Territories Bracket

[jpchicago23]

No Ole for Georgia? You're the Georgia guy so I'm not questioning you're ranking just wondering. Also would we be adding the next four it going with this 16?

[KrisZ]

If we are going 80's then Ole doesn't make the cut.

 

There you have a 16 promotion bracket with 4 men making it a perfect 64. The promotions are listed in order of population basically.

[jpchicago23]

Ok, i like that. We can have other people chime in as far as the names go and so where that takes us. I'm content with the territories listed unless someone else objects. I'll give it a little while before we go full on bracket mode. Also what do you guys think about the head to head matchups, would it be Territory A's four vs. Territory P's four as a whole and the winner advances? I see Funk and Hansen represented in AJ so that helps me be ok with not having a free lance but i did notice Murdoch isnt anywhere on the list and he seems like a pretty big name to not be in there somewhere.

[jpchicago23]

Should i just make a poll for the territories and go with the solid 16 that get voted or just take what Kris Z has?

[goc]

I guess Harley fits in Central States, but I always got the impression he only worked there when he wasn't getting booked anywhere else. It's unfortunate that true Central States all stars like Mike George and Art Crews can't be represented.

[jpchicago23]

If we're only doing territory vs. territory we can have 5 guys each but if its going to be individual match ups we have to keep it at 4 to have 64.

[Ricky Jackson]

Should i just make a poll for the territories and go with the solid 16 that get voted or just take what Kris Z has?

A poll or vote of some sort would be more fun.

[jpchicago23]

Yea i guess we would have a concrete answer as well. So we'll just take the top 16 territories that get voted and use those. Then based on the number of votes i guess that will determine the seeding as well. So is it possible for everyone to fit on 16 things in a poll? Never made one before but it looks easy in the poll options part of the messaging.

[Boon]

Would have to shuffle a few around to squeeze in Rick Rude...

[jpchicago23]

I figured out how to create the poll but I don't know how to add it to the thread

[Guest Nell Santucci]

Hmm, why not place Harley Race elsewhere and scrap Central States? I am arguing for Stampede to be its replacement and am suggesting that the top 4 guys there to be Bad News Brown, the Dynamite Kid, Bret Hart, and Davey Boy Smith. Dynamite was seen as one of the top guys of the early 80's, though I suspect he is getting excluded due to his junior status. But then again, he feuded with Bad News Brown.

 

To KrisZ, why not switch Kevin for David? David is seen as a far bigger star. Granted, David died in 1984, but this is a poll based off of early 80s guys.

[Guest Nell Santucci]

Another possibility - and I know this is breaking convention - is to make an arbitrary "Junior territory" of the top 4 NJPW and AJPW juniors. If this arbitrary "Juniors Territory" is seen as more useful than, say, Continental, I think that would be a good move.

[jpchicago23]

I'll add the options to the poll once I figure out how to do it. It looks like you can only use 20 slots so we might be out of luck on the others. If someone knows how to set the poll up chime in so I can create it.

 

The tentative 20 I had to be voted on for 16 spots were :

 

AJ

NJ

Memphis

Mid South

WWWF

WCCW

Mid Atlantic

Puerto Rico

Europe

Portland

Southwest

Continental

Central States

Florida

Georgia

Mexico

Canada as a whole

Freelance

AWA

 

I'm forgetting what 20 was but there's the gist of it

[Ricky Jackson]

What's the exact timeframe, 80s or just early 80s?

[jpchicago23]

Probably best to go early 80's so that most of the territories were still alive and jcp and wwf didn't have most of the talent us wise.

[KrisZ]

Kerry was the biggest star of the bunch by a mile. David had a short shelf life because of his death while Kevin was on top the whole decade plus was the better worker.

[jpchicago23]

Ok i finally have the bracket set up. If someone thinks i should replace a territory with something else just give me a heads up. I think this is a solid 20 and the top 16 will make it. We can decide on the top 4 or 5 from each region after the voting is done. I'm not sure how this will work because it looks like you only get one vote. If someone can help, let me know.

[khawk20]

If you're covering the all-time wrestlers in a territory, the AWA would be Verne, Bockwinkel, Crusher, and probably Mad Dog Vachon.

 

If it's just the 80's or something like that, never mind...

[JerryvonKramer]

This is jumping the gun a bit, but I want to go through KrisZ's picks and suggest one or two alternatives for each territory. Just to get the ball on that discussion going.

 

WWF

 

1. Hulk Hogan

2. Bob Backlund

3. Randy Savage

4. Roddy Piper

 

This is a very solid 4, and it's hard to think of many people to put against them. Tito Santana would be one person. Possibly Don Muraco as well. And finally -- and this is a very outside pick -- has anyone REALLY explored Iron Sheik aside from the Backlund and boot camp matches? Don't know how much of his 79-80 run made tape but I'd warrant there might be some hidden gems in there.

 

AWA

 

1. Nick Bockwinkel

2. Crusher Blackwell

3. Sgt. Slaughter

4. Curt Hennig

 

The obvious person to look at as an alternative would be Rick Martel. Sarge moved around quite a lot and I wonder if (without seeing his 85 stuff) as a pure AWA worker Martel might not be a stronger pick? I haven't seen a single pre-WWF Martel match where he hasn't been at least "very solid".

 

All-Japan

 

1. Jumbo Tsuruta

2. Genichiro Tenryu

3. Stan Hansen

4. Terry Funk

 

Hard to argue with those four. Choshu and/ or Yatsu would be alternatives but it's hard to see a case for including either of them over Hansen or Funk. If you tot up total amount of time spent in the promotion and no. of matches though, I wouldn't be surprised if Choshu and definitely Yatsu had more than Funk in All Japan. If early 80s is the focus though, Funk is almost a pre-requisite, unless you run with that "freelancer" category.

 

New Japan

 

1. Antonio Inoki

2. Tatsumi Fujinami

3. Kengo Kimura

4. Akira Maeda

 

My exposure to New Japan is limited as I've yet to work through the set. I wonder if there's not a case for Choshu here too though.

 

World Class

 

1. Kerry Von Erich

2. Kevin Von Erich

3. Chris Adams

4. Terry Gordy

 

Would it be out of the question to include Michael Hayes? Few people make me think of that promotion more than he does.

 

Mid-South

 

1. Junkyard Dog

2. Ted DiBiase

3. Hacksaw Duggan

4. Butch Reed

 

This looks about right, but Mr. Wrestling II might get a look in. If there's no "freelancer" category then where do we put a guy like Chavo Guerrero? Clearly he's in the top 25% of the workers of that era, but he never stuck around anywhere long enough to be associated with a promotion. He seems to have been a staple of the old LeBell LA promotion but LA isn't being represented here.

 

Florida

 

1. Dusty Rhodes

2. Kevin Sullivan

3. Barry Windham

4. Dory Funk Jr.

 

Since mostly everyone thinks Dory sucks, I wonder about Jack Brisco for this. In my recent research of him, I found that he spent about 85%+ of his time in Florida after his title run. The footage IS OUT THERE, but if anyone has ever got hold of it or seen any of it, I don't know. What I do know is that from what I've seen of Brisco in that timeframe, he smokes Dory -- I'd say his brother does too.

 

Georgia

 

1. Tommy Rich

2. Buzz Sawyer

3. Masked Superstar

4. Paul Orndorff

 

This would be the other place to put Brisco, given that he was a stakeholder. I don't know how much TV there is from Georgia in 83, but Brisco was active then and having decent matches. From my many conversations with Chad (soup), I also know that the Armstrongs were big local stars in Georgia and that Bob Armstrong was seen as a legend there. Whether Armstrong worked for GCW or how much Armstrong there is on tape I don't know.

 

International

 

1. Dino Bravo

2. Rick Martel

3. Jacques Rougeau

4. Raymond Rougeau

 

This is the Montreal territory right? I know nothing about it at all other than that Bravo was a big star and Dave Musgrave is an enthusiast. Both Maddog Vachon and Pat Patterson feel like they'd be relevant from what I've seen on the 24/7 roundtable show.

 

Northwest

 

1. Buddy Rose

2. Billy Jack Haynes

3. Rip Oliver

4. Matt Borne

 

Proper obscura for me. For mainland USA promotions, I think only the Maritimes is more obscure in terms of what I've seen of it. Looking at the history of the Portland title, Stan Stasiak was a 7-time champion and Jay Youngblood seems to have had a short but reasonably successful run before he left for Crockett.

 

Southwest

 

1. Tully Blanchard

2. Gino Hernandez

3. Bob Sweetan

4. Manny Fernandez

 

This is a territory that feels like it can go to me, just too small time. If it stays this is another place Chavo Gurrerro could go. How much footage is there in Southwest?

 

Central States

 

1. Harley Race

2. Bob Brown

3. Rufus R. Jones

4. Buzz Tyler

 

The most slept-on promotion from the 80s? I am intrigued by the brief tag-team that Marty Jannetty had with Tommy Rogers in 84-5, known as the "Uptown Boys": if Rogers wasn't too green, it can't be bad. Jannetty held the singles title as late as 86, so I wonder if he might be someone to look at for this?

 

Mid-Atlantic

 

1. Ric Flair

2. Ricky Steamboat

3. Wahoo McDaniel

4. Greg Valentine

 

My instinct would be to ditch either Wahoo or Greg Valentine for Ron Garvin, especially if the emphasis is more on 80s Crockett than 70s Mid-Atlantic. Ivan Koloff was a real stalwart for that company too during the early 80s. Arn Anderson naturally, is someone else to mention, as is Tully if South West is ditched -- if it is then Tully is a lock. Ole Anderson was a big star in that promotion. Ricky Morton isn't on any list, he would be an outside bet for 80s Crockett. If the focus is late 70s rather than 80s, Paul Jones probably warrants a mention too.

 

Memphis

 

1. Jerry Lawler

2. Bill Dundee

3. Dutch Mantell

4. Austin Idol

 

Tommy Rich? Koko B. Ware?

 

Continental

 

1. Bob Armstrong

2. Ron Fuller

3. Robert Fuller

4. Jimmy Golden

 

Totally forgot this place even existed. Eddie Gilbert?

 

WWC

 

1. Carlos Colon

2. Abdullah the Butcher

3. Hercules Ayala

4. The Invader

 

No idea at all beyond Colon and Abby.

[jpchicago23]

Yea guys like Chavo and Murdoch would definitely make the freelance category for me. Dont know for sure who the other two would be. i mean if we wanted to make this drawn out and very complete we can. As soon as the 16 territories are set we could even have voting for the 4 guys in each if we want to go that far with it. I just need someone to chime in and help me understand the bracket i made

[Dylan Waco]

Ditching Southwest and keeping Central States would be insane. Hell Southwest was a bigger promotion than Continental and Portland too and at it's height was drawing well enough to compare with some of the other regional staples on the list.

 

I will also say that if we are going purely on footage in particular territories in terms of voting no one from Florida, Georgia, Montreal, et has any business getting very far because there is so little of it. I think the guys should be voted on for their 80's careers, with relative regions being their "home team" for lack of better term but that's just me.

 

I don't hate any of Kris's picks but it feels wrong leaving Choshu out and I have a hard time leaving Hayes out from WCCW just because I thought he was arguably the best guy on the Texas Set.

[jpchicago23]

Yea i agree with the home team aspect totally. Was Southwest the Blanchard fed?

[Dylan Waco]

Yea guys like Chavo and Murdoch would definitely make the freelance category for me. Dont know for sure who the other two would be. i mean if we wanted to make this drawn out and very complete we can. As soon as the 16 territories are set we could even have voting for the 4 guys in each if we want to go that far with it. I just need someone to chime in and help me understand the bracket i made

If Choshu doesn't make a region he has to be a freelancer. I would argue for Fujiwara too.

 

If we do Europe I guess Jim Breaks, Marty Jones, Johnny Saint and Mark Rocco (who I'm not even that high on) would be the best four.

 

If Lucha is going to be one category I would go El Dandy, Satanico, La Fiera and Emilo Charles Jr. but it's really tough and I could see Sangre Chicana and others as well.

[JerryvonKramer]

Dylan, there does seem to be late 70s Florida stuff out there. There are several rather massive packs (no seeders) on XTC with I'd say over 100 matches from that period. No one has ever uploaded it to youtube, but there is some stuff there.

 

Yea guys like Chavo and Murdoch would definitely make the freelance category for me. Dont know for sure who the other two would be. i mean if we wanted to make this drawn out and very complete we can. As soon as the 16 territories are set we could even have voting for the 4 guys in each if we want to go that far with it. I just need someone to chime in and help me understand the bracket i made

I wonder if it would be giving Funk too much of a massive advantage if you make him freelance and stick someone like Choshu in for All Japan?

 

Another way of looking at it, is that if we assume Flair and Lawler are going to be early frontrunners, you're only getting a small portion of Terry and coming and going was pretty much part of his gimmick.

 

Another freelancer I'd point to, who might make up a 4 with Chavo, Murdoch and Funk is Terry Gordy. He seemed to have that Texan thing of never staying in one place for too long. If he became a freelance pick it would open up space for Hayes in World Class.

[Dylan Waco]

Yea i agree with the home team aspect totally. Was Southwest the Blanchard fed?

Yes.