JerryvonKramer

I don't know if this means anything but after I completed my list last night I was looking at the spreadsheet and all of a sudden I was like "shit! Where's Stan Lane!". I'd forgotten to rate him. But then I didn't jump to go and give him a score and if it was someone else I might have done.

Would people agree that he's way better once he loses the belt and stops giving 95% of his matches to his opponent? That was my feeling.

Just want Dylan to know that I'm not trolling him here. My comment about drift towards favourites is something I genuinely believe but it's not from looking at anyone's particular process or motives. This mainly just comes down to the fact that I feel the project might have been helped by criteria being more specific and locked down at the very start. It was a conversation for 2014. Open criteria was interesting but ultimately I feel it led to more of a crapshoot. And I do fully believe that. I just want to be clear that I'm not accusing anyone of anything though and we are at the end so we have to roll with what we've got.

My list is as subjective as anyone else's. I didn't include guys from the 1950s or shoot style workers because they send me to sleep. I only have three genuine Lucha guys on my list. I've never claimed objectivity. And I've said you shouldn't rank Jumbo.

One thing that has been suggested however is done drill down analytics with some separate results lists, and I support that. And Steven designed a front sheet that should make it very easy to do. This is a way of being inclusive with the option at looking at more selective lists at the same time.

If anyone is interested I did do a short show with Steven some time ago called "Makin the case" and Jumbo was the subject. http://placetobenation.com/makin-a-case-for-jumbo-tsuruta-as-the-greatest-wrestler-ever/ Cliff notes version is that he's great in 70s, slows down 81-4 (but still has some great matches in this period) and then is awesome from Choshu's arrival to the illness. But listening to that might be easier than reading a 10-page thread for some and I throw out the essential matches.

Take a look at my Harley microscope thread and dig out anything at ***1/2+.

I've ranked wrestlers I legitimately hate such as Shawn Michaels, Mil Mascaras and Antonio Inoki. This is because against the criteria I set, they probably are three of the 100 greatest wrestlers in history. I think my hatred for these three guys is possibly more that Dylan's for Jumbo. However, the drift in this project has been towards top 100 favourite wrestlers (as opposed to GWE), since about week 2 of the process and per my response in the other thread at this point "it is what it is" and can't be helped. So I'm inclined to say don't bother ranking Jumbo on the basis that that there's no point in losing sleep over it. If "who would I rather watch today" is genuinely one of your criteria for deciding who the GWE is, then don't rank anyone you hate.

Incidentally despite the fact that I said that, my own preference from the start was for the ballot to be more selective but that isn't really what has happened so at this point it is what it is.

BIGLAV Incorporated Ltd. has now ceased trading. Thanking you very much for your custom. Total number of workers rated: 181 Top 100 complete. Stats breakdown 70s: 19% 80s: 43% 90s: 32% 00s: 6% British: 6% US / Canadian: 70% Japanese: 19% Luchadores: 5%

William Regal Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 3/3 2/3 3/3 (+1 for brutality) = 9 Intangibles 9 Great matches 1 Length of Peak 1993-2013 = 17+ years = 10 +1 ability to work babyface +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work gimmick matches +1 ability to work brawls +1 ability to work different gimmicks ("blowjob babyface in England") +3 ability to get over in multiple markets (England, Germany, WCW, ECW, WWF, Japan, indies) Ability to work different styles / roles rating = 8 Variety = 10 47

Tweaks: +2 Intangibles for Misawa -1 on selling for Hase +3 on Variety for Arn +1 Intangibles for Fujinami -2 Great matches for Steve Keirn -1 Variety and -1 Intangibles for Scott Hall

We've talked about this with Loss already, but at some point in the next week, we'll be running down our own top 100s on WTBBP in audio form, however the printed versions will not be revealed. One reason for this is we get a wide listenership outside of PWO who might be encouraged to put a ballot together after listening.

William Regal vs. CM Punk (12/28/08) This is a fan cam form MSG recommended by a certain Phil Schniedier, a man so influential that his political hit on Jumbo Tsuruta still reverberates around the internet to this day. I find him very entertaining on podcasts. Here is his review: http://segundacaida.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/wednesday-night-bootleg-regal-v-punk.html I liked the match less than Phil. It has some stiff work and we get a bit of chain wrestling out of Punk, but I watched this in the same day I watched Regal in Japan in 1995 and the difference is night and day really. Regal does let himself free from the shackles a little bit in this one, but it's still just a WWE house match and not a lot more in my view. I liked this about the same as the Austin strap match and the JBL match. *** William Regal vs. Dean Ambrose (10/13/11) This is another Schneider pick, and also recommended by Grimmas and Matt D. FCW. I'm going to be watching these Schneider picks until I get some dates on this Christian stuff from Matt. This is more like it. We can get some true grit in this studio setting, and there are some cool mentor vs. student type dynamics going on too. Regal is back to 95/6-levels of stiff brutality here. The elbows to Ambrose's head are sick. The threading of the hand and thirst through the turnbuckle and then attacking the prone arm is some pretty cool work. The wedging of the arm into the steel steps is just tremendous. Well this was just fucking brilliant and possibly the best Regal match I've reviewed for the purposes of this thread, at least on par with the Finlay Uncensored match. ****1/2

Phil, I'm going through some of your picks now. Currently the Ambrose match which is pretty awesome. I was wondering if you've seen that Mutoh match from 95 because I can't see why you wouldn't go EPIC on it.

Was it the one I reviewed here: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/31793-jvk-reviews-pimped-matches-from-late-90s-10s/&do=findComment&comment=5695623 Looks like I did like that one. From Velocity in 2005.

I need a good representative cross-section to make an assessment. It's also not like Regal is a new worker to me, I've been a fan of his since 1993. CM Punk match will be next.

2006: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/32779-regal-jvk-edn/?p=5732287

Let's see what he was like in 2006. William Regal vs. Chris Benoit (SD! 3/24/06) I have not liked a single iteration of this match up so far, in a WCW ring, in an indie ring or the more heralded memorial match. I just think they suck as opponents. Let's see if this one is any different. This had some neat touches but was ultimately job number #234 to Benoit for Regal. ** William Regal vs. JBL (SD! 4/28/06) JBL is US champ here and was involved in the Benoit match cheering on Regal. Someone who cares could probably fill you in on how Regal turned on him here. I think it's cos this taping was in the UK. JBL going for the absolute easiest heat with British fans here, which I have no idea why they've never run properly as an angle. I mean they did it with Canada and that isn't even a proper country. Could have been a dynamite angle that would have played huge here. Pretty good crowd work by JBL here. Regal comes out and also gets the cheap heat by agreeing with JBL that Tony Blair is a muppet. Easiest babyface heat possible in 2006. Let's go. Regal bleeds (hardway?) from the ear here. JBL brings some violence. In another life he might have easily been a Stan Hansen partner in AJPW. This was good. Crowd popped for the near falls. JBL's boots to Regal's head were awesome. *** William Regal vs. Rey Mysterio (SD! 7/14/06) Hate the King Booker angle with Regal I just don't believe the character would want to serve him. My interest in wrestling was probably at an all time low around this point and it was not long after I finally tapped out. Rey is world champ here. I do think Booker was good in the role though. I really don't like the whole Rey deal, sorry guys, just totally not what I am into as a fan in any which way. This match was just full of his signature spots without any rhyme or reason or anything. I mean, talk about the Flair flip and the Flair flop. This was the shits this match. DUD When was the last time I actually saw Regal win a match on any of this stuff? Anyway ... William Regal vs. Finlay (GAB 7/23/06) This is heel vs. heel as Teddy Long forces the match. This is a far cry from their awesome stuff a decade previous and there's a fucking leprechaun under the ring. Give me a break. Obviously they lay in some stiff shots but I really felt this lacked the grittiness that made the WCW series so memorable. We get a neat little sweeping leg takeover thing from Regal at one point. Crowd did not seem into this and bust out a loud "Boring boring" chant. That's a little unfair of them, because the match isn't boring, ADHD generation there not getting their fix of 619s. But this also isn't anything special either by their own standards. There are cool touches, like Regal losing his boot and Finaly stomping on this toes. But, genuinely, if anyone pimped this match in 2006 it's because standards and therefore expectations had been lowered and this felt half-ways authentic in an otherwise plastic environment. **1/2 William Regal & Finlay vs. Batista & Bobby Lashley (SD! 8/11/06) Finaly and Regal had two more matches, but I thought I'd skip ahead to this. Batista was pretty over here. Remember what I was saying about seeming authentic in a plastic environment? Batista is probably exhibit A. The Booker T and Michael Cole stuff is getting pretty tiresome now too. I hate to come across so crotchety, and I know people like some of this stuff, but fuck me if I never have to watch any 2006 Smackdown again after this match, I wouldn't mind. I really dislike the leprechaun under the ring gimmick. On the level of Bam Bam Bigelow vs. Multiple Doinks and Dinks level awful. It is wrestlecrap in the true not-even-so-bad-it's-good sense of that term. There isn't even kitsch value to be wrenched from it, it's just hideous. This match wasn't anything either. *1/2 ------ I have become disillusioned and actually feel pretty disinclined to continue. What started off today with some hot matches from the mid-90s has just become a depressing endless line of listless TV jobs for Regal. Watching this stuff is actively hurting his rating with each and every match, to the point where I'm thinking of cutting his peak at 2001.

Probably the Bulldog match from 93

Matches vs. Hash, Hase / Sasaki: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/32779-regal-jvk-edn/?p=5732253 Select matches circa 2001: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/32779-regal-jvk-edn/?p=5732263 Take away:

William Regal vs. American Dragon (MCW 5/5/01) As Regal comes out, a fan gets in his face and does the "suck it" sign to him. That moment has been captured on camera and he was a grown man. His shame will live on forever, I do hope he feels healthy doses of it today in 2016. If it was anyone on this board, you should be ashamed of yourself. Regal gets on the mic. "Well look young man, I don't know if you know who I am, but I'm the WWF commissioner and I can make or break you!" He gives him the chance to leave. "You've obviously got a hell of a career in front of you, you don't want to end it tonight by getting beaten in front of these pathetic people, do you?" He certainly has the mic work down by this point, I think the Regal-Bryan connection is interesting considering how stiff and aggressive Bryan would become in a few years. This match had a couple of moments but it wasn't anything really. ** William Regal vs. Chris Jericho (Cage Match) (RAW 5/7/01) I probably watched this as it happened. Man, 15 years. Seems a lifetime ago. Not a very good promo by Jericho who looking back did kinda suck didn't he. Regal comes out using the word "besmirched" a lot. I also used that word a lot in 2001 and no one knew I was slyly referencing Regal. It's Jim Ross and Heyman on commentary. Escape the cage rules. I felt so much happier watching the early 90s WCW stuff. A lot of headbutts in this match from Regal. This lacked the brutality, blood or hatred I'd want out of a good cage match, and the finish with the door being slammed into Regal's head as Jericho fell down sucked ass. This stuff doesn't hold up well at all. ** William Regal vs. Tajiri (SD! 11/1/01) Tajiri turns down the chance to join the Alliance so Regal assaults him in his office. With match is brought to you by Lugz. Cole and Tazz on commentary. Just a TV match. *1/2 William Regal vs. Tajiri (Rebellion 11/3/01) Paul Heyman claims that Regal is Tony Blair's role model. JR tells him off for "that asinine remark". This match took place in Manchester, England and Regal accuses the crowd of being on the dole. We also get a David Beckham mention. This is 2001 so the crowd are actually a proper crowd not a smart fan dickhead crowd. Refreshing. Although we are near the cut off point of modernity where my nose starts to bleed. I hate Heyman on colour around this time. Given that we just saw Regal basically kill Tajiri on SD, I'm not sure what the point of this match is. Didn't think much of it either. **1/2 William Regal vs. Steve Austin (Strap Match) (SD! 11/29/01) Michael Cole shoehorns the phrase "controversial WWF champion" about twelve times in the first minute here. To say I have no real love for this era or setting is quite an understatement. Lawler on colour. A lot of sick strap shots here from Austin in the early going. Although I was not a fan of the spot where he did the cheers with Earl Habner and the beer cans. Just took some of the intensity out of the match at that moment. This was okay, I suppose, notable for those sick strap shots, but it's not exactly a masterpiece of the genre. As in, I wouldn't put it on a level with Vader vs. Sting or anything like that. Regal's work has lost some of that insane intensity here. Comes from working in a video game environment like WWF in 2001. *** I don't really feel the need to see matches against Edge or RVD, I mean seriously fuck that. --------- Notable stepdown in the level of Regal's work during this stretch. I mean my real antipathy for the environment doesn't help but ... It's not like he's working scrubs here, and most of these matches aren't hitting any real highs. There is no doubt that Regal is a top 30 worker in the world here, but -- like someone like a Ted DiBiase in, say, 1991 -- he's a world class worker working very much within the limits of the WWF style, which leads to regular phoning it in. Of these only the Austin match would count towards his V rating, and none towards his G rating.

Steven Regal vs. Shinya Hashimoto (NJ 4/16/95) Unusual amounts of pomp and circumstance in the intros here. Regal offers his hand and Hash shakes it. Absolutely within character in this setting I'd say. Hase is on commentary. Regal seems to break Hash's nose hardway early and he has blood running into his mouth. Imagine someone brutally beating the living shit out the Stay Puff Marshmallow man and you have something approaching the visual of the first half of this match. Hash comes back with, what else, but stiff kicks. The violence in this bout is just about on par with the brutality seen in the Mutoh and Finlay matches, with a little more down time, but with the added visual of the broken nose adding to the pain factor. **** Steven Regal & Scorpio vs. Hiroshi Hase & Kensuke Sasaki (NJ 4/23/95) The way Regal regards Scorpio as he comes to the ring is awesome. Just a little look as if to say "oh they've given me you", pretty funny. Hase and Sasaki appear to come out to the theme of Cagney and Lacey, or similar. Hase as some chicks with him. I swear Hase is the "most American" of the Japanese workers, I'm wondering if he grew up watching WWF or NWA somehow. Just seems like he did. Here he has the women take his t-shirt off for him as sleazy jazz bears out, as if he was actually Rick Rude. Certainly puts the fun factor into an environment that can sometimes feel staid. He gets the girl to kiss his cheek before he gets in the ring. Proper showman. This match on paper looks kinda awesome to me. Regal works Hase's wrist Jim Breaks style. He's so fucking intense in this part of his career, like almost demented. There's one moment in this where he grabs Hase's head, knees him in it, and then cracks him with a European uppercut. It's just sick sick work. If I have a little niggle here it's that Hase kinda no sells that stuff, not in the moment, he takes the punches well. But immediately after this him and Scorpio get into the manly chest chopping /chest puffing routine. While this is in itself quite awesome, I'd have preferred to have seen a little more long-term selling from Hase there. When Regal comes back in he brutalises Hase some more and Scorpio powerbombs him. Quite the FIP sequence this. But most of it goes out the window with Hase's big swing. Sasaki really didn't do anything in this match apart from scoop powerslam Scorpio from catching him going for a cross body (cool); it was all Hase taking punishment, and getting roughed up by Regal. Really fun match but it could have been better than that if Hase had taken the match a tiny bit more seriously than he did, by which I mean actually selling the damage long term. Still if you are a fan of ANY of these four guys, this is recommended. *** Going to move on to Regal in the 00s now. I think in 95-6 he worked like a possessed demon. And was totally awesome.

Link to Hase thread doesn't work.