Ricky Jackson

I've only got a top ten in me tonight: 1. Hart 2. Savage 3. Flair 4. Backlund 5. Michaels 6. Cena 7. Hogan 8. Austin 9. Sammartino 10. Slaughter

Yeah, makes you wonder how many MSG cards were filmed by outside sources at the time. The comments on the video suggest Wolf showed MSG highlights often, so maybe there are a few more gems out there somewhere waiting to be discovered.

Just watched the Hogan vs Bossman 89 cage match from MSG a few nights ago and I thought Tony was pretty good here (as was Lord Al surprisingly enough), and I usually find him out of place in a WWF setting. For me, the downfall of Tony, and WCW announcing in general, was when endless discussion of the NWO infected every undercard match on Nitro and PPV to the point where it was beyond overkill.

Took me a while to find it again ("hulk hogan vs gorilla monsoon msg" finally did the trick) but here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2_N9Q36hNc

Going over the results on Cawthon's site, the MSG card with the Backlund vs Adonis rematch (2/15/82--a Texas Death Match with Putski as ref) really stands out as one of the most potentially interesting "lost" MSG shows, as there was also a Valentine vs Morales "Brass Knuckles Alley Fight" on the card I'd really love to see. What's the deal with the MSG shows, like this one, that weren't televised at the time? Were they still filmed? Are there examples of untelevised MSG cards showing up in trading circles? One example I can think of is the 6/16/80 card (Backlund vs Zbyszko, Hogan vs Monsoon), which wasn't televised but was filmed, as clips were shown with the sports highlights on a local TV station, and a video of that is on YouTube.

I've been a bit out of the loop---is Flair's return to WWE imminent? Also, looking ahead to MITB, who gets elevated this year? Off the top of my head it doesn't seem like they've been grooming anybody new recently. I could see Cena being in the Raw match, since I don't think he's ever been in a MITB before. Wouldn't be surprised if he won too. Edit: I guess Tensai is a good candidate. Maybe Clay?

Serious treasure trove of historical/Japanese footage on this YouTube channel http://www.youtube.com/user/CLASSiC1PW.

Hogan winning in 91 was the right call (send the fans home happy with USA triumphant on a night Slaughter won the belt), 90 maybe less so (could've ended the match with Perfect eliminating a brawling and distracted Hogan and Warrior), but you can't argue it wasn't what most fans wanted.

I kind of want to argue that Vince Sr was a better booker than Vince Jr (not promoter, although Sr has to be top 5 in that category) based on being able to come up with enough hot angles, stars, and match-ups to draw consistently well for around 30 years, with only a few cold periods (the main one in the late-60s due in large part to them losing TV in NYC), within the confines of the northeast. I can't pull a college-level thesis argument on the subject off the top of my head, but I think this isn't an outrageous statement to make.

It'll happen sooner or later, maybe as a hook for Mania 30 or something.

As far as I know he was a pretty big star in the 50's who basically used ballerina moves in the ring to frustrate his brawny opponents. I think he was mostly a babyface though, which is funny when one thinks of the stereotypical 50s homophobic crowd, but I'm not 100% sure about that. Edit: Not a ton of info on Starr out there (not even a wiki page apparently), but this blog looks to offer some good info on him: http://rickystarr.blogspot.ca/

I'm guessing he meant when they permanently go to 3 hours, which is sometime next month I think. So still a few more weeks of his unbelievable sadness with modern WWE.

Also, the King has never been more annoying than he is tonight, and I'm changing the channel to watch the Kings win the cup.

I've been away for three weeks and breezed through the topics I missed and all I have to say is that a part of me hopes the Punk/Bryan feud ends with a beard vs beard match. Seriously though, their feud seems fun (the promo segment right now with them, Kane and AJ is plain nutty) and I plan on watching their ppv match tomorrow.

Sounds like an interesting movie. I actually randomly stumbled upon that La Lutte movie mentioned in the article years and years ago on a Canadian cable channel one night. Missed the beginning and never caught the title, and had totally forgotten about it until today, so that's cool. What do you guys think of The Masked Man articles on Grantland? I've read most of them and some are very good, but I sometimes feel he pushes his whole "Reality Era" agenda a bit too much and gives WWE credit for coming up with meta-type narratives that just aren't there.

And according to Cawthon, Jake took time off after the DiBiase injury because of "legal issues dealing with charges of assault", with a "fractured disc in his neck" being the kayfabe excuse (although, didn't Jake suffer a legit neck injury from HTM's guitar shot and suffer life-long repercussions from it?). Jake's return bout didn't air until October 7th.

Don't remember this at all. A rare Mania to Mania feud.

The Jake/DiBiase feud did start in 89, right after Mania V. There was a match between Jake and Virgil on Superstars where Ted "injured" Jake post match, allowing him to take time off for either rehab or to recuperate from injury, maybe both. Jake returned post-Summerslam and the feud was rekindled, with matches at MSG in late 89, Jake being on the Hogan side vs DiBiase's team at Survivor Series, and probably house show matches around the horn. Feud ended, of course, at Mania VI.

And the homage to Race's mustache/sideburns combo.

I'm always glad for people to reevaluate Demolition. http://board.deathvalleydriver.com/index.p...p;hl=demolition or http://www.thehistoryofwwe.com/demolitionproject.htm respectively. And remember, the key is structure: when they gave, when they didn't give, how hot tags never came easy, and how yes, they generally break the wwf heel-in-peril dynamic. Great stuff Matt. Once again I'm blown away by the effort put into wrestling analysis exhibited by the people on this board.

Loved the wacky Wrestling Superstars dream matches. One of my favorite wrestling mag covers ever: Check out Jerry's unloved Pat O'Connor Memorial tag tournament thread for my Wrestling Superstars dream match parody. http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?showtopic=14288

I can remember when the Demos first debuted the Apter mags totally trashed them as being blatant Road Warrior rip-offs and treated them as a complete joke. Even though living in Canada I couldn't see JCP on TV (don't remember watching it on Pro Wrestling Plus, but that was a show I only caught sporadically anyway) and was a huge WWF fan, I totally bought into the pro-NWA propaganda of the Apter mags and held guys like Flair, Luger and the Roadies in mythical regard (The Roadies were always ranked number 1 in the tag team rankings even though they didn't hold any titles, so they had to be awesome!). So I didn't hold the Demos in very high regard at first, and defeating my beloved Strike Force for the straps didn't help my perception, but the face turn sucked me in and made me a fan. They were unique in the sense that they didn't change their style as faces, and they had a good run as fun ass-kickers for a year or more. Their theme music was also very memorable and is one of the more iconic themes of that era. I'm not saying the Demos are an all-time great team, but in the history of WWE they are one of the most fondly remembered, especially by the casual fans I know, and in a kayfabe ranking of the greatest teams in company history they would probably come out on top. I think they definitely carved out their own niche as a solid and super over team after initially being written off as Roadie imposters (Eventually by 1990 even the Apter mags capitulated, printing an article entitled "The Road Warriors: Demolition Rip-Offs?") and probably warrant a career revaluation.

What the hell, I'll fire this puppy back up with: Bob Backlund vs Harley Race, WWF title vs NWA title, 9/22 1980 MSG Just watched this for the first time. Really good match. I'm surprised it doesn't get pimped more often as one of Backlund's better MSG matches. Great crowd heat, no commentary, both guys juice, and yes the finish is weak, but its WWF title vs NWA title, so you know it's not going to end decisively. And for whatever it's worth, nobody could work a headlock spot like Bob. Definitely track this one down if you're a fan of Backlund and/or Race.

OK, so the show reads pretty bad, but Martin is just batshit crazy at some points during the review, including this gem of a quote about the closing segment : So he basically implies tonights crowd were a bunch of idiots for daring to like something he hated. Yeesh. The end bit with him comparing Vince to Al Davis did make me chuckle though. Did they really cut Show's balls off as bad as Martin made it seem?