ohtani's jacket

I think Inoki was handsome. I don't see a problem his chin. There was a time when a Captain America square jaw was masculine. Inoki vs. Backlund draws may be for the enlightened, or perhaps I saw the only good one, but I'd take Inoki over so many people's heroes.

You might wanna quote the sign off in your post. The rest of us aren't that bright.

Y'all are way off the mark on Inoki. Backlund/Inoki draws are tough to sit through? Can people upload more of them cos I really wanna see them. I get that his style was boring at times, but the wrestler himself was anything but boring. Shooting on the nephew of the Great Gama in Pakistan with only your ring aids to cover your back is ballsy. All of his fake MMA matches were ballsy regardless of how much cash he shilled out to the participants. I haven't watched the Ali fight yet. but what other wrestler aimed that high that they tried to take on Muhammad Ali? He makes Takada and Anjoh look like pissants for the challenges they laid down. Inoki's not just legendary in Japan because he was tall, handsome and good at BS'ing. Not that long ago I thought that Akira Maeda was more badass than any political figure from his era could be, and maybe he still is, but Inoki is nowhere near as fake as I once thought.

Inoki vs. Kintaro Oki was such a cool bout. Inoki potatoed him to start with and they worked this really awesome cagey defensive bout until Oki started unloading with headbutts. Kintaro Oki, where have you been all my life? Inoki bled hardway but fought back with that legendary punch of his. Perfect minimalist wrestling. If you're a fan of Fujiwara or Nishimura or Ishikawa vs. Ikeda then I don't see how you wouldn't see this as a spiritual forerunner to that type of wrestling. I need to see more Oki or die wondering.

Rayo isn't seriously left to come is he?

Rudge and Fiera did really well.

I have a feeling I'm on such a different wavelength than most of you that my explanation won't mean much, but... When I made my list I had a hard time separating who I "liked to watch" and who I "thought was the best". It's not like baseball where there are pure stats to go off when saying this guy hit more homers than this guy but did so during a period where the pitching was worse and etc... So even if I look at someone like Flair (who I ranked just below Boss) and know that he's regarded as one of the best and brings a lot to the table, if I'd rather watch a Bossman match, than Bossman is "better".I can't step outside myself and go "Well Flair is liked more by people that have watched a lot more than me so he is a greater wrestler". Again, it's one of the reasons I didn't feel comfortable ranking Japanese guys despite watching hundreds of matches from those promotions. I wouldn't know where to rank Kobashi or Misawa without being completely influenced by what others think of them. And watching that stuff is like eating my vegetables. I do it because I know the classics are good to have watched, but I don't typically like them as much as appreciate them. He was super effective as both a face and a heel. Even though he was already Big Bubba in WCW when I started watching (mid-90s), I knew he had been Big Bossman in WWF and was SHOCKED to eventually find out he started out as a heel before that early ‘90s run. And that turn angle with Dibiase is a high point of character development for that era. Up there with the Savage/Hogan/Liz turn. His bumping was fantastic, not just as a big man, but as a wrestler. And for a guy with his physique, he was astounding in getting the most he could out of his character, a master of facial and body expressions. I’d rather watch his reactions during his matches than most wrestlers’ actions. I'd rather watch him in anything, be it a 2 minute squash or 25 minute slog than every other wrestler except the 9 above him on my list. All the guys I've been the high vote on so far (Ouillet, Cabana, Jacques, Steiner, Steen, and Bossman) are all guys I'd drop almost anything to watch a highly pimped match of.

Nothing on Cota? He didn't go that high in the end. It's impressive that he made that many ballots. He probably made more ballots than matches seen. .

Bossman being higher than Sasaki and Yatsu is awesome. Those muthas served hard times.

I'm kind of interested in how Navarro got so many votes last time. It must have been because of the IWRG Dandy stuff and maybe the indie Misioneros stuff. I was the high voter on Emilio in 2006 (#48). I don't think his singles stuff stacks up as well as Casas, Satanico or Santo. He has some nice singles stuff but he also has a lot of bouts that are too short, too slight, and disappointing given the talent involved. MS-1 was my #4 in 2006. I had gotten a bunch of '89 lucha and marveled at how he worked with tecnicos. I remember thinking he was like the Jumbo Tsuruta of lucha. Obviously he's not the fourth greatest wrestler to me anymore, but I do think he's somewhat underrated. Most of his non-Sangre Chicana stuff is overlooked. Even the Infernales stuff.

Emilio wasn't a good enough singles worker to finish much higher.

He was related to Emilio Charles Sr, who invented the rana, which was later used by Rey Mysterio Jr to devastating effect in a match you rated ** 1/2 stars.

Really? I thought he did quite well. I don't know who Sam DiMascio is but he must be of good stock.

Havoc.

There's a big drop off in all Japanese pro-wrestling in the late 90s. The wrestlers were damned if they did and damned if they didn't. They couldn't maintain the status quo and the audience weren't going to accept a minimalist aesthetic, so bigger and better became the mantra. Blame the promoters/television execs for not drawing new talent to upset the apple cart.

The Rey/Eddie match he's talking about is one of the best experiences I ever had watching pro-wrestling. The only thing that compares to me is Bret/Diesel from Survivor Series '95. So yes, I think it's amusingly low.

I really only skimmed over the argument, but I believe Dylan was referring to the late 90s where things started falling apart for All Japan. Specifically, he mentioned the 6/99 Misawa/Kobashi match.

I was kind of dreading the prospect of watching a Joshi broadway tag but the 6/93 Kansai/Ozaki vs. Hotta/Inoue tag ended up being an easy watch. Stylistically, it was more of a JWP tag than an All Japan one, which meant that the bulk of the match was slower than the typical All Japan tag but also less prone to excess. From the get-go it was transparent that one side would work the other over and vice versa. You could pick what would happen in each of these segments and every time the girls would make a miraculous recovery on the apron, but the bout was never boring which I think is a tremendous accomplishment for a 60 min bout. Takako reminded me of why I thought she had one of the all-time breakout years in '93 and Ozaki... I wanna talk about Ozaki for a second.The job she did here selling the top rope powerbomb was nothing short of extraordinary. It was actually kind of scary considering what later happened to Plum. I have no idea how someone could watch that and not think she's one of the all-time great sellers. Are they being disingenuous? Do they have an ax to grind? I have no idea. Of course she recovered her senses to continue with the stretch run and may lose points for that, but those moments where Kansai was checking whether she was alive, basically, were tense and heart stopping if you watched it in real time. Ozaki was carted off in the post-match interview because of how shook up she was, so if it bothers you that she recouped from the powerbomb at least she sold the bout afterward. Next up, Thunder Queen.

Ha ha, I almost spat my beer out on that Rey/Eddie rating.

I thought you claimed you weren't lowballing anyone. BIGLAV was a complicated beast.

Turns out the YouTube version only showed the first fall. The full version had more of a climax than I gave them credit for. Powers went into total heel mode after the first fall and Inoki had to fight through injury to take the title. Didn't change my opinion of the match much but at least it rounded out that rough edge.

The Powers match I saw was good but not one of Inoki's best. If anything it epitomised how a lot of people see Inoki: as a guy who lies around on the mat for long periods of time, picks things up a bit, then lies back down again. I kind of see Inoki as more of an interesting worker than a great one, but I can see why people find his style boring. His matches don't build to a dramatic climax and despite the bid for legitimacy they're not that great shoot style bouts either. I respect his single-mindedness, though.

A few things I should have added -- my opinion on WoS workers has changed a lot over the years. I've done backflips on guys and 180s. It's possible that I could be higher on Iron Fist in the years to come. There's a bunch of guys I softened on over the years and a few guys whom I hated at first that I eventually began to enjoy. The difference between those guys and Myers is that they didn't suffer the same burden of expectation. I expected them to suck and they surprised me. With Myers, I expect every match he has to be good, and all of his matches against top guys to be great, because he was my gateway guy in WoS (v. Grey) and I really do think highly of him. And even w/ the Iron Fist gimmick, I think a few of his matches w/ Grey are legit #1 candidates on the never-to-happen DVDVR Euro set. I think he had a really great match with Haward from the 80s as well. Plus the tags with Marty Jones against Finlay and Murphy that I don't think are available online but are revolutionary in terms of British tag wrestling at the time. Oh, and Skull Murphy wasn't a JTTS. He got a strong singles and tag push after everyone bailed to All-Star. He won quite a few of those rinky-dink tournaments they had. Murphy is actually a guy I grew to love. I hated him at first now I love him. Wish we had footage of his dad as he seems like a chip off the old block. And this is meant to be helpful (not snarky) since everyone seems to be struggling with it, but when you're pronouncing Hokuto it's closer to Hok-to than Ho-ku-to. And Joshi is more like josh-she than Joe-she. Mr. Saito is also closer to sigh-toe than sigh-e-toe.

I've been watching as much Schmidt as I can find. I was starting to think he was a bit of a one-note brawler whose matches were all the same until I watched one of the Thesz bouts. Loved the early technical stuff and the way things escalated from there. Loved the step up in intensity from his other bouts and the "business is about to pick up/shit done got real" feel to it. The brawling felt more vicious than in other fights and Thesz' receipts were badass. Of course there was no way it was going to end cleanly, but who cares. This one was destined for a scmozz and was a great, great fight.

Strongly disagree that Kudo is better than all but a few of the women who have dropped.