is usually a science of progression. He either ignored the signs or just popped another pill to make it all go away for a couple of hours before dosing himself again. I have always liked his work but the man is a moron. He destroyed his body and for what? A legacy of how strongly people despised him. It does suck that Dyno wasn’t able to find a less harmful and bodily toxic method to sustain his physique and athletic abilities without knocking down his temple. Foley’s brain has to be like a scrambled egg and he is going to enjoy the later stages of life as his young adult years proved very costly indeed. Although Foley is not a model wrestler, he is a fantastic talker and brawler. I was enthralled in June 1998 when he was being tossed around and off a cage and then through the cage itself. Eleven years later, I cringe and feel pity for the man who was so desperate and willing to potentially sacrifice his career and life to entertain fans and keep a job. I bet he has an extraordinary time getting out of bed in the morning. Makes me think of that Beyond the Mat documentary when it showed Terry Funk attempting to exit his bed. Uncomfortable to say the very least. Do you remember the “My Sacrifice” music videos from like 2001 or something? The majority of the boys said they continue to push through the pain and the bumps and the bruises and the torment of the schedule to entertain their fans. The one that really sticks out is Steve Austin. That is unquestionably my point. To review and refresh: • I strongly believe that it is the fans, which caused the wrestling industry to change. Wrestling promoters are in business to make money, so if their projected audience is unpleased with their product they’ll either modify it or continue on the same route and lose money i.e. WCW/ECW/TNA. • If the fans are craving legalized violence and brutality, that is what they’ll get. If they want strong-style or the slower technical based style, they will get it. • My own personal view on wrestlers is simple: I want to see someone whom I can identify with on a level of realism and not want to turn the channel. I would rather see John Cena than so-and-so obese person. • I can only really describe it is if you’ve seen an obese soldier, more than likely it has been a national guard. It sends the wrong image – soldiers are supposed to be lean and healthy looking as they are safeguarding our country and all of that jazz. What sense of security does an avoirdupois person present? Uh, none whatsoever – it makes me cautious for my own safety because what is that obese soldier going to do when all hell breaks loose? I wouldn’t feel comfortable having a fat Marine on my fire team – why you may ask. Imagine being injured and being separated by a couple hundred yards and the heavy set Marine/soldier is the closest one by a mile. You’re going to bleed to death. Because just like wrestling, fat soldiers are anything but athletic, and the ones that are, are anomalous. • Because of the demands of the job and new methods of training and working (stiffer and more realistic), the wrestlers are being forced to use unnatural means to sustain their bodies and livelily hoods. • Something I didn’t cover but I think is very relevant to the increase usage of unnatural methods – the WWF’s traveling schedule. I assume that the number of WWF related employee deaths would decline if the company had a lighter schedule. A wrestler can only sacrifice so much before he or she must use methods to catch back up and keep in stride with the ridiculous traveling. • I am saddened by the sudden death of Umaga. It is sad that people are claimed far too early in their lives by professional wrestling and the dangerous vices associated with it. It is particularly worth mentioning that most of the deaths in pro wrestling lately have come from guys who have wrestled in the modern age of wrestling. To me at least, the younger people are falling into the inescapable traps the older veterans have seemingly avoided like Flair and Piper. Whether it is newer drugs, stronger drugs, more drugs, more longer distance traveling, a harder style on the body – more and more wrestlers are dying in their middle thirties to early forties. J Were you attempting an insult? Questioning my sexuality because I prefer healthy looking wrestlers who bring a better realm of realism into a contest that is already devoid of realism, I guess common sense is lost upon people like you. I mean really, is it at all really that difficult to understand the unpleasantness of obese people? Am I the only one with enough courage to admit that fat people are truly disgusting? Apparently so… So is it any less ridiculous to use quotes from non-fictional serial killers? Just asking. The quote I chose is relevant to my internal feelings of disgust to people who completely let themselves go. You doubt many people believe this?Again with the sexuality questioning – I don’t like wrestlers who are fat, because they don’t fit the niche of a wrestler, an actual wrestler. Think outside the box for a moment. In high school they have a heavyweight division, sure, but is it because they want a heavyweight division or is it because they can’t discriminate against the obese? A physically fit wrestler fits the niche of a wrestler, does it not? Imagine the origins of wrestling competitions, like back in the Greco-Roman days. How many behemoth monsters competed inside the ring/fighting area? I am more than confident that not many did. Ask yourself why. Wouldn’t it be beating the horse if they piled that upon his child molestations and adulterous affairs? And are you not a leading contributor of bashing Meltzer's random and inane quotes on this very board? Hmm... I prefer brunettes but wouldn’t turn down a redhead or blonde.It is called preferences. For someone who is labeled a wrestling guru you sure don’t remember many big men do you? Add Rikishi to the list. Add Earthquake and Tugboat to the list. Add Abdullah Kobayashi to the list. Incredibly agile, I assume you mean an agile man of his size… Do you keep a journal with everyone’s likes and dislikes posted in it? You are trying to point out all of my flaws and such – those who live in glass houses should not throw stones.It is obvious you dislike me, and whatever reasoning you have behind your dislike is fine by me. Nevertheless, if this is any indication of what the future is going to bring i.e. any post I make that is controversial that you will fly off the hinge and attack my beliefs with vigor I will retract my account from this site. I do not go out of my way to memorize things about you, things that are particularly…unbecoming of a man of your age. I give you the respect and considerations I hope to receive in return, and whether I receive the same level of gratitude or not will not deter me from being respectful and using tact. It has become painfully obvious that I am not well liked around these parts, for whatever reason. To be honest, I am completely surprised that Phil, Goodhelmet, and Loss haven’t jumped aboard yet to attack me. That is not meant to be a dig of any sorts, but when the proverbial beehive is disturbed – all the drones typically make a gang assault to repel the intruder.

Where do I say that Umaga deserved to die? I reserve those feelings for a very particular group of people – and don’t try to say none of you wishes death upon anyone. If there was some slight error in my post, where I unintentionally conveyed a desire for a man I have never met and has never done anything wrong to me to die, I am sorry. I still would like to see where I said that in my initial post however. If there is one thing I did do, I outright praised the man for being a behemoth in the ring, which I will continue to say for many years. His match with Cena at the 2007 Royal Rumble is my favorite match of the decade – my match of the decade, two enthusiastic thumbs up, 5 stars… Moreover, and conveniently for a point to be made against me, the August 07 match between Danielson and Morishima is my second favorite match of the decade. Both involved morbidly obese men fighting much smaller opponents, especially the ROH match. Does that mean I enjoy watching morbidly obese men on a constant basis, hell no. Although Morishima has added another cruiserweight since that time, or he has just lost muscle mass he has always reminded me of a Japanese Terry Gordy or an enormous Japanese woman. There are times I cannot stomach watching his matches because of his size, which I will explain further down in my diatribe of a self-defense. In addition, yes, I meant the oily fat guy who wears a g-string and I believe palled around with D-X – Big Dick Johnson, or something. Men like him, Mabel, Yokozuna, Mark Henry, and Big Sal – repulsive and not enjoyable to watch, especially in high definition. Don’t attempt to play the race card either. Those people sucked at their functions as wrestlers because they can’t even do what they are in the ring to do – wrestle. Fat men are like soft-core porn – a disappointment in every aspect. Vader has never struck me as a morbidly obese man even though he is; the surliness and bastardly conduct persuades me to look past his overflowing gut. His tremendous workrate for a man his size also helps. Umaga was definitely tolerable; I found his character both hilarious and dominating and I thought he was a fantastic worker. My racism of fat people stems from my own personal experiences. In 2004, when I graduated high school I was tipping the scales between 315 and 330 pounds. I had jumped from 175 to that size in six months. It tarnished my body, leaving very red and visible stretch marks. My entire wardrobe was lost. I went from a size 28 waist to a 46. I didn’t let myself go unlike those men who grace the wrestling ring (presumably). If you want a further explanation, I will gladly provide one. Concussions were well documented prior to the Benoit Family massacre. Steve Young and Troy Aikman’s professional football careers were ended because of concussions. Bret Hart’s career was ended because of several concussions received in a months’ time. Jeff Jarrett was also on the shelf during that period of time with a concussion. Scott Hall missed time with a stinger and a concussion from the three-way with Sid and Jarrett. Christopher Nowinski’s career was ended because of concussions. I believe Jericho has missed time with a concussion. Bubba Ray Dudley was obviously concussed in a TLC match on Raw in 2003 (?) when he was face planted off a ladder. Hell, in 2001 an organization was formed dealing specifically with concussions in sports. My dealings with concussions are well documented on the internet. I’ve known that for years that brain damage is a probable result of a multitude of concussions – depending on the grade and frequency. I knew this back in 1998 when I received my first of many concussions from a football game when my helmet was knocked off. Misawa dying was very unfortunate. I am a huge fan of him. You mention Meltzer saying it wasn’t as legit as it appears, but in Misawa’s case, there seems to be a clear assumption those years of dangerously landing on the back of head and being spiked directly on top of head proved more realistic than appearances from Meltzer’s eyes allowed. That was an exaggeration on my part and I apologize. I was, and am, of course referencing the 1970s in Japan. Those matches bring the old school greatness, but a drastic change was needed to keep fans interested. In addition, being an avid fan of AJPW pre-split, the 70s and early 80s are often a chore to sit through – like the now internet wide famous Broadway with Lawler/Race. Riki Choshu brought the stiffness and head dropping style to All Japan. Jumbo followed suit and passed the torch to Misawa, Kawada, and Kobashi. I don’t know how you fake being spiked directly on top of the cranium i.e. Williams’ nasty backdrop drivers to Kobashi and Misawa in ’93 and ’94. Some of Morishima’s uproot backdrop drivers are also particularly nasty looking. Re-watching some of the particularly gruesome drops, especially to Kobashi, he typically brings his arms up to relieve some of the impact that is being incurred to his spinal column. There is no telling how much impact is being directly applied to his spine however. In addition, there are plenty of times where the worker is dropped on the back of his head without using his arms to help cushion the impact. Whether those bumps really hurt or not, I do not know, I am not the one taking the move. However though, I have wrestled with friends on pole-vaulting pads when I was a teenager, and it definitely took the wind out of my sails when I landed awkwardly on the back of my head one time. Obviously, that isn’t a concrete example to use in the terms of this conversation, but it does persuade me to think that continuously landing like that will have detrimental effects on a person’s body. Years of abuse, whether from taking too many bad, not 100% protected head drops caught up with Misawa. Now you’re just being condescending and arrogant. Think Flair/Steamboat. Flair/Windham. Steamboat/Savage. You mention the Rock, why? He was getting chokeslammed and pedigree’d through tables.Do you disagree with the assertion that more realism has been added since it was well known that wrestling is an orchestrated and planned ahead of time contest? Then everything changed. This generation’s wrestlers aren’t as good as those men who were protected by kayfabe and cut their teeth traveling from territory to territory busting their asses. The WWF roster would implode if they had to work the kind of schedule that Flair worked in the 80s. How many WWF wrestlers have succumbed to broken necks in the last decade? Didn’t Cena have his pectoral muscle torn to shreds because of Kennedy’s sloppiness?In the WWF there is often visible misses that are still sold, it sometimes works, and sometimes doesn’t. Would that go over in Japan or ROH? Not a chance. It makes my disdain for obese people pinpoint clear though. Whether it was his gimmick or not, I do not care – it was, and is repulsive every time he is on Raw for a special appearance. No offense Bix, but you mustn’t have thought about it very hard – Yokozuna, Mabel, Big Sal, Akebono, Haystack whatever. Yeah I get it though, Yokozuna was a sumo wrestler, and he is supposed to be enormous but that doesn’t mean I am supposed to feel all warm inside because he is performing his function correctly. The divas certainly are.Women go ape shit when Cena’s rips his t-shirt off. If Orton weren’t a heel, they would be going bonkers over him as well. All the young punk rock emo girls love them some Jeff Hardy. How many grown women do you know that are avid professional wrestling fans? I strongly believe most women venture to these shows because (A.) Their significant other i.e. boyfriend/fiancé/husband are fans – and – (B.) They like looking at the eye candy (the men) just as much as we enjoy the eye candy (the divas). Everyone isn’t created equal. That’s what you just pointed one. Fedor is the greatest MMA fighter of all-time and he doesn’t have a tremendous physique either and could outlast just about anyone in his weight class. Why is Fedor so dominate, so powerful, so great – because his genes are better than your (not you) genes. Just because someone like Mark Henry stomps, clubs, and slams his opponents doesn’t make him an athlete. Weight lifting is not a sport and you don’t have to athletic to wear spandex, a weight belt, and squat a bus. I wouldn’t say easily. Ninety minutes of sometimes often and rapid movement and physical punishment is a daunting task – it would be for any well-conditioned athlete. I do recall a lot of resting going on though, which is obviously going to occur. Just saying is all. I do not agree with this. The larger the man, the larger the opportunities for pain because of his sheer size, there are/will be a larger amount of nerves and skeletal tissue. That is because of the larger mass, larger doses of narcotics will be required to make the pain manageable for a larger than normal man. Like the fabled drinking escapades of Andre the Giant – an average normal man would have died from alcohol poisoning. How often do you see diminutive men competing on the World’s Strongest Man competitions? They are generally huge, hulking monsters. Smaller men usually don’t have the skeletal strength or durability to perform such unusual feats of above average to super-human levels of strength. That was all very simple physiology of the human body. Eh. Wouldn’t that defeat the purpose of being a professional wrestler – hell, just being a professional in general? Half-assing his function would have caused turmoil in his career. Had he blown his opportunity against the modern day Hogan it would have been disastrous to the longevity of his career. He probably wouldn’t have been such a focal performer in one of the lead WrestleMania storylines either. Yes, plenty of people have been lackluster wrestlers, blown major matches, and still drawn. Hogan is the lynch pin for that category. However, Hogan wasn’t expected to be Ric Flair in the ring, he was the unique charismatic super-hero all the kids wanted to emulate. He did the normal routine: get beaten down by an intimidating monster heel or snarky smart cowardly (Piper) hit his trademark moves, tell the children to say their prayers and take their vitamins and the mark fans loved it. That was well over twenty years ago depending on exactly what era we are talking about. Umaga isn’t Hulk Hogan and him not performing his duties and obligations to the extent everyone in the back knows he could – “We wish you luck in your future endeavor”. Yeah, the boxing thing was a spur of the moment thought. I was hindered by time constraints as my laptop battery was at five percent and I wasn’t sure when I’d be online again. The point with the boxing addition is the fans dictate everything in that sport as well. If the boxers were playing it safe, avoiding everything and not taking chances i.e. “not sticking their nose in there”, and if this is a major advertised bout like the upcoming Mayweather and Paciquo fight, oh boy would the fans be unpleasantly pissed off. I have witnessed this with MMA as well. One of the last Randy Couture fights I saw he just keep pressing his opponent into the cage side and hugging him – and this started from almost the beginning of the fight. The boos drowned out the cheers.

I see what you did there. As though you're above using quotes from cult classic films...Are you claiming you have never, not once, used a movie line/quote in a conversation? Liking a match with ordinary looking guys is a problem because? It's not like Lawler had back boobs flopping around and looking like a pregnant cow. Anyway, Lawler has that natural coolness to him like Harley Race.And how do you know Lawler doesn't/hasn't do(ne) drugs or tipped bottles back? Did he tell you this - if so - you believed him? If anything, THAT would be laughable. I like how you insinuate that I am gay, very original there Bix. Again, how do you know Foley has always been drug free?

I posted this at DVDVR as well. Although I am saddened by the demise of one of the best booked big men the WWF has ever produced (until being squashed into oblivion by Lashley) I feel no resentment towards the WWF or wrestling in general. The men and women who lace up their boots and voluntarily enter the squared circle under their own power know the associated risks and dangers of professional wrestling. If they don't, they should not be in the ring in the first place - but that is besides the point, a disclaimer if you will. That is not wrestling's fault, nor the WWF's. Japan has seen a similar increase in head drops and death defying spots because of the audience becoming desensitized of the normal collar and elbow tie ups and working an arm for forty-five minutes. The same can be said about American wrestling, when two technical wrestlers are working holds and selling like they did in the 80s the WWF crowd yells "boring". ROH crowds enjoy more technical wrestling but they wouldn't enjoy an entire card of technical wrestling - they want the strong style the Japanese uses i.e head drop suplexes and dangerously hard strikes. Since the end of the kayfabe era wrestlers have had to adopt more realism into their matches - which relates to more dangerous moves and strikes. To make something that is known to be fake look real, people will eventually get hurt. The WWF has received a ton of harsh words and criticism over the years about wanting a particular looking wrestler in their rings. Well, no shit. It is like Penthouse having mammoth women grace their pages and covers - no one would buy the magazine except the men who love fat chicks, and that niche isn't large enough to sustain the profit margins Penthouse enjoys and expects. The same can be same about the WWF, when Big Dick Dudley or the Bastion Booger come out most people feel sick to their stomachs, they should because fat people are disgusting. As John Doe said on Seven: "An obese man... a disgusting man who could barely stand up; a man who if you saw him on the street, you'd point him out to your friends so that they could join you in mocking him; a man, who if you saw him while you were eating, you wouldn't be able to finish your meal." So the WWF does the sime kind of business strategy the modeling companies and porn companies do - they utilize men and women with physically attractive bodies that will promote sexual desires thus increase attendance and viewership. It is unfortunate that people have to use unnatural methods to procure a body of perfection, but that again leads to the point that the men and women know the risks - unless they have been living under a rock for the last twenty years. Having a strong looking body makes it more realistic as well. How believable is it when a huge fat man wrestles for twenty minutes? Everyone knows a fat person, imagine them orchestrating a twenty minute athletic solo event. Completely unbelievable, and let alone a disgusting visual. Because of his size, Umaga had to use unnatural remedies to negate his massive body i.e steroids and massive amounts of pain-killers, I doubt baby aspirins would cut it for a man who was well over 300 pounds. He had to perform at a high level, like in the 2007 LMS match against Cena - he was incredibly athletic, unnaturally athletic to be precise. He took the risks and has paid the consequences. Honestly if there is anybody to specifically blame it would be the fans. We want more, we want the biggest, we want the best. We don't want forty-five minute snooze fests between out of shape grocery shelf stockers, we want the smash mouthed brawl and head drops from two diesel like fullbacks. It is our fault that men are jumping off ladders, crashing through tables - we wanted the insane violence and the performers give it. And like liberals, once we have gotten our way and realize how fucked up it is, we cry and bitch. In boxing, the boxers have to put on a show and throw huge damaging haymakers and take absurd amounts of punishment to please the crowd instead of strategically placing their blows and avoiding punishment. Blame yourself. But as I said, I am saddened by the death of Umaga.

What if it was coming from the Big Show?

Eh, booking undefeated streaks in complicated. Goldberg lost all (most) of his heat following his first major loss and of all people to lose to, Kevin Nash, did him no favors. Goldberg needed to lose to someone of near equal status, or someone the crowd could actually see pulling off the major upset. Sting would be an obvious choice. But in WCW at that time frame, no one was really booked as massively strong as Goldberg. He soundly defeated everyone up to that point, DDP/Hogan were the two biggest ones. Unless he beat Sting, I don't recall a clean pin in their match, a no decision is what I remember (?). A undefeated streak is fundamentally screwed from the beginning. The wrestler has to lose sometime, whether by pinfall, submission, or count out/disqualification (although I don't consider the latter to be streak-enders). Unless a promotion wants to go out of business, they can't have someone be undefeated forever. If they were champion, sure the title would have prestige up the butt, the only downfall is that feuds for the title would get little heat because "B will not defeat A". Samoa Joe suffered the same kind of loss of momentum after his two streaks were obliterated. After he won the ROH title, he was the destroyer of worlds. After Aries pinned him cleanly, he started losing to all sorts of guys, the worst was Jay Lethal. He had a similar, albeit much longer streak in TNA, until Angle beat him. Look at what happened to him? He's losing three minute matches to Red....

Seen the clipped version, and it was from memory, top notch.

Did this joke elsewhere, I liked it enough to do it again. Hah. That is awesome.

Pish posh, Murdoch is one of my newly (within last three years) dubbed favorites of all-time.His punches in this match are incredible. They look like they are landing legit every time, something that is good, and something every wrestler needs to learn how to do. I liked the ring announcer stating Murdoch was only 230, or whatever, then Ross correcting that error. Good match, Luger playing the muscled coward to the tee, and Murdoch being the no non-sense hard ass brawler.

This match is very iffy to me. The work is okay, something to be expected considering who's in the ring, but the overall feeling of the match is flat. Armstrong was keeping pace and outworking Muta through the contest, but loses two falls consecutively. Add in the color commentator, who was annoying, and it is a long match to endure. Muta did seem like he was having problems with Armstrong, maybe not understanding what Armstrong was saying?

What's missing that should have been included: 9/23/81 WWF Junior Heavyweight Title Match: Tatsumi Fujinami vs. El Solitario 1/1/82 WWF Junior Heavyweight Crown Decision Match: Tiger Mask vs. Dynamite Kid 7/23/82 Tiger Mask vs. Dynamite Kid 10/26/82 WWF Junior Heavyweight Title Match: Tiger Mask vs. Kuniaki Kobayashi 2/7/83 WWF Jr. Title: Tiger Mask vs. Black Tiger If full version exists 6/2/83 WWF Junior Heavyweight Crown Decision Match: Tiger Mask vs. Kuniaki Kobayashi 2/7/84 Kid/Smith/Cobra 8/2/84 NWA World Junior Heavyweight Title Match: The Cobra vs. Kuniaki Kobayashi 9/19/85 Antonio Inoki vs. Tatsumi Fujinami 8/7/86 IWGP Junior: Nobuhiko Takada vs. Kazuo Yamazaki 9/16/86 Antonio Inoki vs. Bruiser Brody 12/10/86 IWGP Junior: Shiro Koshinaka vs. Kazuo Yamazaki 2/15/88 Top of the Super Junior League Match: Nobuhiko Takada vs. Shiro Koshinaka 8/8/88 Antonio Inoki vs. Tatsumi Fujinami What is the defense for these selections? Are they better compared to the ones I have listed? Tatsumi Fujinami vs. Chavo Guerrero (5/9/80) Why wasn't the match from August included instead of this, as it was a much better match. Tatsumi Fujinami vs. Kengo Kimura (9/25/80) Tatsumi Fujinami vs. Tony Rocco (9/11/80) Tatsumi Fujinami vs. Steve Keirn (11/6/80) Tiger Mask vs. Gran Hamada (11/6/81) this one, and the one below, why couldn't TM's better matches with Kid and Kobayashi be included instead of these? Tiger Mask vs. El Canek (12/8/81) Tiger Mask vs. Steven Wright (4/1/82) This is good, but better than 10/26/82 OR 6/2/83? Hulk Hogan vs. Abdullah the Butcher (5/26/82) Hulk Hogan vs. Antonio Inoki (IWGP League Final) (6/2/83) Andre the Giant vs. Hulk Hogan (12/9/82) Hulk Hogan vs. Tatsumi Fujinami (2/5/85) Tatsumi Fujinami vs. Riki Choshu (4/21/83) this is good, but consideration for one of the best NJPW had to offer in the '80s is stretching it just a tad. Riki Choshu matches in '89 against Vader & Hashimikov, really? I typed this up when the listing was initially released. It won't change anything, but it will provide some good commentary and discussion. Oh, and another reason I posted it is because I killed the thread with my lost post = my bad.

Hey, not fair! McAdam's lists are very misleading, especially when you've been drinking screwdrivers all night because your grandmother just died.

I'm in that boat, minus Owen Hart.

I can't see how you'd look at this and make the complaint your making. It'd be like Wild Pegasus/Resident Evil putting together a best of WCW project, there would be like two hundred Benoit matches.Just because someone is a persons favorite wrestler doesn't mean that their matches are the greatest thing since hardcore porno.

Liger will be released before the end of the year, maybe as soon as November. That is splendid. Is the Gilbert match from the PWO DVDs? If so, that was an awesome match.

Twenty-eight Fujiwara matches? I wonder who influenced that many matches. Set looks great, although some bias exists in plain sight, and there are some very key juniors matches absent involving Mask/Kid/Kobayashi.