Dan

I looked it up, here what the WON said in September: "If you are wondering how WWE views the work of Chris Nowinski in the Chris Benoit case, the company made the decision this past week to remove Nowinski's name and all of his information and connection with the "Smackdown Your Vote" campaign from its website. He is still under contract with the company, but the expectation is he won't be used anymore for public speaking engagements and he'll never to anything affiliated with the company again. You have to give the guy credit for balls. He could have made his name on examining footbaIl players and left the Benoit case alone, but he was front and center, caIling Michael Benoit, looking to get his okay, even though it was weIl known one of his employers wasn't going to be happy with the idea. "

“You think it's fake!? What's that? Is that fake? What the hell's wrong with you, that was an open hand slap.” --- Dr. D. David Shults, 12-28-1984

I didn't quite get that either.

If I'm reading this thread right, we can't watch any matches of wrestlers who are sleazeballs, or is it just Benoit? If it's the former there's almost no wrestling you can watch guilt-free.

Estrada killed a whore, McMahon is the evilest man alive...what did Takada do?

Oh yeah CCW. I saw tape of a few of their shows years ago. The thing I remember is they had a dreaded leech match, and before the bout Necro ate one of the bloodsuckers.

So they don't care. That's understood. That said, Mick Foley got a huge reaction for falling off the top of the cage and then getting chokeslammed through it. WWE was smart enough to never do it again (without gimmicking). WWE is far more successful than ROH or TNA, and they've done it by creating characters people care about. With effort, any indy could accomplish the same thing if they really wanted to. And it should be noted, that second fall was accidental and shouldn't have occurred in that fashion. That was planned. Foley just lies about that.

Blue Demon (Sr and Jr) is a pimp. I have an issue of FHM were he's modeling swank suits while hot women fawn all over him.

I don't know, the worst thing I know about Flair is made a stewartess touch his wang. Schwarzenegger Heiled Hitler as a youth has had group sex, and groped numerous women. And nobody seems to mind much. There could be worse things about Flair that could come out I guess.

When did AAA start getting good? I don't think I've seen it since Pena was alive.

Pro wres and MMA have three things in common, that I see. They both feature men in their underwear grappling with each other. They both are about making money. And they both use personalties. And that's about it. So boxing is pro wres, like Meltzer seems to be thinking? A De La Hoya fight has all those things. Other sports too. Baseball and football aren't the same thing because they both throw balls at each other and play on a field. Except if in pro wres if you hurt your opponent, you're doing something wrong. In mixed mar you're supposed to, or at least incapacitate them. Fairly big difference.

Heyman and Gabe told him it was, so yes. It's not that far of a stretch actually. He already considers MMA to be pro wres. And punching is a part of MMA. Kicking is in MMA, so maybe soccer is next.

Whoah. Where'd you hear this?

They're fairly similar.

About Vader, I remember reading that he and Misawa had some dispute, and the next thing you know, Vader gets a visit from the Yakusa. I don't know if there's any truth to that though. Anybody ever hear that?

What are some tales about the Yakusa and wrestling? And specifically what was the whole story with the Vader incident?

My all-time favorite quote about wrestling: "Just look at what I do for a living. My mother worked two jobs so I could graduate from NYU. If she could see me now, working with lesbians, midgets, faggots, freaks, druggies, dirty old men and all the other types of creeps." -- Herbie Freeman, ca. 1950s

This isn't really a con but a lot of these aren't so I'll add it anyway. Boxing = pro wres: Gabe and Paul Heyman conned Dave into thinking that Floyd Mayweather is the best heel in the business.

Wrestling is extremely sleazy, but porn is just so much darker it's not even funny. Or to put it another way 2girls1cup is worse than that video of Sayama torturing those trainees. People who think "illegal porn" shouldn't count in this discussion, are looking at it from a U.S. perspective. If you talk about young-boys scrubbing Baba's ass, you have to think about all the horrible pornography in that country. I imagine there's places were every sick thing imaginable is produced legally.

I think I liked Chokehold better. If you read this and nothing else you'd think people like Johnny Valentine, Jim Barnett, Eddie Graham and Billy Wolfe were saints. In other words, needs more sleaze.

Kennedy is great, and is an obvious future star. There room for improvement in his ring work, but that will come.

Shrunken testicles? I guess all the rumors about Jim Barnett might count.