French catch

[David Mantell]

I stand corrected, I've reviewed other Flesh Vs Kato & Elliot/Grim Rocker matches but not this one with Walter Brodes, it seems. Never mind, I shall do both bouts shortly - in the meantime here is OJ's review of that first bout .

On 5/21/2020 at 1:51 PM, ohtani's jacket said:

Eliot Frederico & Kato Bruce Lee vs. Flesh Gordon & Walter Bordes (aired 7/9/83)

Herve is back again, but this time as Flesh Gordon. I was interested in the backstory behind this. Apparently, Jean Corne brought Herve into the business in the mid-70s. Herve says he was part of the Celts, so perhaps he replaced Falempin as Corne's tag partner. According to Herve, he didn't like the fact that wrestlers wore underpants and idiotic robes. He had a better idea and started fashioning a gimmick for himself based on the Flash Gordon movie. Now you'd think a gimmick patterned after Flash Gordon would be pretty spectacular. After all, it's Flash, ah ah, King of the Impossible. Herve wasn't bad. He was apparently influenced by lucha after a trip to Mexico, and he comes across as a decent technico. It's patently obvious that the Eurosport shit that come later was not the same idealist that we see here. But you can see that he's not as good as an aging Bordes let alone the phenom that he'd need to be to really be a draw. I was surprised by how much Bordes resembled Ben Chemoul in this match. It was almost like he had adopted his former partner's role. There was some fun stuff from the Gordon/Bordes team, but their opponents were weak. 

 

[David Mantell]

11 hours ago, David Mantell said:

Been away from home a couple of days and this week's French Catch dropped while I was away.  One of these bouts I've already reviewed on here and will just bump up the original r3view. Th3 new bout sounds interesting - Black Shadow  in singles action.  We've seen Shadow as a rent a heel in tag matches with everyone from Josef El Arz to Jessy Texas.

Okay, let's deal with the tag match first.  (Have just this second figured out how do do accents etc on the tablet btw.)

Hervé first became a wrestler while in Mexico.  As OJ mentioned in his review, he came back to France in 1979, decided that the existing French scene was a bit too dry for him and decided he could remake it more the flashy world of masked and caped  superheros  like Mil Mascaras.  He found a willing accomplice in Daniel Cazal who is commenting here (and who was gradually replacing Couderc as the voice of TV wrestling.) 

Villains like "Le Rocky Du Ring" Elliot and Kato were very much part of the package of Hervé's vision. Jessy Texas was another early example In time there would be Scott Rider, Micky Trash and Cybernic Machine. Not to mention the slow transformation of Jacky Richard to first Le Marquis (replacing Eduardo the original Marquis) then Travesti Man and finally Monsieur Jacky.  Kato and EF le R du R would also evolve their gimmicks becoming respectively Kato Gypsy and the Grim Rocker by the time of Eurosport New Catch with the latter becoming the sidekick of Johnny South, the future Legend of Doom, which is ironic considering he has Mike Hegstrand's future haircut here. (At this stage over in America, the Road Warriors were only just formed and doing a standard biker heel gimmick no different from Les Bloussons Noirs in France)

Although he gets to score the pin with a rather nice surprise flying bodypress, Walter Bordes is here as a link to the past. Flesh is the last in the line of his tag partners Including Rene Ben Chemoul and Claude Rocas.  Flesh, as I mentioned, later tagged with Angelito to face Kato and Rocky/Rocker on A2 in 1985 and teamed with Prince Zéfy to face the same two Méchants on Eurosport New Catch.  Here, they're  very much the squash boys, sent to do a job.

Flesh is very much the star, doing high flying  moves throughout.  It's a good display but not worthy of the blow by blow approach.  Referee Andre Blanc does get a brief heel ref spot, physically breaking up Flesh's Indian Deathlock after Kato complains that supposed chops to the chest are actually chops to the throat, resulting in a brief shoving match between Flesh and L'Arbitre.

Verdict - a vehicle for Flesh and a pilot for the future "Barnum Heavy Metal"

[David Mantell]

On 9/25/2025 at 1:02 AM, David Mantell said:

MD: This is part of a show with a Flesh Gordon/Walter Bordes vs Eliot Fredrico/Kato Bruce Lee match from the previous week too and I kept that because the version we had before and covered here. This doesn't have the audio timecode issue though so it's an improvement. The Cohen vs Shadow match is new to us.

SR: Cohen has had one of the best singles matches of all the French matches that we've seen in 1968. 15 years later, he sure is aged, but still quite on top of the game. By 1983 these matches had approximated the rhythm closer to a lucha match. Less extensive working of holds, more complicated rope running and snappy armdrags with a rudo bumping a lot. It's a fascinating evolution. Cohen showed he was definitely not coasting by his old skillset. He could do all that. And Black Shadow was an excellent bumper. There may be an argument that the guys working France may have been better rudos than the Mexicans. I mean, Black Shadow had no problem bumping around for Cohen for like 10 minutes straight here, flinging himself into armdrags and outside of the ring. They would work some holds for a bit, and then go back the bumping and stooging. It's really fun to watch. Shadow actually ends up taking up the match working over Cohen with some mean stomps and punches. Nothing mindblowing, it does the job. Shadow actually put up a bit of a fight here but ended up falling to Cohens skill anyways. Perhaps they were a bit long in the tooth here going 20 minutes with the rudo beatdown being a bit much but it was a good match.

MD: Cohen sure was good. The first ten minute had him totally in control and some of his stuff was so slick. He'd torque the arm and then vault over for the headscissors takeover or bump himself with a front flip to set up the bridging headcissors roll over. The rope running was very good. The fans were into it. Shadow did a great job of feeding and running into it all, really bumping all over the place for Cohen. Very entertaining stuff and like I said, slick, just slick. There were two bits of heel control here. Both were quite similar, with a lot of stomps and punches, slamming the head into the turnbuckle, and tossing Cohen out. In the first, Cohen was able to mount a comeback because the ref was getting in the way of Shadow. Cohen went too big on his comeback an the ref got in his way though, letting Shadow take back over. The second, which got over big, had Shadow toss him out one too many times and Cohen yank him out from the floor. Cohen was able to catapult him into the ref too, satisfying everyone. You had the sense (and the footage might justify having this sense) that these two had worked together for years. It showed here. It's late in the game for the French Catch footage, but from a skill standpoint alone, this really does stand up to almost anything in the world in 1983.

There's a rather large gap in the INA tape copy between matches during which we hear an engineer introduce this next bout as Catch A Quatre even though it's just a singles bout.  Black Shadow comes in wearing a gold jacket- I think we saw it before in his 70s appearances. At at time when Dave Bond and Johnny Kincaid were getting into trouble for incorporating the more antisocial elements of Afro-Carribean cuture into their heel Carribbean Sunshine Boys gimmick, alleged African American Shadow (Cazal lets slip that Shadow is actually from Morocco) was getting over as a heel in France without any hassle.

Cohen, le Bon, ex one half of Les Israeliens tag team with Gass Doukhan, (they were both Algerian Sephardic Jewish- Cazal claims Cohen to be a former North African champion). gets the early upper hand, dropkicking Shadow out of the ring and leapfrogging and armdragging him, stepping over one side of a finger Interlock straight into a flying headscissors takedown.  Shadow nicely flexes Cohen's legs open to not only release his head but get a two count folding press. He uses an illegal pull of the hair to take down Cohen in a top wristlock test of strength.  Cohen does the classic French headscissors as counter to armbar and keeps snapping it back on each time Shadow escapes. Shadow eventually places a knee in the space where his head went, creating a modified Indian Deathlock and using illegal closed fist kidney punches (nice to see closed fists still got heat in 1983 France) whenever Cohen sits up to attempt a counter.  After referee Blanc Cohen  rolls forward in a finger Interlock to get another headscissors. He turns on to his front, propped up by his fists and leg-throws Shadow out of the ring, rather like Kid McCoy's Yorkshire Rope Trick minus the ropes! Another Cohen headscissor sees Shadow kicked in the face. Shadow side chancery throws Cohen and drops down with Cohen dropping down beside him in a George Kidd ball.  Cohen baits Shadow with various producing limbs before catching and throwing him, securing a reverse arm hank, before high whipping him for a bump. Shadow does it back (for less of a bump) and maintains wristlever dominance even through a snapmare until he counters with a headscissors. Shadow puts his feet on the ropes and Blanc, as in the last bout, pulls Cohen off physically rather than verbally calling a break, getting himself some heat. 

Shadow wins a test of strength to get a double knee press but can't get Cohen's shoulders down. This then develops into Cohen bridging and, as traditional, eventually monkey climbing Shadow and a Bascule situation developing.  Cohen legdives Shadow and spins him round on one foot until he collapses.. Shadow gets a H&S into pressure points on Cohen who uses a double leg chop to escape.  A back and forth ropes exchange ends up with Shadow at ringside.  He gets back in and gets a legdive into leglock, snapping off various attempts at a chinlock counter by Cohen.   George uses his spare leg to kick Shadow in the face forcing a break.  The next finger Interlock results in Shadow getting some kind of foul and Cohen in pain, selling it.  It looks like Shadow is using biting on these interlocks but the ref sees nothing, standing an Aux Chiottes L'Arbitre chant for Monsieur Blanc.  Cohen retaliates with a good long nip on the nose but he lacks Shadow 's practice at that kind of fouling and leaves toothmarks when earn him a premier Avertisement from Blanc.  It all goes a bit American after this with rope running and bodychecks (apart from one sunset flip attempt by Cohen which Cazal gets excited over, thinking it will mark the match returning to "un Catch peut-être plus Classique" - yay. maybe he's secretly a purist like Kent Walton!)  and both men miss Big Splashes on each other, winding Shadow the worst - he sells it like a stomach upset.

Shadow gives Cohen some stomach trouble of his own with an illegal closed fist punch which Blanc almost sees and is suspicious enough to privately warn the Morrocan.  He is more careful to conceal subsequent foul shots. Having floored Cohen for 7 he lets rip with the dirty wrestling- illegal punches, legal thumps and illegal rope-assisted stomp on his fallen man until Cohen ends up at ringside, detaching a sponsorship message from the apron in the process.  Shadow continues the foul treatment when Cohen comes back, choking Cohen with the ropes which FINALLY earn him in Avertisement.  Shadow continues the treatment, twice posting Cohen before dragging him outside for a ringside beatdown the IBA would never tolerate.  He gets back in the ring and celebrates as the heat rains down. Fans help Cohen back but it just sets him up for more treatment.  Shadow gets a full nelson and Cohen's waving arms bash into Blanc's back. earning him a Deuxieme Et Derniere Avertisement. Encouraged by this, Shadow rope chokes and stomps Cohen back out of the ring, An angry Cohen storms the ring and grovits Shadow but one illegal kidney punch and some stomps later, Cohen is back out and Shadow is further provoking the audience by making a  "wiping his hands" gesture!

It goes on like this, Shadow doing thecfirst on Cohen + eventually earning himself his own Deuxieme Et Derniere Avertisement. (Somewhat unfairly the crowd start an Aux Chiottes L'Arbitre chant while this is happening.) The next Avertisement will end the contest. Cohen finally makes a face comeback, he fights back with postings and a hefty series of Manchettes that leaves Shadow trussed in the ropes and Cohen flirting with disqualification as he pounds on him - and then threatens Blanc, before cooler heads prevail.  The referee unties Shadow and Cohen throws him outside before climbing the top of the ring post. When Shadow returns, Cohen leapfrogs, double legdives and slingshots him - straight into Blanc who is knocked out. Cohen leads the crowd in a Knockout count over both opponent and official - it reaches 10 but Blanc waves it off. He corners Shadow who bodyscissors him Cohen chops him down and goes after Blanc but is, ironically, saved from a DQ by Shadow who grabs him from behind by the hair and corners him. This time Cohen gets the bodyscissors and bashes a heel on the heel's head. He dodges a Shadow charge and throws Le Méchant outside.  Shadow regains the advantage and throws Le Bon out of the ring, doing everything he can to keep him there and continuing the dirties when he finally does get back for a while. Still no DQ even though one woman at ringside is screaming for that final Avertisement.   Cohen drags him outside for a ringside brawl then throws him back in where he gets the one required fall with a flying tackle. Cohen is still annoyed at Blanc and won't let him raise his hand, raising it himself and locking his arms rigid whenever Blanc tries - in the end MC Fred Thomas (interesting name for a Frenchman) raises Cohen's hand. 

Classic game of two halves - fifteen minutes of mostly good scientific wrestling with Cohen frustrating Shadow by being just that bit more technical than him and fifteen minutes of Shadow getting his revenge with wild dirty brawling that would give an ECW crowd un Petit Mort. I know which half I preferred and I can guess which half OJ will prefer.

[Phil Lions]

1 hour ago, David Mantell said:

Hervé first became a wrestler while in Mexico.  As OJ mentioned in his review, he came back to France in 1979, decided that the existing French scene was a bit too dry for him and decided he could remake it more the flashy world of masked and caped  superheros  like Mil Mascaras.

Not really. Like OJ mentioned, Hervé was brought into the business by Jean Corne and by all accounts began his career in France. INA has a January 1977 FR3 segment featuring Corne, Angelito and Hervé, which spotlights Hervé as an upcoming star and at that point he was already claiming a World Championship (INA has footage of him defending said title the following month in Rennes). Technically, this FR3 segment is the earliest mention I've seen of him, but he probably started working a year or two prior. In 1977 he also began working for Delaporte, who had just resumed promoting after being away from the business for a while.

I'm not sure if I buy the idea that Hervé ever worked in Mexico either. I mean he very well could've, but just like with Mercier and his complete BS of a story of FFCP's origins (among other wacky claims), I've learned not to trust anything these guys say, so until I see proof of it I'm not buying the story of Hervé working in Mexico. And I've come across zero proof.

Also, keep in mind, Hervé became Flesh Gordon in late 1982 or early 1983 so a few years after his supposed Mexican run.

[David Mantell]

Just now, Phil Lions said:

I'm not sure if I buy the idea that Hervé ever worked in Mexico either. I mean he very well could've, but just like with Mercier and his complete BS of a story of FFCP's origins (among other wacky claims), I've learned not to trust anything these guys say, so until I see proof of it I'm not buying the story of Hervé working in Mexico. And I've come across zero proof.

Fair point but I can see logic in the idea that he got the idea of a superhero character from Lucha culture.  Bear in mind at this time most Americans thought Mil Mascaras a one-off when in reality he was a fairly generic Mexican masked babyface of the time. So it's anyone's guess how a Frenchman could have picked up on such a trope, short of actually going out there and immersing himself in the culture.

You're right that he was on TV as plain old Gerard Hervé in 1979, but he may have already been doing the character for his own KMG company (the G stood for Gordon) founded in 1979 and the alleged ancestor of (I)WS(F).

[El-P]

43 minutes ago, Phil Lions said:

Also, keep in mind, Hervé became Flesh Gordon in late 1982 or early 1983 so a few years after his supposed Mexican run.

Also, the fact he choose to call himself Flesh Gordon has exactly zero to do with lucha libre and everything to do with the Flash Gordon movie from Mike Hodge (ya know, with Queen doing the OST) that was released in France in early 1981.

Also, Hervé calling himself Flesh Gordon probably thinking it was a smart way to avoid getting sued or something, is incredibly dumb considering Flesh Gordon is the title of an erotic movie from the 70's. (or maybe he was in on the joke, considering he comes off like a horny sleazyball in the Strip-Tease TV show, and it's even worse since he tried to market himself to kids)

And yeah, the guy is 100% full of shit anyway everytime he opens his mouth, from what I've seen.

[David Mantell]

5 hours ago, El-P said:

the Flash Gordon movie from Mike Hodge (ya know, with Queen doing the OST) that was released in France in early 1981.

Yeah, I was about 6 or 7 at the time.  Weetabix did trading cards, the first of which was the scene of the green monster eating Flash. They previously did World Of Sport trading cards with sports Yes/No questions you had to scratch off to correctly answer - collect five correctly answered cards and you could send them off to be entered into a prize draw.  Annoyingly none of the questions were about wrestling, at least not in any packet of Weetabix that crossed our threshold.

Gordon did (in those days) look like sort of like a luchador who'd just had his mask pulled off though.

[David Mantell]

6 hours ago, Phil Lions said:

INA has a January 1977 FR3 segment featuring Corne, Angelito and Hervé, which spotlights Hervé as an upcoming star and at that point he was already claiming a World Championship (INA has footage of him defending said title the following month in Rennes).

Any chance we could see this?

[ohtani's jacket]

Mascaas was many things, but generic masked babyface wasn't one of them. 

[David Mantell]

34 minutes ago, ohtani's jacket said:

Mascaas was many things, but generic masked babyface wasn't one of them. 

There were a lot of other luchadors who could have been him America.

Point being, if Americans were that unfamiliar with Lucha culture, what chance did a Frenchman have unless he'd seen it up close?

[PeteF3]

1 minute ago, David Mantell said:

There were a lot of other luchadors who could have been him America.

Name them. They not only needed his skill and charisma and his physique, but also his size which is what was going to trip up most of them. Santo was a draw in parts of Texas but was never going to be able to be in-demand nationally as Mascaras was. I suppose Canek might have gone places (and he did, to some degree)--tall for a luchador, could fly and do power moves--but while he was a major star I don't think he had the same it-factor that Mil did. The "thousand masks" hook had more cache to an international audience than Jacinto Canek.

[David Mantell]

Who else would Americans have heard of?  Let alone the French?  They tried to sell Lucha movies in Spain and they flopped - fans reared on the CIC couldn't relate to it at all.  We never heard about him in Britain. I first saw him in back issue adverts in PWI in 1988.

[PeteF3]

I just asked what other luchador could have accomplished what Mil did in America (and Japan). Not sure what lucha movies in Spain and France have to do with any of that.

[David Mantell]

58 minutes ago, PeteF3 said:

I just asked what other luchador could have accomplished what Mil did in America (and Japan). Not sure what lucha movies in Spain and France have to do with any of that.

Other than having gone there, how much exposure to Lucha culture would Gerard Hervé have had a chance to experience?

Pancho Zapata was probably a lot closer the mark than Mil Mascaras when it came to most European fans' idea of a Mexican wrestler in the 60s/70s.

 

 

[David Mantell]

By the way. here are Cohen and Shadow facing each other eight years earlier:

On 10/22/2024 at 2:54 AM, David Mantell said:

Arz and Shadow team again, this time in surviving colour, yet again at the Cirque d'Hiver. Shadow in a gold ring jacket, Arz in the red/white plus Cedar Tree colours/emblem of the Lebanese flag. Robert Duranton drops in to say hello and snog the elderly male MC, dressed in black and looking every inch the movie star he was by this time.

The bad guys still lose but they put on their strongest performance yet, getting an opening fall about 10 mins in. It's all too much for one old boy who attacks Shadow and gets VICIOUSLY booted for his pains.  Les Bons finally catch up and get their equaliser and decider in the last few minutes. Fans chant Mama Doux Mais Mais despite the lack of Walter Bordes.

 

 

And here they are two years before even that:

On 10/19/2024 at 3:25 PM, David Mantell said:

Continuing my Black Shadow kick, rewinding 12 years to 1973 and the days before INA was set up, on which we are reliant on B/W export film prints. This bout was not reviewed on here previously although Shadow and Arz did team previously in 1973 and that has been reviewed. I'll get back to that one later.

An "Arz" if you don't know, is Arabic for a pimp.  (The Modern Hebrew term "Arsim" for the subculture of young working class Sephardic Jews into sportswear an hip hop culture - the Israeli equivalent of "Chavs" in the UK - was derived from this word.). J el A made quite a few French TV appearances running up to about 1976, the last of which INA made it's own colour video recordings. Josef sports a goatee, shadow an arrogant sheer worthy of the greatest Rene Lasertasse. Shadow may be a faux American, or even a real one, the commentator says he played American Football. More clean wrestling 

Five minutes in, Shadow is mostly clean wrestling Les Bons, taking bump landings from their wrist levers and Irish Whips. Fast paced but the audience are quiet, making them them of body on canvas stand out.  Shadow pulls his head out of a headscissor but is kicked into the ropes and leg-flipped on the rebound. Tags Arz. More clean wrestling. Shadow finally gets nasty with some punches on the ring apron. Arz holds Cohen for some Shadow stomps. Bouvet does a hope spot with flying scissors/bulldog headlock combo on both Mechants. Before long Shadow is in, Arz is out but still the double team. Pithy remark from commentator "La festival d'Iregularite continue".  Soon Les Bons are turning the table on Josef, camera zooms in on him selling an arm scissors.   Shadow reaches in with a stomp to regain heat. Referee is an old long white haired guy. Not Delaporte, he was still in tranks and a Mechant in August 1973. 

Both heels take an ankle each on the fallen Cohen, causing Bouvet to come in an split leg dropkick the pair.  Soon he is diving on Arz repeatedly.  Later Chiottes Arbitres like Saulnier and Weizz would be handing out Avertisements by now to the naughty Bons.  Shadow gets one for beating down on a cornered Cohen.  Commentator is getting fed up of still being in la Premier Manchester after all this time. Cohen rolls out of a beat down and scores the hot tag to Bouvet.  He gets to work dropkicking Shadow out the ring and getting a victory roll on Arz for the opener.  Crowd taunts the heels "ou est, ou est?" But they are soon back double teaming Cohen. Shadow briefly gets his head in the ropes but gets back out.  Cohen end up staggering at ringside, he gets in but Arz gets his in a piledriver position before switching to a bodyslam for the equaliser.  Shadow doesa suitable victory strut. Yes, apparently he is an American says the commentator.

Shadow forearms Cohen in the chest and Bouvet gets hot tagged in. Goes to work with dropkicks. Has both bad guys on the floor and follows them out for a four man ringside brawl.  IAt this point in 1973 the IBA's predecessor the ITA would have banned this from British TV.  Good guys double dropkick and whip bad guys into each other before Cohen gets the cross press on Arz for the decider.

Very much a dirty wrestling fest with the heels getting their comeuppance eventually. If you like the somersault escapes of Catch Francais then this is not much for you, but if you Kong to see an American style brawling heel team, Arz and Shadow really give it some Arn and Tully.

 

 

 

[Phil Lions]

19 hours ago, David Mantell said:

You're right that he was on TV as plain old Gerard Hervé in 1979, but he may have already been doing the character for his own KMG company (the G stood for Gordon) founded in 1979 and the alleged ancestor of (I)WS(F).

Just checked my notes and that KMG story is definitely not true either. Even Hervé himself is on record that he started using the name Flesh Gordon in 1982. And indeed, I have him on posters as late as February 1982 still using his real name. So the KMG, with G for Gordon, was definitely not founded in 1979. In 1979 Gordon was still working for Delaporte. He went off on his own in 1982 or so when he either quit or was fired by Delaporte (depending on which version you want to believe). That's when "Flesh Gordon" was born.

And besides, the source of the KMG story is the official WS website and that's not a source one should trust anyway. Just like one should've trust the BS FFCP stuff by Mercier that's plastered all over Wikipedia.

13 hours ago, David Mantell said:

Any chance we could see this?

No, but here's a screenshot of Hervé and Corne from said segment (which is about 6 minutes long). That's Hervé's first TV appearance that I have a record of (January 31, 1977). I think it aired only locally in Rennes, however.

[ohtani's jacket]

10 hours ago, David Mantell said:

There were a lot of other luchadors who could have been him America.

Point being, if Americans were that unfamiliar with Lucha culture, what chance did a Frenchman have unless he'd seen it up close?

Mil is the third biggest star in lucha history. His gimmick was created specifically for him to a wrestling and movie star at the same time, and is one of the most successful lucha gimmicks of all-time, but he was hand picked for the role and there was nothing generic about him regard to his physique or the gimmick itself. That fact that he got over as a babyface star in Japan is also anything but generic. A lot of luchadores have worked in Japan since but none of them have gotten over to the extent that Mil did, and that was with Mil using a different style than he did in Mexico. I get the point you're trying to make, but Mil is a poor example. 

I don't know if Herve worked in Mexico or not. I imagine that if he did, we'd have some record of it. I don't think his style of wrestling or the gimmicks he used specifically came from lucha. 

[ohtani's jacket]

Georges Cohen vs. Black Shadow (7/16/83)

As the biggest Cohen fan I know, I was quite happy to see some new footage turn up. After watching this, I have no doubt that Cohen was one of the best workers in Europe during the early 80s, comparable to Zrno, Van Buyten, or any of the WoS guys. Structurally, it offered a little bit of everything -- flashy technical wrestling, brawling, face-in-peril, and a fired up babyface comeback. It reminded me of the classic matches of the 50s without the amazing crowds. I was somewhat sympathetic towards Black Shadow as I feel European babyfaces tend to be dicks in the way they humiliate the heels technically, especially heels that can actually wrestle like Shadow. However, Shadow crossed the line and took things too far. The brawling at the end is what I imagine most fans enjoyed seeing more so than the technical wrestling, as I imagine most fans just want to see a fight, but I liked the way they touched all of the bases here. This was very good for what it was. 

[David Mantell]

Usually the idea was that the babyfaces/blue eyes/bons were just generally better technical wrestlers anyway and that's why the villains eventually resorted to brawlng and fouling.  The good guys had to prove themselves against other good guy in clean matches.

France didn't have a Kent Walton type commentator out to educate the viewers (Couderc often gets compared to Walton but really they were different breeds) so it's hard to say how much 1982 French fans appreciated good technical wrestling.  Probably older fans who remembered bouts like LPP/Saulnier had more of a taste for it. The kids and younger fans however may, as you said just been there for the action and cheering Les Bons/booing Les Méchants.

[Jetlag]

On 9/16/2025 at 11:23 PM, ohtani's jacket said:

Do the clips! 

I would, if I knew where to find them!

[David Mantell]

Quote

MD: A swimming pool match where no one actually ends up in the water. This was actually more of a river match or a lake match. It's probably identifiable but there was a train going by at times which added to the ambiance. I got so many annoying comments begging for more such matches the last time I put a Borne match as public that I don't think I'll do that here. You guys can see it because you check the blog. This was clipped. They call a twenty minute mark at the 10:43 point, give or take, but you do get enough of this to make sense of it. They cut in to the studio and Delaporte commenting to cover the breaks. 

And hey, it's pretty good for what we get. They wrestle for the first ten minutes or so, do one spot where they tease the ref going over (a pretty smooth one actually where Borne navigates Dewerdt to be tied up in the ropes quite well), and then move in to more wrestling, a short beatdown, and the finish. De Werdt was Belgian apparently, mother of three, and a bit of a bruiser. Borne did quite a bit well, including how she engaged the crowd. She was excellent at that. There was a nice rolling armscissors in here.

There was also a spot I'm not going to clip where Dewerdt had her legs split, did a headbutt to her butt, and then tried it again and got caught in headscissors. Some things can stay in 1984 maybe? They cut to Delaporte to talk about it because of course they did. I imagine this was part of a broader card where people did end up in the drink, but this was a little anticlimactic without that I suppose?  

SR: The prayers have been answered - it's another Brigitte Borne match. Oh, and it's a swimming pool match, of course. And it seems to be part of Le Dernier Manchette, so they are interviewing Roger Delaporte, pretending to watch the match at a studio even though this was clearly filmed outdoors. As far as the match goes, it was good. Definitely proved their salt once again. They mostly worked holds. Tight simple stuff, with a few cool escapes and moments. I thought the match would end early when Borne already went for the body checks in the ropes at the 9 minute mark, but they went back and wrestled a bit more. A very young Didier Gapp was the referee here (later the referee at EWP in Hannover) and he was great at teasing himself being thrown over the ropes and landing in the water. Leo Dewerdt was billed as the champion of Belgium. She did some heel stuff like going for the eyes and not too much. Nothing outstanding from her but solid wrestling skill was displayed here. It's not a revelation like the other Brigitte Borne match we saw but it's a fun time and I'm glad I watched it. 

Not just any old swimming pool either. It's the very same pool where the Mercier Brothers faced Albert Sanniez and Mario Petrolini. With the same evening commuter train passing by in the background.  If you recall the missus of the arguing ringside couple got thrown in the pool, nice red dress and all, so if neither female wrestler took an aqua bump here, it's nothing to do with the kind of politically correct chivalry-in-slapstick that gave us the one sided pie throwing games on Game for a Laugh that I mentioned on the British thread review of Simon Hurst Vs Ray Robinson recently. Or that bit in the AWA WrestleRock Rumble video where Da Laydeez push Scott Hall and Curt Hennig in a pool and have a  giggle.  Otherwise we might see both wrestlers here pitch the poor old ref in the drink and disappear of into the night together as girly mates for life.

And speaking of Monsieur L'Arbitre - So that's Didier Gapp with hair.  The same Didier Gapp who tried his damnedest to upstage a bunch of British (and one honorary Brit Owen) at the Heumarkt in the early 90s.  The same Didier Gapp whose whole miserable petty official persona actually made him a comedy cult hero among 90s CWA fandom and, as SR mentions, continued being a fixture of old school German/Austrian wrestling into the 21st Century with the EWP.  

I like the cool video fault at the start by the way.  Very David Bowie Ashes to Ashes video.

Oh and that IS a swimming pool, it just seems to be next door to a harbour.  This could get messy on a bad weather day with chlorine ending up in the sea and mucky sea water ending up in the pool.

Leo is pretty roughhouse with the bodychecks and high whips at the start. Gapp stops Borne booting Leo off, or was she going for a headscissors? Leo easily breaks Borne's bridge with a good old elbow to the stomach. She armdrags Borne back down when the latter gets up to sling her in the ropes and again in response to a hiptoss, but Borne finally gets that headscissors (see I was right!) Leo loses the arm and takes forever to snap out and kip up only to be scissored back down several times.  She tries the roll out escape but Brigitte tickles her (!) to make her lose balance. Finally she concertinas Borne's legs to bend them open and ends up with double legs but Borne is twisting back and forth to get out. She does get pin counted to 2 a couple of times but in the end flips Leo off. Some lecherous cameraman has climbed onto some nearby scaffolding and we get his longshots of back and forth armdrags and armbands and throws before cutting to the presenter and Delaporte eager for someone to fall in.  Brigitte pulls Leo off the ropes and applies a single toehold which she improves to a Gotch toehold. She turns Leo over and Manchettes her in the back when Leo sits up to attempt a counter. Leo uses a manchette of her own to get out and proceeds to an argument with Didi over it. Leo gets a bearhug which Borne escapes by bashing her sides, then manchettes her down. Leo gets the bearhug back then rope a dopes Borne to try get a better grip but Brigitte boots her down and splashes her (not in La Piscine sense.) but Leo does get a bodyscissors. Brigitte does get the odd 2 count out of it as does Leo with the help of a couple of illegal throttles. Borne, fighting fire with fire, pulls her up by the hair and Manchettes her off, Leo side chancery throws and chinlocks her. Brigitte elbows her in the stomach to break it, but Leo is back with the side Chancery throw to chinlock soon enough. Brigitte uses the same elbow escape then totally loses her cool, stomping Leo.  When Didi tries to interfere she nearly throws both of them in the water and get an Avertisement for her pains. Chastened, she opts for a lot of snapmares and the odd lariat before getting Leo on the top rope, tying her up and charging her.  Didi again narrowly avoids a soaking - he could show Modesto "Kamikaze" Aledo or even Ricky Steamboat a few tricks slingshotting himself back in the ring) and give Borne her Deuxieme Et Derniere Avertisement. He manages to eventually free Dewerdt (as the driver of a passing train honks his horn in appreciation - was he a Catch fan? We'll never know.) Leo plays possum on the canvas but it's a ploy to legdive and legspread Borne. As @Matt D mentioned she did the butts (to the stomach not the crotch) and upgraded the legspread to a standing toe and ankle legspread combo. She pulls Borne away and gets the headbutt in to the behind but Borne pushes up and gets into a pre victory roll position -not quite a headscissors.  (I'm not sure what Matt's issue with this is, it all seems clean enough stuff the guys could do without attracting comment.)  Leo gets up and Brigitte indeed does the victory roll. getting a few armstretch press pins for 1 out of it and even Leo getting 2 with a folding press attempt. Leo eventually gets rear double arms - if she had a surfboard in mind it doesn't come off as Brigitte somersaults out, catches Leo with a couple of ground position dropkicks and dodges a Big Splash. She gets a hammerlock , throws Brigitte into the ropes, trips her neatly and might have got a folding press only Borne rolls out of the way, nearly into the water. She tries the same hammerlock/ropes/trip sequence but Borne sidesteps and boots her in the behind.  Borne gets a waistlock, atomic drop and seated rear bodyscissors. She then lifts and dumps Leo a few times, the old Ah Ouais spot although the crowd don't chant it.  Leo tries unlocking the feet and leaning back for a pin attempt; neither succeed.  Leo turns in the hold to face Borne, possibly trying for a pin, in the end getting a back weakener and the chopping Borne down off the ropes.  She boots and Manchettes Borne down, slams her, hair drags her twice and gets in another few Manchettes.  More side chancery throws until Borne surprises her with a folding press from behind for the one fall required. Nice happy pop from the crowd.

Quite a slow methodical bout, very like German/Austrian Catch before Steve Wright revolutionised their style.  Although to be fair a lot of the space it the bout is used wisely for crowd working and psychology, this being very much a La Bonne Vs La Méchante match.

Only one bout this week. Looks like I'll have to find a bonus bout to match to two newies each in the British and German threads...

[ohtani's jacket]

You keep touting that Steve Wright theory like it's a) the empirical truth, and b) Steve Wright did anything special. 

[David Mantell]

... Okay, how about this?  Jean Phillipe de Lonzac, fine specimen of the New Catch generation takes on a veteran from Antenne 2, Elliot Frederico Le Rocky Du Ring..  Rocker gets the best of a top wristlock battle, throwing JP around. De L gets revenge, vaulting over and knocking the grim one off his Rocker.  He uses a splash on the bigger man! Rocker gets aside chancery throw into mat side headlock, coming out only to shouldeblock JP down. He gets the headlock again but JP pulls his head out to make a hammerlock then gets a headlock of his own. He cartwheels over Rocker's drop-down and gets an armbar.Rocker begs for mercy to slow things down. De L headlocks him and h3 tries a rope break and gets stuck in the ropes.  De L snapmares and flying bodyscissors and dropkicks him twice.

We cut to Rocker getting his heat back with chops and axehandles and illegal hairpulls and punches and stomps on a fallen opponent and a headbutt. He uncovers a corner and posts JP into the bare hooks. He does the same in the opposite corner and gets an Avertisement. He gets pressure points, knocks out de L's knees and Manchettes him.  He continues the illegal attacks on his fallen opponent (and a young kid too, to add to the heat), picks up JP and clotheslines him down. Rocker suplexes the youngster and splashes him for the pin.And boy are the Les Pieux crowd angry.

In Britain they tender to send kids as lambs to the slaughter to bigger heels in catchweight bouts like this - Fit Finlay and Danny Collins' first bout in 1986 springs to mind. We've got a similar deal here.

[David Mantell]

37 minutes ago, ohtani's jacket said:

You keep touting that Steve Wright theory like it's a) the empirical truth, and b) Steve Wright did anything special. 

This really belongs on the Germany thread but

1) He moved over to Germany full time so spent more time there than say Tony StClair or Caswell Martin.

2) He has done a lot of training work there.

3) There is clearly some sort of before/after aspect between generations, regardless of whether Steve is the cause, between the style of Axel Dieter Senior/Achim Chall/Roland Bock/Gunther Wagner and the style of Alex Wright/Ulf Hermann/Ecki Eckstein/Michael Kovacs.

In the context of Britain, Steve Wright was just another Ted Betley apprentice just like brother Bernie, both Bulldogs and Johnny Smith.  But someone Betleyfied 90s German Catch and he seems the likely suspect.

[David Mantell]

Was going to bump this up to provide context but can't find my original post so will post this anew.  I think it's still Didi refereeing this one and he does gomin the water.  I think they make reference to the Borne Vs Leo match at 21:00.