El-P

I know. Thankfully !

It works because it's cute and fun, because they are married, and everybody knows it.

I'd say yes because it's where they had to shuffle the deck after the Tessa debacle and a bunch of people getting fired from #SpeakingOut. It's not the best show (but again, IMPACT with no crowd has not been the same) but it's really the starting point of what you have today, basically it jumpstarts the story of Eric Young coming back and the Swann rise to the top. I love the whole Wrestlers House stuff during the summer.

The issue with that, is that when Mike Awesome was doing a simple plancha or top rope splash, the 200lb guys where doing twisting ranas and quebradas and whatnot. Not the same thing, sorry. This whole argument is totally skewed to me, because obviously the flying big guys are *not* doing everything that the 200lbs guys are doing. Even today, yeah, Lance Archer and Brodie Lee are super agile big guys. Are they doing the same thing Fenix (ok, not fair, no one is doing what he's doing) or the Young Bucks are doing ? Of course not. To me this argument, which I've heard countless times, doesn't work because it's simply fallacious. The Vader case is interesting because Vader was absolutely unique. I heard people in the past saying Vader was working too fast, bumping too easily, doing the "little guys spots". Except... If Vader worked like say, One Man Gang or Earthquake, what makes Vader special ? Well, nothing, especially in the times when he showed up. He would be just another big guy. The fact he would do so much, including the moonsault, made him special and absolutely contributed to making him a star (not the only thing, but it was part of it). Also, who did the moonsault back then ? Actually, I can't think of even a bunch of "small guys" who did it on a regular basis in the US. The guy who got it over in the States was the Great Muta, who wasn't a small guy by any stretch of the imagination. Then you had 2 Cold Scorpio, who wasn't a small guy either, I mean by the standards of the time maybe he was and even that is debatable, but he showed up in WCW after Muta and after Vader. When the 200lbs guys from Mexico and Japan showed up in WCW, who worked like them ? No one. Hell, what big guy from today does everything the 200lbs guys from 25 years ago did ? Maybe Brian Cage (because he's a jacked up small guy) to some degree, but again, that sets *him* apart, not the other way around. Mike Awesome absolutely needed to do the Frog Splash, because doing great-flying-spots-for-a-big-guy was absolutely part of what got him over both in FMW and ECW. That and throwing people onto tables. If Mike Awesome doesn't fly around, what's left ? Well, he wasn't a really solid worker otherwise (and was a crappy promo), he was a big high spot guy so yeah you had a hundred powerbomb variations because he came from FMW, the land of the powerbombs, but what set him apart and put eyes on him was the fact he could do all this flying shit that looked, well awesome for a guy his size. Did it look like what Hayabusa or Liger or Sasuke were doing at the same time, no. It looked super impressive for Mike Awesome, but again he certainly wasn't doing the same spots as the great juniors of the time. The "for his size" is what matters here. So there, that argument never worked for me. (EDIT : actually I wonder if Bam Bam Bigelow is not the first guy in the US doing the moonsault regularly, which would make the moonsault a "big guy move" by default. Let's also note that Jimmy Snuka was a jacked-up dude and not a small guy at all. Like the Samoan Swat Team, who were also doing the top rope dives and stuff. Do we need to mention the Road Warriors with the flying tackles and TOP ROPE CLOTHESLINE in the 80's. Which is something Barbie was doing too. Yeah, the more I think about it, the less sense it makes. Tons of big guys were flying around and were doing more impressive stuff than you run of the mill dropkick/armdrag smaller babyfaces. The day every 300lbs guy works like Juvy in 96, yeah, then it's an issue probably, but until then...)

Stop this bullshit NOW ! Don't touch to my beloved IMPACT promotion with your godawful Screamin' Useless Cultural References Mauro' ! The guys is the worst announcer since Mark Madden. Calling Eric Young is WWE reject is really missing the point completely. Young is a TNA guy who had a cup of coffee in WWE. Him coming back to IMPACT is really coming back to his home promotion. Yeah, it's awesome, especially since Madison is so quick with her putdowns. At times you almost you "hear" the smile on Matthews face when Madison just drops insults on him. Matthews is not a guy I'd want by himself or with a weak or annoying partner, but he has excellent chemistry with both Callis & Madison.

I love Matthews & Rayne together. Mauro is an absolute turn-off to me.

You really want to ruin every promotion I love @C.S. ? That's not nice...

Yes she did. I wish they would bring her back, either as a announcer or a manager (because really, Vickie Guerrero... yikes, she's not been good).

Madison Rayne is really good at everything she does. She is totally killing it on announcing and making her team with Matthews as fun as Callis was, Locker Room Talk is always a highlight whenever it's on. And she was a terrific character pretty much as soon as she left The Beautiful People for her first single push in 2010.

Yeah, his character was not the flashiest, but his World Title reigns promos where very good for what he had to convey, his stuff with Owen was really good too. Plus, let's not forget the pile of shit he was dealt with for most of 95, there's no way you can shine working promos about Isaac Yankem or a kiss my feet match with Lawler or cut money interviews about a pirate stealing your jacket. He certainly was hidden during the Hart Foundation days under Jim's charisma and crazy promo style.

It didn't seem like he was ! Because that's a scary thought ! Maybe that's the thing, the NXT environment really catered to his worst instinct and he would be better somewhere else. Well, he couldn't be much worse anyway, so...

Exactly. Not to mention, Mauro is yet another WWE guy in the mind of the audience. They absolutely don't need another "star" announcer coming from the opposition. And Mauro sucks and would ruin my fun, but that's beside the point.

Honestly, at this point, if I were a worker and Ross would shit on me like that, I'd go "Ok boomer" on his ass. And yeah, we don't need a three men booth anyway. Excalibur & Schiavone are just fine. Would give the broadcast more air. As far as "looking choreographed," well, that's what some of the same guys were telling about Eddie & Benoit & Rey & Juvy back in WCW. And what some guys from the 60's said about the Midnight Express and Ric Flair and Steamboat. Get with the program already. Say hello to 2020. And yes, the problem here is that Ross is PAID to get the product over. Not publicly shit on it. If he can't do his job, bye bye.

Come on, Bret was an awesome promo guy in 1997. I also love the jaded, "I know this company can't book me right for shits" 98 Bret Hart actually.

Wow, this thread. You're a bunch of salty MFs ! Hey, today I pretty much celebrate my 30th anniversary of becoming a real pro-wrestling fan. Yeah, probably taped my first show 30 years ago, two weeks before Xmas holidays, so that must have been it. Brutus Beefcake, Bushwhackers and Rick Rude squash matches and the likes. 30 years later I get to see Tony pop Sting with his classic call, the most obscure call-back even with Se7en (21 years in the making) and Don Callis & Omega appearing on two companies shows the same week. And a bunch of actual good matches. Needless to say, it's been quite a ride. I wonder what the fuck did I do with my life too, in the meantime. Hey, nothing could follow last week's show anyway. And now I realize I watched way more pro-wrestling not only than I should have, but also than I most probably will in the future, damn that's kind of a depressing though !

So I watched that Salina promo, she basically is talking about Mil Muertes. Either that or they are totally stealing the gimmick ! Hey, that's not the worse idea in the world, if anything I would watch those matches (but I'd rather have them do this act in IMPACT, where you kill actually kill people). What is Low-Ki wearing ? Looks like he's going surfing or something.

It's hilarious. They sign Keith Lee. They don't let him be Keith Lee. > "Keith Lee can't work right ! He has to go back to the Performance Center !" Not exactly new, but still.

He absolutely wasn't Owen Hart, Kurt Angle or AKINO (prodige rookie of ARSION who became a terrific worker in no time and whom probably everyone has forgotten apart from those who remember the all-time classic HamaKINO vs LCO bloodbath).

I know this match. I bought all those tapes from Lynch back in the days. Yeah, Kobashi was not a factor then. Kicking out of fucking german suplexes in 89 in undercard matches with tag team guys and rookies ? Killing the business with all those movez, I tell you.

Oh yeah, I totally forgot about that one. That was bad.

Ok. I admit I haven't watched a match with Charlotte probably since the Mania main event with Ronda & Becky. But a few years ago when I was following the product more or less for the women, I used to love Charlotte and she was having tons of very good to great matches. And she came off like a star. And the crowd absolutely cared about her. So, for that reason only, the Orton comparison doesn't work for me. So, my question is, has there been an actual backlash on Charlotte at some point or is it one of those bizarre PWO takes (like with Angle) ?

I have, in lenght. A long time ago though, so it's absolutely possible I'm clouded by my latest vision of Kobashi's work, which is the NOAH Kobashi, which I've rewatched a few years ago.

Ok, there's some misunderstanding here. By "stiff" I don't mean "stiff" the way we refer (or used to refer) as crappy workers. I meant the way he used to do athletic spots. You could absolutely feel it was not natural for him and that he was putting a lot of effort into it. Compare it with Mutoh for instance, who looked like he was literally sliding in the ring (or Windham, or Owen). But that doesn't mean that he wasn't already excellent as a worker and showed potential as a futur star. He never ever looked like Misawa either in the ring, but then again, Misawa is one of the most fluid wrestler ever. But yeah, like @NintendoLogic said, Taue was a former pro-sumo, he had to be a great athlete to get to that level. You simply don't make it otherwise.

Different context though, it's really hard to come off like a big star in IMPACT in 2020, without a crowd. Swann with the IMPACT crowd going batshit insane would maybe change your perception. Tessa sure came off like a total star. I don't know if I would go that far, but I had been clamoring for a Rohit push forever and now that he's getting it he's been awesome at it. He reminds me of Chris Candido in some ways. Tenille has struggled for a long time before she finally hit it with this current character, which is absolutely great. Taya, Tenille, Deonna, Grace, Su Yung, Rosemary, Hogan, IMPACT's women division is just stacked with talent and cool characters.

Except you are not interested in these guys because you know them from... well, WWE, and not "a different promotion entirely". Case in point, you mentioned two specific context which were 205 Live and RAW.;) I wasn't a fan of Myers at first, but as always with IMPACT I just waited for it to developp and I enjoy him ok now. Hey, at least we agree on Eric Young (and Rohit Raju, who's terrific). BUT THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT IT IS !!!!! AND THAT'S WHY IT'S COOL !!!! Like it would have been super cool to have, well, not Hogan because blah, but for instance Bret Hart or Randy Savage working with Tony Anthony in SMW in 1994. Would have been fucking awesome too ! Or like, if Flair had actually worked Shane Douglas in ECW in 95 or 96 ! That would have been sooo fun. Of course there's the big fish in small pond effect, because it's the case ! But that doesn't make it less cool. Well, that was the point.