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Everything posted by ohtani's jacket
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A lot of Kansai's best stuff is from 1996-1997, though. Her peak was probably from around '89-97, which is a fairly typical peak for a Joshi worker, or any wrestler really. Her GAEA work holds up in spots if you divorce yourself from any emotional investment you had in her as the heart and soul of JWP. It was hard to see her fade after being such an incredible leader for that promotion. One of the greats, for sure.
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Jones vs. Mercier wasn't very good. Marty seemed to lose a clip after the outstanding match against Bull Blitzer (Steve Wright) in '86. I don't think he was ever the same. I'm not a big fan of the Owen match, however, so YMMV.
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Blue Panther vs Vulcano (AAA April 18th, 1993) Finally, we reach the apuestas match. As soon as Tirantes was announced as the ref I knew he'd get involved. A few minutes later, he disqualified Panther and Vulcano won the opening fall. Then Pena got involved and removed Tirantes from the match. Casas' dad took over as the ref and then he disqualified Vulcano. Somebody remind me why this promotion was so hot? It reminds me of Vince Russo jumping to WCW. The tercera was mostly nearfalls. It speaks to the power of an apuestas match that the nearfalls were as good as they were considering the match had no body. In fact, the tercera was pretty much the match itself. There wasn't much in the way of brawling. For all intents and purposes, they could have been working a title match. However, the crowd was red hot, so at the very least it entertained its primary audience. It was better than Atlantis vs. Mano Negra, I suppose, but I kept wondering why they couldn't just let the two guys go out there and try to have the best match they could. Then, somewhat amusing, Vulcano had his hair cut instead of taking off his mask. I guess I didn't listen properly or was listening to music while watching the bout. I naturally assumed it was a mask vs, mask match since the thing Vulcano wears looks like a mask. All that for a haircut? I guess there was a reason why nobody ever talks about this feud. The redeeming feature in my eyes was how over Panther was with the crowd. Next up, I'm going to take a look at matches that may feature Panther in a more favorable light. Or not.
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1958.11.8air Joachim la Barba vs Jakob Thoma + Hans Schwarz III vs Jose Marques (Berlin) la Barba is working a comedy catchweight bout here against an extremely limited heavyweight opponent. Schwarz vs Marques is the best footage so far. Instead of clips, we get extended sequences from the bout. Both men are skilled and work a style that is similar to French Catch. Marques was a Spanish wrestler, so I guess you could classify it as a continental style. It seemed that most of the skilled workers of this era could travel between France, Britain and Spain and work seamlessly with local opponents. 1960.10.18air Hans Schwarz III vs someone + Oskar Muller vs Bill Martinez (Munich) Here's Schwarz again. His opponent looks a bit like Inca and does a lot of fun, exaggerated selling. Schwarz is one of the most skilled workers I've seen thus far. Muller is the stereotypical German wrestler. It's like watching the love child of Axel Dieter and Roland Bock. Bill Martinez did this spot that modern wrestlers should ape. He scored the pin, do a backwards roll, rolled forward again so that he was standing over his opponent, then taunted him in his face. 1957.11 Hermann Iffland vs Josef Kovacs + James Brown & Matthias Rösges vs Roman Waniek & Hans Dillinger (Wiesbaden) There was a lot of excellent wrestling in this clip. Iffland and Kovacs wrestled like men, and Kovacs wore Dick Shikat style tights, which I always approve of. The tag match featured something I've never seen before. Instead of standing on the apron, the tag partners stood in each corner holding onto the tag rope. At first I thought it was because there was no space on the apron for them to stand, but then they did a spot where one guy was placed over the top rope onto the apron. A very weird but interesting visual dynamic. I'd be curious to know if all German tag wrestling was like this at the time or it was unique to Wiesbaden. The wrestling and comedy in this bout were first class.
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Jerry Estrada/Vulcano vs. Blue Panther/Tony Arce (AAA April 11th, 1993) Man are they dragging this out. It's Panther vs Vulcano not the fight of the century. Early on, it felt like they had gone back to the square one in terms of the apuestas feud,, but that wasn't Panther's fault. It felt like bad booking on AAA's part. Then Panther was forced to work what you might consider standard, or perhaps even classic, lucha exchanges with Jerry Estrada and suddenly it was the best that had happened since the feud began. So, clearly Panther isn't a great brawler. Then, finally, Panther's mask was ripped open, and you could see the top half of his face for the rest of the bout. It took them long enough to reach that stage, and I can't really fault Panther's selling from that point on, but overall, perhaps not the best use of Panther. Then again, at least they were using him. That in itself is kind of a Catch 22.
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Some German film footage. 1965.8air Horst Hoffmann vs Ian Campbell + Leif Rasmussen vs Micha Nador + Mustafa Shikane vs Josef Molnar (Wiesbaden Ian Campbell shows up in the most interesting places. It's a shame we don't have any of his matches from ITV. He was mostly playing a stooge heel in these clips. Shikane vs. Moinar was wild. Very stylized and strange lightweight wrestling. It almost felt like performance art. 1962 Geoff Portz vs Paul Berger + Rene Lasartesse vs Jose Arroyo (Berlin) The German newsreel directors liked to focus on crowd reactions a lot. Must be that history of expressionism. Not a lot you could really gauge from this other than Lasartesse worked the same way in the 60s that he did in the 80s. The only difference was that he looked younger. 1965.5.8 Josef Kovacs vs Ian Campbell + Horst Hoffmann vs Jose Marques + Ricki Starr vs Leif Rasmussen (Karlsruhe) Speaking of expressionism, this stands off as a montage of the matches shot at various different camera angles, then shows extended clips of Ricki Starr vs. Rasmussen. As best I can tell, Rasmussen was a Buddy Rose style worker who seemed like a real character. The clips are fun, and I imagine the full match would have been similar to the great Les Kellett vs. Bobby Barnes matches. 1971 Leif Rasmussen vs Hansi Roocks This clip is already in circulation. There are some decent exchanges but the main focus is on interviewing women at ringside, and boy are there some interesting hairdos.
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Which luchadores are you ranking (2026 edition)?
ohtani's jacket replied to cad's topic in Greatest Wrestler Ever
How deep does this list go? I keep wondering if certain names will show up. -
Zarak & La Bete Humaine vs. Michel Di Santo & Eddy Mores (9/30/81) I thought this was going to be the drizzling shits, but it actually wasn't that bad. Di Santo and Mores were incredibly game, and whoever was under the La Bete Humaine mask was a pretty good worker. He had to be, too, since he did the lion's share of the work. I'm assuming that Zarak was Dave Larsen. He was pretty average, but grew on me throughout the bout kind of like a French Rayo de Jalisco Jr. There wasn't a shred of technique, really, but for a heavy metal circus bout it wasn't bad.
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Los Destructores vs. Blue Panther, Jerry Estrada & Herodes (AAA, April 4th, 1993) This was the most fired up Panther has been in the feud thus far. It didn't lead to anything great, but it was a step in the right direction. Panther and Vulcano finally began brawling in the tercera, however instead of the violence escalating, they did some cutesy shit where Vulcano got his win back from the week before by cheating. Not as enjoyable as the first match.
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Los Destructores vs. Blue Panther, Jerry Estrada & Herodes (AAA, March 28th, 1993) Here was a chance to see how Panther does in a proper apuestas feud, and the answer is not that great. It's not entirely Panther's fault. He wants to square off with Vulcano but the Destructores wind up triple teaming him. The beatdown is okay, but Panther doesn't get any shine before the rudos take over. When Panther makes his comeback, it's no different from the tecnico comeback in any trios match, and he botches the finish to the segunda caida, which ruins the visual. He tries to punch Vulcano in the tercera, but the rudo ref won't let him. Again, not his fault. His big moment in the match is pinning Vulcano while holding the ropes, which is both a retaliatory move and a nod to the fact that Panther used to be a rudo himself and knows a trick or two. However, nowhere do you see the type of intensity you expect from this sort of match. I don't expect Panther to be as intense as El Dandy, for example, and I'm not sure that his role as a masked tecnico allows him to be, but the bout gave me a renewed appreciation for how good Santo was in these situations. I don't think the booking does Panther any favors, but I think it's because his selling isn't very good. The best guy in this is a broken down, past-his-prime Herodes, who was hugely charismatic. In fact, I actually thought a Herodes vs. Vulcano feud would have been more fun than this. If Panther sold more like Herodes, I'd be a lot higher on this matchup. That said, the bout wasn't boring, so it wasn't a major loss. I don't have much hope for them ratchetting things up, but I'm determined to see it through to the end.
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The Beginner's Guide To British Wrestling
ohtani's jacket replied to ohtani's jacket's topic in Megathread archive
Mark Rocco vs Terry Jowett (5/23/73) This is the earliest Rocco bout that I've seen and predates the 1974 Lee Thomas bout that I have in my collection (though that match is in color and I'm fairly certain exists in full.) This is an interesting bout from a historical perspective as it shows a young Rocco making headways in the world of professional wrestling. He hadn't come into his own yet. That happened when he began feuding with Marty Jones. However, it had an unexpected finish that was much better than what I was expecting, -
Great stuff, Phil. Undoubtedly, my favorite era for catch. I was surprised by Adolf Kaiser being cancelled.
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The New Frontier is an incredible piece of work. Cooke was a major loss. Lord only knows what else he could have created. I just recently read his Spirit/Batman crossover and it was a lot of fun.
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This, and the Colin Joynson match (which exists because I know someone who got it out of the archives) were anomalies though, and I think it's mostly Elijah guiding Daddy through the match and Daddy, for some reason, determined to show he can hang. I do quite like the tag matches Daddy had around this time, but I'd have to see more from the archives to believe Daddy was on this sort of trajectory until his brother made him a star. Hogan proved it over and over again.
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The only time I would compare Hogan to Daddy is Hogan vs. The Dungeon of Doom, and maybe Hogan's 1993 run in the WWF. Prime Hogan, there's just no comparison.
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Blue Panther vs. Vulcano (AAA, March 21st, 1993) This was decent. I liked that they attacked each other while they were still wearing their entrance attire, and that Panther worked the entire first fall with his jacket on. His comeback was okay, but it highlighted how difficult this sort of match was for him. He was the tecnico here, but he lacked the apuestas experience of a Santo or a Villano III, and of course he couldn't be expected to have the dramatic presence of a Pirata, Satanico or Dandy. When we think of Panther do we identify with him as a tecnico or a rudo? I'm talking about pre-unmasking. I suppose for the majority of his career he was a rudo, but what sort of a rudo? His role seems poorly defined. He's constantly presented as a maestro figure regardless of whether he's on the rudo side or a tecnico. This seems to be one of the biggest weaknesses with Panther. The match ends with a Horsemen style beat down on Panther, which was disappointing at first but probably would have been a hot angle if we were talking about Crockett. Panther sells it well, but will he bring an extra edge to the apuestas match?
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Bret Hart vs. Davey Boy Smith (WWF, 6/30/92) Not from the 80s but close enough. This was the famous dark match that Bret and Davey Boy had prior to SummerSlam '92. The story Bret always tells is that the match was awful and that when he got to the back Vince said, "I hope it's better at SummerSlam." Then Davey returned to England and spent the entire summer getting messed up on substances, while Bret spent his every waking moment thinking of how to work the greatest match ever, or so the story goes. The match is kind of mediocre, and it feels like they're going through the motions, but I don't know if it reaches the threshold of "awful." I'm not sure what else to expect from a dark match, to be honest. It's at the very least interesting. If it had been on a MSG card or something it might even have some fans.
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I'm not sure if anyone was impressed by the hold itself, but merely the fact that it was Hogan doing it. It was an effect of the tape-trading days where we didn't have access to as much footage we have today to know that Hulk was trained to a reasonable extent in the territories and worked harder in Japan in general (as mostly everyone did.) I remember being part of tape trading circles back in the day and trying to get people to agree to get All Japan matches and there was always someone who wanted to get Hulk vs Muta or Hogan vs. Hansen instead.
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And Hogan could have the next Hiro Matsuda, but the point is that Daddy was awful. Hogan was never awful. At least not during his peak Hulkamania years. I could give a crap about Hogan doing a hold in Japan. I'm talking about working competent house shows and main events. Now I realize Hogan throwing a punch or whatever isn't going to appeal to you, but if you ignore your preferences for a second, Hogan's actual mechanics were better than Daddy's. Hogan vs. Andre at WrestleMania III may have been a poor wrestling bout compared to some of their early bouts, but it is nowhere near as bad as Daddy vs. Haystacks at Wembley Arena. You can get as sentimental as you want about the era, but that's a hill I don't even need to think about dying on because it's as true as the sky is blue and the earth goes round the sun. Vince's original plans are open to speculation. His most recent comment on the matter was that he was considering Dusty. If Hogan had meant to be Superstar v.2, I think you'd see a lot more of that in his gimmick. Muscles plus blonde hair equals just about every wrestler in the 70s and early 80s. Cornette says Hogan got a lot of his shtick from Austin Idol, but the truth is he picked up things from all over. Watch him cut promos in Memphis, he's not trying to be Idol or Graham. If anything he's doing a weird version of Terry Boulder.
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Hogan was never as bad as Daddy in the ring. In fact, for the most part Hogan was a competent worker. There was a time in the 70s where Daddy was reasonably competent, but that's about where the similarities as workers end. Hogan was also a much bigger star than Daddy. I don't think Hogan was a ripoff of Superstar Graham. That's lazy, second hand hearsay. Graham cut the same sort of promos that Dusty did. Hogan never cut promos like that in the territories. When he first started, he wasn't a particularly strong promo. The closest thing he did to that sort of promo was as Thunder Lips. It was Vince who got him doing those coke-riddled promos about moving mountains and swimming across oceans.
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Anton Tejero is a good worker to follow. He's a solid worker with a relatable heel shtick, and an entertaining performer.
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Wrestling went off the air in New Zealand in early 1991 after a bunch of complaints that kids were copying the moves. As a result, I never saw the tail end of Hulkamania in real time. I only saw it later on VHS. I do remember once I finally got access to WCW thinking that Hogan's act was fairly lame, but then he became the Wood and was relevant again. At no point was he as bad as Big Daddy, though. That's a slight.
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Blue Panther & Vulcano vs Rocco Valente & Tony Arce (AAA March 14th, 1993) This was shorter and more focused than the previous week's bout. The main purpose of the match was for Vulcano to turn on Panther. Panther spent most of the match being beat up. He was fine in that role so I'll giving him a pass mark for this week.
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I suppose, in many ways, I wouldn't have become a wrestling fan without Hogan. Territorial wrestling had died out in New Zealand when I was a small child and was no longer on television. The WWF became hot in Australia before New Zealand. I remember I had an uncle who lived in Australia who came back to NZ for the first time in like 15 years, and we were sitting in my grandmother's living room on the night he returned and he wanted to watch two things, Married with Children and WWF Superstars. That was the first time I saw wrestling. I clearly remember watching Hacksaw Jim Duggan hit Andre the Giant with his 2x4 on the episode I watched. Then it blew up at school and was massive for about a year until Ninja Turtles took off. We had the Apter mags and various non-WWF wrestling tapes, but I don't believe I would have been exposed to wrestling if not for Hogan. Folks always talk about the WWF going national. They actually went global.