Harley Race vs. Rick Martel (2/3 Falls) (1/12/80)

[goodhelmet]

Harley Race vs. Rick Martel (2/3 Falls) (1/12/80)

Disc 1

[garretta]

First fall: ​Martel controls most of this fall, working over Harley's arm. But the crafty champion turns the tide by dropping Rick throat first across the top rope, then busts out a piledriver, a reverse neckbreaker, a diving headbutt, and a high suplex in rapid succession. That's too much for the challenger, and it's the suplex that finishes him off. Race leads one fall to none with about nine minutes of disc time remaining.

 

This is a rematch that isn't a rematch, according to Frank. Apparently, there was some sort of controversial decision in a match between Rick and Harley the previous Tuesday, so the NWA wiped the match off the books and ordered a second match (which isn't a rematch because the first match technically never happened), which is what we're watching. Okay, guys, if you say so. (Frank says that Rick deliberately got himself disqualified, but it had to have been Harley who did; otherwise, why would Rick have been rewarded with a second match?)

 

Even though Harley doesn't get a whole lot more offense here than he did against Billy Jack, he looks better here, probably because Rick in 1980 was several country miles better as a worker than Billy Jack was in 1983. Harley had a tough task against Billy Jack if you think about it; he had to lead the match against a rookie who didn't know much more than squat about wrestling while still making said rookie look like a world beater. Here, his job is much easier.

 

The sleeper's being promoted as Rick's money finisher right off the bat on this set, as Harley wastes no time in getting to the ropes the second Rick puts it on him.

 

Piper must have just turned face here, because Rick has only agreed to team with him if he (Rick) loses this match. By the time of the next match on this disc (4/26) Piper and Martel are flourishing as a team and Piper's on his way to becoming the Northwest legend he remains even in death.

 

If there was an LA battle royal in 1980, it must have been one of the last ones, because LeBell didn't stay in business much longer. The MSG tournament that Lonnie Mayne supposedly won is bunk, in case you didn't know. If there had been a tournament at MSG at any point in the seventies (which there wasn't), no one would have won it but Bruno, assuming he was entered.

 

Interesting to hear about Portland Wrestling​'s sponsors putting up a thousand bucks to entice Buddy to sign a hair match. This is the first time I've ever heard of such a thing, and it could only happen in a place like Memphis or Portland where there are true local sponsors. Even regional companies like JCP and statewide promotions like Georgia and Florida had too many sponsors in too many markets to pull something like this off. I wonder if they ran a similar angle in markets like Salem, Eugene and Seattle.

 

There must have been bad weather over the last week in the Northwest, because Frank reads a list of canceled shows and their makeup dates, and he also tips his hat to the few thousand "hearty souls" who made to the House of Action the previous Tuesday.

 

Even in 1980, no one wanted to run any events opposite the Super Bowl, as Frank points out that the spot show running that night has a bell time of 7PM Pacific (The game kicked off at 3 Pacific that year, which is 6 Eastern).

 

​Second fall: ​Outside of a few lucky headbutts from Harley, Rick dominates this fall, almost getting a submission with what Frank calls a reverse abdominal stretch, then slapping on the sleeper. Harley doesn't offer much resistance, and soon he's in dreamland and we're even at a fall apiece with about three and a half minutes of disc time remaining.

 

I was right about Harley being the one who was deliberately disqualified in the previous match; while he's flailing away in the abdominal stretch, he almost hits Sandy, and Frank surmises that he's trying to get himself disqualified again.

 

Just for the record, Dusty Rhodes' five-day reign as NWA World champion in 1979 wasn't recognized by Don, as Frank says during the first fall that Harley has been champion for three-plus years. I'm guessing that Tommy Rich's reign was similarly ignored in 1981. (I wonder if Dusty's '81 reign was recognized; I haven't watched all the matches from that year yet, but you know that Buddy would have been screaming his head off for a title match if Dusty had been scheduled to come to Portland.)

 

Aniother Frankism: "Spinning suplex drop" for a reverse neckbreaker (from the first fall).

 

What is it with Martel refusing to wake opponents up from the sleeper? He did it against Buddy in the second match between them on the disc, and now he's doing against Harley and blaming the fans for it. I doubt they were planning on turning his heel, so I don't understand why they've done this twice now. Thank heaven Sandy threatened to disqualify him if he didn't wake Harley up. (I watch matches out of order depending on what I'm in the mood for, so if I talk about a match that's yet to come chronologically as if it had already happened, that's why.)

 

​Third fall: ​Rick gets the sleeper on Harley twice in the final three minutes or so, but Harley escapes outside the ring the first time and the time limit expires the second time. The match ends in a 1-1 time limit draw.

 

I'd never heard the term "flail kick" for a kickout until Frank used it. It's an accurate description of what a kickout is, and I wonder why more announcers didn't use it.

[AJS]

There was plenty to enjoy in this match. I know a big criticism of Harley is that as champion he gives too much to his opponent and it looked like it would be the case here with Martel controlling the arm for much of the first fall. I did think though that after Race hotshotted Martel on the ropes and worked on the neck, things were more even and it became more of a give and take bout. Both men's punches looked great and they both bumped and sold really well. I love Harley's suplexes and the fire Martel brings as the babyface challenger. A great way to kick off the set. ****1/4

[Johnny P]

I’ve never liked Harley, but Martel’s pre-WWF work became a revelation as I jumped from 80s set to 80s set. His work with Flair in All Japan. His work with Lawler in that Memphis match. His work in the AWA, especially vs Bockwinkel. I’m excited to see what he can bring to a big time match in an excellent atmosphere like the Portland Sports Arena.

 

This match is 2/3 Falls for the NWA Heavyweight title. Race is the traveling world champ, so he makes Martel look good because he’s of the mold that making a local challenger shine is part of his job description. Martel responds to a slap before the bell, and shows fire from then on. Race tries to slow it, stalls, bumps, and sells for Martel just as the formula often dictates. He even gives the vaunted Harley Race bump in the corner over the buckles to the floor. A big move in this match is body slam, so there's nothing too flashy, but the story is better and more consistent than most matches the last 15 to 20 years.

 

Commentator Frank Bonnema is a joy who adds so much real world feel and local flare to this presentation. He’s everything I loved about Harry Kalas and Richie Ashburn on the radio when I was a kid, growing up listening to Philadelphia Phillies baseball games in the summer. The way he fills in how every promoter wanted this for their town, or reacts to the fans reacting to Martel working the arm with holds, is calm, understated and yet trusted. It's what I imagined people thought of Walter Cronkite delivering them the news in the 1960s.

 

First fall hinges a lot on how much movement/the type of movement you need in your wrestling, and if a charismatic Martel constantly finding a way to isolate a frustrated Race's arm and ground him can hold your attention. The first few minutes I'm into it, the next few I drift, wanting some sort of progression or dramatic story beat within the match layout. Martel usually does something to bring me back - until it doesn't. Highspot here is Martel sending Race from the top buckle to the mat and then going right back on the arm, but this gets long in the tooth for me as he cranks the holds without seeming to progress towards a finish from there.

 

Race turns the tide on a stungun across the top rope on Martel's throat, then a pile driver. The pile driver is the oddly lackadaisical version where Race falls back, slowly. In fact, from this point forward it's a run of dated and soft offense by Race, reminding me why I never got into the guy. I do realize the match itself is “dated,” but some offense looks great when properly executed no matter when you perform it. Race pins Martel somewhere after the 15-minute mark, and continues his dominance in the second fall, but I still can't buy the guy in his lofty position. I hope this changes after watching him and Funk from Houston, but I think he's average at best offensively in the ring (and that IS considering the time period), dull or uninteresting in his movements and how he executes them, hyperbolic in others. The two things I can find about him to justify his reputation are his look and persona. His mic skills, which seem to be an extension of those two things in sound form, flow from there and are great. The first fall did lose me by the end, and for better or worse I’ve identified Race as the culprit, the guy steering the ship in my estimation, in this one. Maybe that’s unfair.

 

Part of my problem, I realize in the second fall, is that the struggle feels very real when they are in holds, but getting into those holds does not feel like a struggle at all. 5 minutes remaining announced to crowd early in the second, so you can see where this might be headed, and that seems reasonable given they're not going to do a title change in front of a few hundred fans in Portland, Oregon. Martel's piledriver looks better than Race's, even doing the fall-back version, and part of that is that Race is a bigger guy so it seems more “wild and out of control.” Race gets his foot on the ropes, a heel champ move I’ve loved in Flair and Danielson title runs, and I love it here. Martel’s offense looks excellent, gets the fans into the idea of him winning, but not completely convinced or losing themselves. His offensive hot streaks are the best part of this match, and his execution really is great in a way that feels "real" in a wrestling context. He's faster and younger, but the vet champ continues to sidestep and outsmart. I enjoy that character dynamic. Martel uses a sleeper that is (to me) the perfect length, wins the second fall. 1-1 tie, and the fans are emotionally all in now. I’m pretty there too, frankly.

 

Cool old-school moment where Martell wakes up Race from the sleeper, which is a storyline thing in the seventies. Love the explanation and play-by-play from Bonnema.

 

Early in the third—and deciding—fall, Race gets caught in the sleeper again, but he's too wily and takes it to the floor immediately. It looks great and folds perfectly into the match story progression. Piledriver tease on the cement floor becomes a back body drop. Countout tease isn't as over as you'd hope, but he brings him back in and is in complete control. Really does feel like everything's falling into place and clicking, with possible exception of the arm work from the first fall not meaning anything—but you can always argue it was a tactic that wasn't successful to begin with, a perfectly acceptable part of a story.

 

Race just bumps and sells like crazy as they announce 1 minute left. His offense is played as desperate and unearned. Martel grabs the sleeper once again, Race is perfect with theatrics of struggle and fading, but it is a time limit draw. Match ends as a draw.

I'll say this: it all came together well, Martel looked great both in work and execution, but as a storyline babyface, and Race played his role perfectly. As a card carrying Race nitpicker this may have been my favorite Race performance in isolation. I wasn't a big fan of the arm work going nowhere in the first fall, and I like the concept of the heel turning it around and stealing the fall to go up early, but it really didn't resonate. However, the second fall course-corrected the pace issue and the internal logic, and the finish to that fall was great ( Martel tried several times for the sleeper, so it made sense to have him win with it). Third fall brought it all together and left me legitimately interested in a rematch. Solid to very good stuff that emotionally involved the fans. If I were gonna quantify this for a recommendation (which is what star ratings really are) I'd go 3 ½ Stars

[Johnny P]

Other stray thoughts:

 

-I'm just in love with Frank Bonnema and I'll be gushing periodically throughout the process. I love the breezy way he announces by himself. I love the charm of the local announcements. I love the way he explains the leverage of a move.

 

-I love the sports presentation/approach to wrestling. Of actual world building where their is a competition, rules, and a "real" reason for things happening.

 

-Got a kick out of them announcing over the house mic something like "Bob Smith, you're wanted at the front door. bob, please come to the front door."

 

-Watch the older couples in the front row as the set progresses, especially how angry/disgusted they are with Buddy Rose. You def need to check out the Youtube playlists for promos between falls or after them where Rose and Piper are concerned, and Dutch Savage as a semi-retired authority figure kills it too.

 

-Don Owen and his jacket, in the same way the guy from Mid South is, is a national treasure. Always feel like even after 30 or more years of being involved that Owen is uncomfortable with his participation in the worked/pretend parts of being onscreen, and yet very much wants to be the ring announcer. Its like he's kind of insecure or maybe suspect to the real-life motivations of the heels even though they are in character in these cases, but thinking about Piper or Rose being such carnies, maybe he's right to be even when supposedly "in character." He doesn't quite sell for the moment, so to speak, is what I'm getting at.

 

-I DO give Race to much crap without verbalizing a lot of little things he does well. His giving nature, understanding of the ups and downs of the in-ring story, selling even after taking control, facial expressions and presence. I'm very big on "movements" though, not speed or high flying, but the way you you, when, how you execute, and how it fits in to what you're trying to accomplish, and Race only fulfills that very subjective box in moments for me.

 

-Example: I'm prob to harsh on something like Race's piledriver execution, placement, and where he does it, but part of it is that he's bigger and has a heavy rep, and so I figure he's strong enough to drop down with more velocity and protect the guy, really make that move a flourish in his arsenal, and protect when he does it. I know others have compared him to criticisms of peak Kurt Angle - doing lots of cool "movez" but not thinking about when and where to do them, and the degree of the move's impact, but I'm kinda like "Race does lots of bigger moves? Really?" Making that ripple out, its interesting that now we have a generation of really big moves, and often those are higher impact and flying, so it almost seems weird to discuss, but if we're talking NBA games, we usually would critique someone like Wilt Chamberlain or Bill Russell within their time frame (60s), so I'm looking at it from an early 80s perspective (I NEED to really go back and watch Race from 70s, like the Lawler stuff, the Funk matches, maybe some stuff w/ Baba or Jumbo from All Japan)

 

-Since I loved Joe walking away from someone doing a blind twisting splash off the ropes, I totally dug Race doing it here is a more fluid, less "this is a spot we do" way. Also, what was Martel's plan after the 2nd Fall when he argues with Ref Sandy Barr about waking up Race from the sleeper (and isn't that an interesting touch that fell off of wrestling narrative in 80s)? What if Race died? Some hero. Also, since we know they really don't address that in babyface moments like this, was the plan that Barr would have to start a 10 count on Race at the start of the 3rd fall? Okay, that's clever if not usually a heelish move for Iron Man matches, buuuuut... in Portland they'd go to the back between falls and often do promos in-between. Was Martel going to leave him unconscious for like 10 minutes to satiate the bloodthirsty fans at the Portland sports Arena? Its way to "heavy" for wrestling as its commonly been depicted, but I like the idea of Race playing like he might actually be dead then jumping a distraught Martel when medics come out to resuscitate Race.

 

-The drama at the end was really palpable, and mentioning that the World title never changed hands in Portland w/ some excitement about the prospect raised the emotion for me. also loved that throughout the whole thing they did identify moves that worked, carried that through, while never going over a line in terms of "why is he fine taking that now" or "well it should be over because that was far to big to come back from." I know you never see that in these types of territories, but that's the point. I never see something where I go, "screw the match being over (and it isn't), his career is in jeopardy, maybe his life" from a move that ultimately doesn't mean anything within the story. I wish wrestlers better identified "escalating moves" and they were sub-finisher in terms of impact and visual damage, so this problem didn't exist for me.

 

-Loved the finish. Race kept turning into the Sleeper to alleviate the pressure, something I do wish Bonnema mentioned, but it may have sacrificed some of the drama of a possible finish before the bell. I dislike the modern argument of those trying to define people like me as "selling fetishists" because while I agree on the surface with the idea (I know VOW's Rich/Joe forward) of "the guy tried to work the body part and had to give up cause it just didn't work," that's NOT what usually is going on. The guy is effective in targeting the arm, for example, the other guy sells that he is, in fact, in pain, but then he blows that off. A better use of this would be a good commentator doing what Joe Rogan would do on color for UFC: Explaining what Wrestler A is targeting, what he's trying to do, and that while he needs to do (insert movement) the other guy is mostly defending it to a stalemate. Of course, wrestlers would have to act accordingly for story telling purposes, and that's difficult these days. But you can work selling into a comeback and a match story just fine. I've seen it done in CWF Mid Atlantic, which made me a fan of the promotion.

 

-Speaking of which, final thought: this Portland weekly show and the character work and stories, along with fan reactions, is very much why I fell in love w/ CWF Worldwide during their first 2+ years on Youtube as a weekly series. Same great episodic feel, look, crowd, world that had been built up and drawing from their and other's histories.

[Stuttsy]

Chuckle @ Martel being announced from Paris, France, but I've heard more egregious intros in my day. LOVE the start here with Harley running his mouth and Martel giving him a big ol' body slam right at the bell. Jesus Harley takes the over the top backwards bump in the first minute. Martel's fire is superb and Harley is putting Martel over big time in the early going. Martel yanking Harley up with the arm bar was excellent. Super hot start then Martel cranks on the arm for a loooong time. Harley wins the first fall right at 15:00 after a flurry of offense and a BIG suplex. Harley starts fall 2 with a nasty headbutt and attempts a hip block but Martel snatches an abdominal stretch in a beautiful counter. Martel really hits some gorgeous looking offense in fall 2. Martel counters the BIG suplex with a sleeper hold to wrap up fall 2, which I absolutely love. He knew he had to avoid the suplex a second time and he did. Crowd does not want Martel to wake Harley up which is incredible. Third fall is all about Martel's desperation to win. Martel survives a suplex after all and gets the sleeper on as time runs out. Bit of an anti-climactic finish that did not have the oomph you'd expect under the circumstances but a beautiful match.

[Grimmas]

I haven't watched a lot of Portland, but HUGE Rick Martel fan and I don't really like Race too much. Race, to me, is 70s/80s Kurt Angle. Big spots for sake of big spots. Let's brainbuster people pon the floor as a transition spot?

 

Fall 1)

 

With that said, Harley not on offense is a joy to watch and his bumping for Martel is pretty awesome early on. The first fall is kind of odd, as Martel essentially controls it mostly with an armbar. Harley would get some hope spots and there would be some nice flurries, but we'd go right back to Martel grinding on Race's arm. Race gains control and works over Martel's neck, including a piledriver. Brainbuster finishes it off. Long fall, about 15 minutes.

 

Fall 2)

 

Martel back on top in this fall. Martel gets even, hitting his own piledriver, but Race gets the foot on the rope. Martel's fire is the fucking best in wrestling history. HIm working over Race in the corner is a thing of beauty. Another beautiful Martel moment, countering the suplex into the sleeperhold to win the second fall.They do the old school, you have to wake up the guy after putting him to sleep. Martel refuses, because he wants to win, but is forced.

 

I never know what to think of this having to wake the guy up, like wouldn't they be dead?

 

Fall 3)

 

Early sleeper, but they roll to the floor. Harley goes for the stupid piledriver on the floor, but luckily it was countered. This third fall is pretty quick paced.

 

Time runs out though and we get a draw.

 

There was a definite sense of build here and a lot of good stuff. Martel is the BEST. Kind of an odd structure though with him dominating the first 15 minutes.

 

I'll go *** 1/2.

 

A good way to start the set.

[Jkeats]

Wow theres some great stuff on this match already written by you guys so I doubt I have anything to add. Im not a big Race fan but I do love Martel in Portland, especially when he teams with Piper.

 

The match was good but I hated the first fall. Martel cranks on Races arm for like 7 minutes and that arm being weakened never comes into play, so it just came off boring and a waste to me. Martel hit some gorgeous arm drags and I love his fire going into the sleeper. Its a good TV match with the World Champion and I could see it leading to fans wanting to see a rematch.

[Irishstunner]

I enjoyed this match up for what it was, the opening minutes of it honestly was the best part. The quick slam by Martel on Race set the tone for what I would've thought would be a faster pace match than most of Race's NWA Title defenses. Harley takes the huge over the turnbuckle flip and sells hard for Martel. Unfortunately the bulk of the first fall was spent with the challenger cranking on Race's left arm in vice like fashion.

 

Bonnema on announcing does his best to sell the idea that Martel is working the arm because he is smaller than Race, but that is a bit of stretch. The element of the Portland Sports Arena (a converted bowling alley) came in to play with Race going to the top rope, only to be slammed by Martel. The low ceilings of the PSA are always something that I enjoyed seeing how the wrestlers would work around.

 

People complain today about a lack of selling and big spots becoming transitions, this matches first fall was as "spotty" a finish as any match up today. The finishing sequence that sees Martel kick out of the "hot shot" across the top rope, followed by a piledriver then a vertical suplex/brainbuster finish in my mind is major overkill. Suspending disbelief is one thing, but with Race as champion that piledriver should've sufficed.

 

Martel winning the second fall with the sleeper was fun, as I always enjoy seeing the babyface "waking up" his opponent post finish. By the time we get to the 3rd fall we know we are stretched for TV time. So the time elapsing finish was a bit predictable, but it's effective. Race is a guy who as I have gotten older I've enjoyed more, but this match isn't one of his standouts. It served the role of simply being NWA traveling champion trying to make the local young babyface look good.

[shoe]

Harley Race is a guy who has had a lot of highs with me and other times had me scratching my head. The Houston footage made me a more pro Harley guy. Martel has been tremendous in all the territories he's popped up in. One of the all time great baby face workers.

 

I love the fact that 2 of the all time most honorable promoters in Boesch and Owens were proponents of the 2 out of 3 fall set up. They give us a big tease to start. Race's corner bump is a thing of beauty. Martel has all of the answers to Race in the 1st fall. Martel focusing on the arm. He isn't just sitting there. He's working the arm. L---iking Martel selling the back already. So good at the little things. Martel keeping Race off balance with those deep arm drags. I'm a mark for targeting a body part and Martel is aces on the arm. Race as toiring champ is making people believe this could be Martel's night. The arm work got a little long in the tooth. Race catches Martel in the throat with the top rope. A Piledriver later and Martel kicks out. A suplex!!!! Martel kicks out. Harley Race headbutt, and Martel kicks out. Finally, a suplex finishes him off. Loved the way the 1st fall was worked and structured.

 

2nd fall and both guys are battling. Martel shifts his attack to Race's back. Martel using standing Ax handles. A very cool move that always stands out. Back breaker by Martel. Martel's sleeper is the equalizer. I love how they have to wake him up, and some fans have no idea what is all about. Just a difference in time periods.

 

3rd fall and Martel gets the sleeper on. They're fighting on the floor. Big outside in slam by Martel. Sleeper again. Time limit draw. A fun match with people believing Martel should be World Champion. So Harley did his job as touring NWA Champ. 3 1/2*

 

 

 

 

[Johnny P]

Digging all these thoughts/reviews so far, and nodded at so many thoughts from others on things like Race's famed corner bud, the older couples in the ring, Bonnema's style as announcer, the structure of the match, the pros and cons for the arm work in the first fall. We're halfway already to this being all I'd hoped for. But, as has been pointed out to me there is the risk that some might not say to much if they think all the observations are taken (I say post that stuff anyway and we can acknowledge each other or ask why they felt that way). So, with that in mind, I'd love to get some interaction/discussion going. In keeping with the joking theme of a book club, I have some questions for everybody. Feel free to ask some of your own too if you're reading the reviews after matches and wondering things:

 

Saw some people commenting that while they liked the match, the finish didn’t quite bring it home. I like the finish in the macro (time limit draw with the babyface title challenger having the advantage, not able to find a way to win before the bell), but do think I’m slightly in the camp on the micro (the way this particular Race/Martel match finished). Do you think the finish is bad in the macro - this is just an unsatisfying finish for what they were going for no matter what - or is there a way to do the same finish, but better in your eyes?

 

Is Harley Race as great as the older generation has positioned him to be for our age group, or is that a false narrative? Maybe somewhere in-between? I commented on the Race is like Kurt Angle thing, and Grimmas (Steven) brought it up too. JB seemed dissatisfied w/ Race here. But I also thought this was a good showing from Race, that he was giving to his opponent while still being a champion, and that he followed a good script of his own making or co-creation on the fly. If you dislike Race or just Race in this match, is there a way to maximize him for you personally that makes him “better,” and if you like him, what does he do to make you like him (in ring, persona, move set, match layouts, etc)?

 

I’m so happy there’s been love for Martel here. I never liked him as a kid because I didn’t like his character in the WWF, and I’m from the northeast stronghold/a child of the 80s. Yet I loved Martel guesting on Memphis set vs Lawler, loved him in the AWA, thought his stuff in All Japan was better than people gave him credit for. What’s the difference between WWF Martel and pre- WWF Martel? Is he better as a face even if more famous as a heel? What was his ceiling if he goes to the NWA, or ½ territories stay strong and take him in?

 

I’m in the camp that wished the Martel arm work would have gone somewhere. Do people think they should have had Martel win the first fall, lose the second, or does that also hurt the match? Also, would you rather have had no arm work, arm work but go somewhere with it, or maybe had him try to focus on the sleeper or on strikes in the first fall?

[Matt D]

The real key to understanding this match was that it was Martel's introduction to the territory. He was going to be their big babyface going into 1980 and he came with a few detriments. He was relatively unknown. He couldn't speak well (in English at least), even though he had the right look and was technically sound. This was part of a campaign to get him over and establish him. It was a big deal for anyone in a territory to face the NWA champ. I can't think of any other situation where the promoter used it to put over a brand new talent instead of heat up a preexisting one to make his own promotion look important. Martel not just faced him but more than held his own, completing controlling in the first fall. That meant something. One thing you guys will find with Portland is that while we have a lot of the Saturday matches, a wealth of them, a trove of them, and thanks to the sponsors (in part), they're pretty much the best thing we have from 1980 and maybe the best TV in the country, the big blowoff matches were all on the Tuesday Night shows and we have so many of those. They'd do other things to get Martel over, by the way, like announcing special kids' tickets promotions were because he went to Don Owen and demanded them. This match worked. The promotion worked. Martel worked. Hell, in this one situation, Harley worked too (even his usual detriments were a strength for what they were trying to accomplish).

[Johnny P]

Hey Matt, I just saw you asking about this "people doing Portland" thing in the GME thread and left a note for everyone, but also sort of directed at you (because you asked). Thanks for popping in and dropping a few words. Def echo those sentiments. I thought Martel had gotten there a little earlier, some time in 1979. This reveal makes it even more fascinating. By our second match on the set he is a God to the PSA audience. There was a really good podcast on Portland a few years back (a single pod) that reviewed some stuff, but gave a lot of info/background on Portland. I think it was from people in the PWO family. were you involved there, or am I making that up in my head? Also, feel free to join in.

[Matt D]

You're right as in they brought him in at the very end of November with a promo talking about how the Sheepherders hurt him 9 months before in New Zealand and then he had a couple of multi man tags against them in the weeks that followed, but this was still within his first couple of months.

 

I went through pretty much all this stuff back in 2013: http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/15074-buddy-rose/page-8 with aggravating train-of-thought reviews as I was watching but the board getting upgraded destroyed the formatting. I'm sure I'll pop in and out when I can revisit something or want to talk about Stan Stasiak. Maybe I'll even jump in with 82 which I don't know as well. In the meantime, Portland's amazing and you guys are going to have a blast.