BillThompson Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 How can a match with something like 20 high impact moves and bugger all transitions not be a spotfest? It wasn't a bad match, but even if they build off their previous matches it was still spotty. Because a spot with context behind it isn't just a random spot. It has meaning, has been built to, has importance, etc. They weren't just randomly throwing out moves, and later in the match they were even playing off of moves/sequences that had taken place earlier in the match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 CMLL gets no coverage on most newz sites. AAA had some for Triplemania, but you never see anything about CMLL. Past people in rural Georgia, I think most wrestling fans in 2015 read these sites at least casually, so CMLL is just way under the radar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 How can a match with something like 20 high impact moves and bugger all transitions not be a spotfest? It wasn't a bad match, but even if they build off their previous matches it was still spotty. here Because a spot with context behind it isn't just a random spot. It has meaning, has been built to, has importance, etc. They weren't just randomly throwing out moves, and later in the match they were even playing off of moves/sequences that had taken place earlier in the match. What does it matter if the spots are random? If there's no spacing between them and the bout is non-stop then it's a spotfest. The word "spotfest" needn't be a pejorative. And repeating spots from earlier in the match isn't necessarily playing off them. Sometimes it's just repeating spots from earlier in the match. If they actually sold the spots like they were deliberately going for moves I could understand, but they don't slow down to signal that sort of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 Disagree with everything you said, but there's really no point in me debating this with you. Talking modern Lucha with you is like having your teeth pulled, a terrible experience that no one should ever have to endure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I wasn't going to reply to this, but I knew you'd say something about it on twitter. I'd just like to say to your follower that "oh" is authorized by the Japan Foreign Ministry in passports as a transliteration of the long vowel sound in "Otani's" name and not a misspelling like the both of you claimed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stomperspc Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I agree with OJ on classifying the match as a "spotfest". I have always a considered that term to be a match where the defining characteristic is the volume of the spots/moves. Some matches are defined by selling (either good or bad). Some matches are defined by mat work or for the brawling elements. It doesn't mean those matches have no other positive characteristics or are "nothing but [defining characteristic]" it just means that we group them by their defining characteristic. Dragon Lee & Kamaitachi built their match around a high volume of spots (like usual). It was a spotfest. I do think it was a very good spotfest. The quality of the moves was definitely high caliber and the execution was really good, particularly when factoring in the degree of difficulty. I thought they sold a little bit more than in similar matches. Like mentioned before, they built off of some of their signature spots from their previous matches in an entertaining manner. There are bad spotfests (ie. matches where it is is spot-spot-sport and the offense isn't even that great) and there are good ones. For me, Kamaitachi/Dragon Lee was the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pol Posted September 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I wasn't going to reply to this, but I knew you'd say something about it on twitter. I'd just like to say to your follower that "oh" is authorized by the Japan Foreign Ministry in passports as a transliteration of the long vowel sound in "Otani's" name and not a misspelling like the both of you claimed. Yo ugggh (flame emoji) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I wasn't going to reply to this, but I knew you'd say something about it on twitter. I'd just like to say to your follower that "oh" is authorized by the Japan Foreign Ministry in passports as a transliteration of the long vowel sound in "Otani's" name and not a misspelling like the both of you claimed. I didn't claim anything, I said why I thought you were doing it. If I was wrong, I was wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I agree with OJ on classifying the match as a "spotfest". I have always a considered that term to be a match where the defining characteristic is the volume of the spots/moves. Some matches are defined by selling (either good or bad). Some matches are defined by mat work or for the brawling elements. It doesn't mean those matches have no other positive characteristics or are "nothing but [defining characteristic]" it just means that we group them by their defining characteristic. Dragon Lee & Kamaitachi built their match around a high volume of spots (like usual). It was a spotfest. I do think it was a very good spotfest. The quality of the moves was definitely high caliber and the execution was really good, particularly when factoring in the degree of difficulty. I thought they sold a little bit more than in similar matches. Like mentioned before, they built off of some of their signature spots from their previous matches in an entertaining manner. There are bad spotfests (ie. matches where it is is spot-spot-sport and the offense isn't even that great) and there are good ones. For me, Kamaitachi/Dragon Lee was the latter. That's pretty much my take as well. Dragon Lee's title defences were always going to be a different beast from Virus', but it wasn't bad. I could have done without the stuff on the ramp and the use of the set, and I thought the third fall was too long, but there were a lot of cool things in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Evans Posted September 19, 2015 Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 I guess everyone was watching the ROH ppv but I caught most of the CMLL ppv tonight since CMLL forgot to put the stream behind a paywall and relased it for free. I missed the opener but the Maximo match was good and the main event was must see. Sombra's act is so great and Atlantis had the match of his life. Rush interfered in the first fall and again for the finish but that didn't hurt it. The finish was sorta shocking but I figured it would go down that way. The atmosphere was insane with Sombra's dad and mom crying and the crowd going nuts for Atlantis. There is nothing like a main event lucha mask match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jushin muta liger Posted September 19, 2015 Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 I fell asleep at the start of the show as I was following the ROH show as well but woke up and found out it was YouTube as well so I was able to stream to my Roku which looked awesome. I really liked the main event better compared to last years main event but that was because I have not followed Lucha that closely and didn't know the backstory with UG and Atlantis. Both guys tonight put on a great performance and Sombra to be only 25 is amazing. Just reading his body language after the match, he wasn't scared and looks likes gonna be the same Sombra but just without the mask. I think the future is bright for him and if he stays rudo with Rush, they are gonna be money for CMLL down the line as Ingobernables being their new Perros Del Mal. You only wonder which is gonna be lost first, Atlantis mask or Rush's hair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted September 19, 2015 Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 Just watched the main event and it was really terrific. Probably better than last year's main as a match, but it didn't have the history behind it so can't quite measure up to that. But Sombra was great and while I thought the outside shenanigans dragged things down early, they played well in the third fall. Much as it may not make sense to take Sombra's mask already, he has a great look and an incredible heel presence at just age 25, so I don't expect him to fall off at all. Rush on the other hand was so great throughout the entrances and his involvement in the main that I was almost hoping for him to turn on Sombra at the end to set up a hair match for next year but it looks like we'll get him and Atlantis instead and save hair vs. hair for down the road. Are any of the other matches worth watching? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Cooke Posted September 19, 2015 Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 Stompers 2015 Lucha recommendations http://www.crossarmbreaker.com/2015-lucha-ongoing-lucha-match-recommendation-list/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted September 19, 2015 Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 Thanks, added a couple from there to the watch list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pol Posted September 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2015 They're doing Rush vs. Volador Jr. next Friday. Could be great. The attendance of that show should provide some insight into the appeal of the guys that will be main evening for the next decade or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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