The Thread Killer

Don't steal my gimmick, bro.

Here's the problem...Cornette doesn't actually say half of those things. Has he said Kenny and The Bucks are "killing the business?" Sure, he says that anybody that does anything that is blatantly and deliberately "fake" during what is supposed to be a Pro Wrestling match is killing the business. As is well documented, that includes stuff like wrestling 9 year old girls, wrestling blowup dolls, wrestling the "Invisible Man" suplexing people with your penis, etc. So on that point, you are absolutely correct. Jim Cornette has been highly critical of Omega and The Bucks for contributing to the downfall of traditional Pro Wrestling by doing certain things which he believes are detrimental to the Pro Wrestling business. But... Cornette didn't say Kenny and The Bucks aren't stars. He never said they will never be successful. He never said AEW isn't successful. One of Cornette's favorite expressions that he uses all the time is: "For people who like that sort of thing, that is exactly the sort of thing those people will like." Jim Cornette says that Omega, The Bucks and a lot (but not all) of the talent in AEW are stars to the AEW audience...but just to the AEW audience. What he has actually said is that AEW will never achieve mainstream success and popularity like Pro Wrestling used to have. Cornette famously claimed that Dynamite would be cancelled by TNT by March 2020 if their ratings didn't get any better. Shortly after he made that brazen claim, TNT not only renewed Dynamite but asked AEW for a second show. Cornette said at the time, he was obviously wrong...that TNT was clearly content to settle for an audience of 600,000 to 1,000,000 viewers every week and let that be the ceiling. Cornette claimed that he is well aware that AEW has a very devoted fanbase that will continue to follow their product and even go so far as to travel around the country to support it. He just thinks if AEW continues to do what they have been doing so far, they're never going to get any bigger or break through to the next level. As far as their past...Cornette admits that PWG was successful...but that they played to a limited audience in small venues. He admitted that Kenny Omega was successful in New Japan. He has admitted he has no idea how successful or important The Young Bucks actually were in New Japan. Brian Last has repeatedly claimed that if The Young Bucks weren't part of the Bullet Club and "The Elite" then on their own they would have been nothing more than a midcard act in New Japan. Last has also claimed that he has been informed by sources inside New Japan that no real effort was made to keep The Young Bucks in New Japan because New Japan didn't see a lot of value in them. Last has said New Japan absolutely did want to keep Omega in New Japan and would have kept The Bucks around if it would have kept Omega happy, but on their own New Japan was pretty much indifferent to The Young Bucks. Cornette has never commented on that because he happily admits he doesn't watch New Japan and has no idea what goes on in New Japan. The point is...I have listened to more Jim Cornette over the past few years than I wish I had, and I have never heard Jim Cornette claim that Kenny Omega wasn't successful in New Japan Pro Wrestling. I haven't even heard him say AEW isn't successful. I have heard him say repeatedly that he thinks they are just playing to the same limited audience, they have no mainstream appeal, and if they keep doing what they are doing they will never achieve mainstream success. The thing is, he doesn't limit that criticism to just AEW. He claims he can't figure out why WWE also seems content to keep appealing to the same limited (and diminishing) audience instead of trying to recapture previous success. I've heard him say it a million times...Pro Wrestling fans today are willing to pay more money than ever before to be fans, but there are less of them now than there have been in years. Cornette has repeatedly talked about the kind of ratings Pro Wrestling got back in the 70's and 80's and even about the huge ratings WCW and the WWF got back during the 90's. He says he can't understand why WWE and AEW are satisfied with playing to such a smaller audience now, and why they won't try to widen their appeal and try and regain that level of popularity. And yes...he has said he thinks AEW is incapable or rising above where they are now and reaching that kind of success. You can argue all day whether or not his opinion is right...maybe AEW could achieve greater success. Maybe "modern" Pro Wrestling is capable of drawing the kind of ratings and fans Pro Wrestling has in the past. That's debatable. But to claim that Cornette is denying that Omega or AEW are successful to their own audience right now...I just don't think that is true.

You absolutely do. @Laz is 100% correct. Go back and look at half the posts you've made in this thread alone. Or the Jim Cornette podcasts threads over in the podcast forum. Or the NWA Power thread. Every time anybody says anything remotely critical of Kenny Omega, The Young Bucks, "The Elite" or to some degree AEW at all...you tend to come out with guns blazing and pretty much try and steamroll over anybody who doesn't agree with you. You're entitled to your opinion...the only problem is that you always act your opinion is a fact and there can't possibly be another side to the argument. That's fine if that's the way you want to act, but at least own it.

I know I haven't posted any recaps in a while...so-called "real life" has been kicking my ass over the past couple of weeks. I hope to get back to the recaps soon. However... The next best thing to reading a Thread Killer recap is actually hearing The Thread Killer talk! Well...not really. PWO Good Brother @Mad Dog was kind enough to have me as a guest on his highly recommended 4Corners Podcast. (I'm not just recommending it because he had me on as a guest, I have listened to other episodes and it's a lot of fun. It's like listening to a really engaging roundtable discussion.) Anyhow...if you'd like to hear ME talk (not that I can actually think of any reason you actually would) then please check this out. And big thanks to Mad Dog, the whole process was a pleasure.

Cornette gives the impression that Lothario's feelings were kind of hurt...but maybe Lothario was understanding about it because Shawn was supposedly all fucked up a lot of the time on the pills and the whatnot. I guess there wasn't too much bad blood, because if I am not mistaken, when Shawn opened his own Pro Wrestling Academy after his first retirement (when he trained Danielson, Kendrick, London, Cade etc.) Jose Lothario was involved, I am pretty sure. EDIT: And apparently that didn't last long...and they had a falling out less than a month after the school opened.

Supposedly, after Shawn won the title at Wrestlemania 12 they did some kind of market research and discovered that Shawn was plenty popular with female fans, but male fans didn't care for him. Vince's reported idea to remedy this problem was to introduce Jose Lothario as Shawn's manager and for the two men to have a "Rocky and Mickey" type relationship. The idea was supposed to make Shawn more sympathetic and likeable...and of course when somebody would inevitably attack Lothario, they'd have a built in angle. Problems arose because: 1) As great as a trainer as Jose Lothario is, he apparently can't cut a decent promo which would have been a huge part of this plan actually working. 2) Vince has never been able to book a successful babyface manager...ever. I believe it can be done (hell, Cornette did it during the Horsemen and Midnights vs. Original Midnights feud) but Vince has never been able to pull it off. Remember Oliver Humperdink's cup of coffee in the WWF in the 80's, managing Paul Orndorff and Bam Bam? Yeah. 3) Shawn Michaels flat out didn't like the idea, so being his usual unprofessional, passive aggressive self, he decided to go along with the idea...but basically sabotage the entire thing by refusing to acknowlege or even look at Lothario half the time. Cornette (and Prichard, if I'm not mistaken) have both claimed that Michaels was pilled out of his head a lot around this time, and he was either obnoxious and belittling toward Lothario backstage, or he completely ignored the guy behind the scenes like he did in front of the camera. I'm not going to debate whether or not this was a good idea...I can see arguments on both sides. But it really didn't matter because if Michaels didn't want to buy into the story, the fans weren't going to either. The idea of Shawn getting help from his trainer who then gets attacked, and Michaels then swears revenge would have been great if Michaels had ever actually acted like he cared that the guy was alive.

Maybe I'm remembering this wrong...but wasn't this match supposed to be a Tag Team match up until right before the show, featuring The Undertaker & Nathan Jones against A-Train & Big Show, but they actually pulled Jones from the match because they thought he wasn't good enough? I remember hearing that rumor somewhere, but I could be wrong. Maybe it was on Prichard's podcast?

That's the problem, right there. I was as big of a Jim Cornette fan as you're likely to find (especially here at PWO) and I have long since thrown in the towel when it comes to listening to his podcasts. And hell...I agree with most of what he says about modern Pro Wrestling. (Most...not all.) But he just bores the shit out of me now. He sacrificed his old audience for his new audience...which is fine. He's making money, so more power to him. But I think it is shortsighted of him. I honestly don't think his whole "bash modern wrestling 24/7" act has much of a shelf life. He had a much smaller, but devoted base of fans who wanted to hear him talk about historical Pro Wrestling, the territories, etc...and he has basically thrown them over for his new audience. The Drive-Thru is essentially shock jock talk radio now. When these new fans are gone, or when he finally goes too far and says something so outrageous that he is held accountable for it, where will he be then? And then problem is, he's going to have to keep saying more and more outlandish crap to keep his current audience entertained. This isn't going to go anywhere good for him in the long run. He might not see it this way, but I honestly think Brian Last is pulling his strings and then sitting back and counting the cash...but that cash isn't going to keep coming forever.

If people are still enjoying the conversation and participating in it, I fail to see the problem. If you don't like this thread, don't post in it. I doubt your "contributions" would be missed. Pathetic like whenever somebody says anything even remotely critical about Kenny Omega or The Young Bucks, feeling compelled to leap to their defense? That kind of pathetic?

That's an excellent point and a very interesting comparison. And now that you've made that point...you're right. There are actually some significant similarities between Michaels and Brody. You would never think there would be on first glance, but behind the scenes you're absolutely right. Both guys were physically gifted, very popular, in demand and capable of having great matches. The only difference is that Michaels was interested in actually having good matches some of the time...whereas even though he had all the tools and was physically capable, Brody was so unprofessional he had no hesitation about deliberately stinking the joint up or putting in a half ass effort most of the time. All he cared about was making his money and protecting his image. Hence the seven year stretch where he did exactly zero jobs. And remember when he used to no sell guys like crazy...there is that infamous story about he and Hansen against Steamboat and Youngblood in Japan, where Brody supposedly announced before the match he wasn't going to give his opponents any offense at all. Hell, there is that famous story that Bruce Prichard and Jim Cornette talked about in the Houston Wrestling episode of "Back to the Territories" where Brody was unhappy about his payoff for a match against Jim Duggan so he just sat cross-legged in the middle of the ring and wouldn't sell or do anything. I remember Cornette saying that as much as he respected Brody, that was definitely a case of a guy "going into business for himself" and "exposing the business."

That's gold. That insult is kind of a counterpoint to another one of his best comments. One of the cooks brought him a steak that was so overcooked, Ramsay said it "looked like Ghandi's flip-flop." The best part was that afterwards, the insulted cook claimed: "Ghandi didn't even wear flip-flops. He lived in the jungle."

That's a good question. You're right...Cornette gives credit or praise to Michaels very begrudgingly. He has gone out of his way to say that Shawn Michaels is one of the best he has ever seen in terms of in ring work, but at the same time he has also said that Michaels is probably the biggest asshole he ever worked with, aside from Buzz Sawyer and maybe Ole Anderson...so that's some pretty rarefied air there. Cornette was front row center to see Michaels at his all time worst during the Vader feud in 96, in terms of acting like a spoiled, entitled prima donna backstage.. Not to mention, he definitely holds a grudge because Shawn Michaels actually injured him at one point by not taking care of him during a spot where Cornette interfered in one of the Vader matches. I forget if it was on a house show or if it was during the SummerSlam 96 Main Event. I'm pretty sure it was during the SummerSlam match, and Cornette and Last talked about that during the "watch along" they did for that match on Corny's Drive-Thru last summer. Cornette also hated the way that Shawn Michaels treated Jose Lothario backstage. As much as Cornette talks shit about Omega as a person...he has certainly blistered the hell out of Shawn Michaels over the years. If you listen to that watch along Cornette did of the SummerSlam 96 Main Event, you will hear most of his criticisms of Michaels as a worker, as well. If I recall correctly, Cornette claims that Michaels knew how to make his moves look good, but he wouldn't adapt his style to fit the type of opponent he was facing...one of Cornette's big criticisms of Michaels has been that Michaels always had to "get his shit in" whether it actually fit into the match or not, and that is a similar complaint he has regarding Omega and most "modern" Pro Wrestlers. I can't honestly say that I disagree there. I think a lot of guys go into a match with a list of spots that they are determined to execute, regardless of whether the layout and psychology of the match actually call for it or not. If I had to guess, I would say that the reasons Cornette is willing to cut Shawn Michaels some slack over Kenny Omega boils down to two big factors: training and selling. Cornette has a ton of respect for Jose Lothario and he knows that Michaels was at least trained in an "old school" manner and in his own way, Michaels was protective of the business...as long as it suited him. Where Cornette has been most critical of Michaels is when he and his friends in the "Kliq" did stuff to "kill the business" most notably the Curtain Call incident at Madison Square Garden. Cornette felt Michaels should have pretty much been blackballed from the entire business for that. But Cornette at least respects how Michaels was trained, and who trained him. With Omega, Cornette has always disliked him due to the history between Kenny Omega and Harley Race. It's been pretty well documented that when he was coming up in the business, Omega attended one of Race's training camps. After watching Omega work Harley assigned Kenny to the beginners class because he thought Omega didn't have a good grasp of the basic fundamentals of the business. Omega was apparently insulted and offended by this, and has given a bunch of interviews where he basically implied that Harley Race was an out of touch, old fashioned Pro Wrestling veteran. As we all know, Harley Race is one of those guys that is pretty much universally respected by his peers...so when Omega talked some shit about Harley Race, and when Race claimed Omega didn't have a good grasp of basic Pro Wrestling fundamentals...that was pretty much it for Omega in Cornette's opinion, I think. Cornette is definitely one of those "respect those who came before you" guys. I have heard Cornette compliment (once again...very begrudgingly) Shawn Michaels ability to sell. (Having said that, Cornette has also blistered Michaels at times for when he doesn't sell.) But I know one of the many things that drives Cornette nuts about Omega is his selling...either he doesn't do it at all, he does it very briefly, or when he does sell it is by waving his arms around and bugging his eyes out. I think selling is one of the main areas that Cornette thinks Michaels has it over Omega in a big way. I think Cornette views Michaels and Omega on pretty much the same level when it comes to ego and backstage behavior...and if anything I think Cornette probably thinks Michaels was a bit worse. But I think he feels Michaels was a better worker and had a better background, especially when it came to selling.

I checked it out, and didn't much care for it. I found it was too "all over the place" with the jumping from one time period to the next. I also didn't find it at all funny. However, I could see how some people might find it entertaining and I certainly wouldn't begrudge anybody that. Over the last couple of years (especially during the pandemic) I have grown to pretty much loathe mainstream network television, so I find I am getting to the point where I pretty much hate anything on TV right now. There used to be a lot of shows I would DVR every week and follow religiously and I have dumped 90% of them, with the exception of shows like Mayans MC, Billions and Better Call Saul. Oh, and Hell's Kitchen of course...because I'm still a mark for Gordon Ramsay screaming at people and calling them donuts or donkeys. That's just good TV, dammit.

Good point. The reaction all those NBA fans had on Twitter to seeing Chris Jericho for the first time in years on TNT was proof that there is very little crossover between the two fanbases anymore.

Agreed. Granted, I haven't gone back and watched it...but at the time I distinctly remember thinking that it was better than the match they had at WM14, much more visually impressive, and wishing they had done that gimmick match at WM instead of the dull, plodding affair they ended up having in Boston.

Yeah, it sounded particularly absurd when Bret was saying that. It was Sam Roberts who was interviewing Hart, and after Hart concludes his diatribe about how Eric Bischoff is a total and loser and a maggot...but a nice enough guy...Roberts actually bursts out laughing. It was so ridiculous.

I'm pretty sure the Conrad interview is with Jim Crockett, not David. I have it on my AFS feed, I just haven't watched it yet. I'm planning on watching it and recapping here some time fairly soon.

That's a great write up. Really gives you a good idea of who is going to do what, and in which division.

I know exactly what you mean. I get the distinct impression that JR would probably have views very similar to those of Jim Cornette (although I have no doubt he wouldn't be quite as vitriolic when expressing them) if it were not for the fact that he is being paid by AEW, he likes Tony Khan as a person and boss (especially after working for Vince) and the fact that some of the AEW locker room apparently treat him like an elder statesman. I think JR is willing to look the other way or bite his tongue to a degree, because he loves still being able to call Pro Wrestling, even if it is a kind he might not otherwise enjoy or appreciate it.

Thanks brother. I'm pretty stoked, I got pretty much the exact roster I wanted...pretty much every single person on my Maple Leaf Wrestling roster worked that territory between 79-83. That's pretty good considering most of the same guys worked in Mid-Atlantic at the exact same time, because Jim Crockett was promoting both territories. The only guys I missed out on were The Masked Superstar, Paul Jones and Scott McGhee...but it's all good because I got really decent substitute picks. I had intended to have Johnny Weaver and McGhee do the whole mentor/student angle, but when you grabbed McGhee I poked around and found out that when he worked in Toronto, Mike Rotundo actually teamed up with Weaver. Nobody had grabbed Rotundo surprisingly, so I was able to draft him instead. I am looking forward to seeing what you come up with as well.

Blockbuster Announcement from Maple Leaf Wrestling regarding Tag Team Championships! Promoter Frank Tunney announced today during an interview with The Toronto Sun that the NWA International Tag Team Championship Titles (formerly known as the NWA Canadian Open Tag Team Championship) have been declared Vacant, effective immediately. The former champions (Hartford and Reginald Love) have left Maple Leaf Wrestling and have subsequently been officially stripped of their Championships. Mr. Tunney announced that the Opening Round of an All Star tournament to decide new NWA International Tag Team Champions will be held at the next Maple Leaf Wrestling show at Toronto’s Maple Leaf Gardens on Sunday, February 22, 1981. An impressive field of 16 Tag Teams have already been signed and Mr. Tunney has finalized the brackets for this exciting event. The participants for the tournament, and the Opening Round match-ups are as follows: Opening Round: Match #1 The Great Hossein Arab (with Manager Abdullah Farouk) & Mr. Fuji vs. Angelo “King Kong” Mosca & Dewey Robertson Opening Round: Match #2 Big John Studd (with Manager “Pretty Boy” Floyd Creatchman) & “Huge” Tom Lintz vs. Dino Bravo & Pat Patterson Opening Round: Match #3 Billy Robinson & The Destroyer vs. Blackjack Mulligan & Bullwhip Johnson Opening Round: Match #4 Abdullah The Butcher & The Sheik (with Manager Abdullah Farouk) vs. Kelly Kiniski & Whipper Watson Jr. Opening Round: Match #5 Iron Mike Sharpe & Goldie Rogers vs. Dominic DeNucci & Tony "Cannonball" Parisi Opening Round: Match #6 Rocky & Bob Della Serra vs. Sweet Ebony Diamond & George Wells Opening Round Match #7 “The Family” (Doug Vines and Jeff Sword) vs. Johnny Weaver & Mike Rotundo Opening Round Match #7 The Kelly Twins (Pat and Mike) vs. Sweet Daddy Siki & Cocoa Samoa * * * * * “We are very excited to bring such a star studded event to the great fans of Maple Leaf Wrestling.” claimed Mr. Tunney. “Rocky Della Serra has been having great success in the All Star Wrestling promotion in Vancouver, and Bob “UFO” Della Serra has had some thrilling matches in the International Wrestling Organization in Montreal. We are happy to reunite these brothers and bring them together in Toronto.” Mr. Tunney further expanded on some of the other fresh talent which are being introduced or teamed up for the first time in this tournament. “We think our fans will really enjoy seeing the sons of two Maple Leaf Wrestling legends teaming up for this first time. Kelly Kiniski, the son of former NWA Champion Gene Kiniski will be teaming up with Whipper Watson Jr., whose father is still considered legendary for his reign as the NWA British Empire Champion. I think this second generation team will make their namesakes proud.” I had a chance to ask Mr. Tunney about a couple of the other new or returning teams in the tournament. “The Kelly Twins have experienced great success in Maple Leaf Wrestling in the past, including a lengthy reign as Tag Team Champions. We are glad to welcome them back to Toronto after their time in St. Louis. And we are also interested in seeing the young and dynamic Doug Vines and Jeff Sword who were known as “The Family” or “The Devil’s Duo” making their debut for Maple Leaf Wrestling." I asked Mr. Tunney if “The Family” would be accompanied by their notorious manager Izzy Slapawitz. “There are no plans for Mr. Slapawitz to appear with his former clients, however this could change in time.” This opening round will also be notable as it will be the first appearance in Toronto by Abdullah The Butcher and The Sheik in quite some time. Both of these men have been making waves and creating chaos overseas both as a team and individually, but this will be the first time they have appeared in Toronto as a team. I asked Mr. Tunney about both men and their well earned reputation for mayhem and violence. “I am well aware of the dubious history of both Abdullah and The Sheik, and we have all witnessed their exploits here in Maple Leaf Wrestling, many times. I have informed their representative Mr. Farouk that while we are happy to have both men return to Toronto, we intend to run a fair, cleanly contested tournament and that no cheating or shenanigans outside or inside the ring will be tolerated!” * * * * * Other news and notes: - Mr. Tunney informed me during the interview that the Marcus Brothers, Bob and Joe are being designated as official alternates for the tournament, should any of the teams in the Opening Round brackets be unable to advance to the Quarterfinals. After the Quarterfinals, it is my understanding that the bye system will be in effect and no further substitutions would be permitted. - With the newly popular Angelo Mosca teaming with the perennially popular Ontario native Dewey Robertson, can there be any doubt that these two men will be the clear crowd favourites in this tournament? Then again...the rough, brawling Mosca and then clean cut, athletic Robertson seem to be the definition of “clashing styles.” It remains to be seen how well the two most popular men in Maple Leaf Wrestling will fare as a team...especially against an established team with experience working together like Hossein and Fuji. - Speaking of a clash in styles...considering the fact that Iron Mike Sharpe has won Tag Team Championships with both Moose Morowski and Savatore Bellomo in other parts of Canada, I was somewhat surprised to see him team up with Goldie Rogers for this tournament. While Rogers is certainly more flamboyant than Iron Mike’s former partners, it remains to be seen if they will be able to work together as well as Sharpe & Morowski or Sharpe & Bellomo have in the past. Both Morowski and Bellomo are reportedly available, which makes Sharpe and Rogers choosing to team up all the more curious. - Although this is the first time they will have teamed up in Maple Leaf Wrestling, Billy Robertson and The Destroyer have experience participating in Tag Team Tournaments overseas, and should not be overlooked as potential contenders in this tournament. - We have similarly seen Sweet Ebony Diamond and George Wells work together previously in Maple Leaf Wrestling, as well as the mentor/student combination of Johnny “Buzzsaw” Weaver and the exciting young collegiate Mike Rotundo. The same can be said for Dominic DeNucci and Tony Parisi, who have extensive experience working together. It remains to be seen if previous experience as a team will work to any of these teams advantage. - The opposite can be said for the teaming of Dino Bravo and Pat Patterson. Both men have worked together here in Maple Leaf Wrestling before and yes...both men are accomplished Pro Wrestlers, but isn't it a bit odd to even think about seeing Pat Patterson working in Maple Leaf Gardens without his usual partner Ray Stevens? Bravo is a sensation and nobody has a better reputation in Tag Team matches than Patterson, but that doesn't guarantee that their team will automatically gel. - I know as a reporter, I am expected to be objective...and I wish all of the participants well. But is there any true Pro Wrestling fan who doesn't salivate just a little at the potential match-up of Abdullah The Butcher and The Sheik against Blackjack Mulligan and Danny "Bullwhip" Johnson? Depending on who wins and loses in the opening round...that could be a potential brawl for the ages. If any team has the physical ability to stand up to the barely contained chaos that Abdullah and The Sheik will doubtless bring, it can only be the two big cowboys. - The 8 opening round matches will make up the entirety of the next big show at Maple Leaf Gardens on February 22, 1981. It is my understanding that the Quarterfinal and Semifinal matches will take place over the following weeks when Maple Leaf Wrestling presents their weekly Television program, and the Finals will be taking place as the Main Event of a future event at Maple Leaf Gardens in the coming months.

Loss, if you are interested in checking out the ROH Pure Title Tournament, you'll be looking for Ring of Honor's weekly TV show beginning with episode #469 and ending with #478, I believe. That tournament almost served as a promotional "reboot" for a couple of reasons. Firstly, ROH hadn't produced any new content for TV in a while, because they pretty much shut down due to the pandemic. Secondly, Marty Scurll had been assuming a bigger role in the creative aspect of ROH prior to the pandemic, but by the time the Pure Title tournament started he was pretty much out of the picture due to the allegations levied at him as part of the "#SpeakingOut" movement. I found personally that watching Ring of Honor from that point onward was pretty much like a fresh start. They did an excellent job doing "sports like" introductory interviews and packages prior to the matches, so even if you were unfamiliar with the talent, it didn't matter. Prior to this tournament, I had pretty much given up on watching any current Pro Wrestling for a couple of reasons. I had been a huge fan of NXT after they debuted on the USA Network but I found there had been a steady decline in the quality of that show. In my mind NXT used to be distinguishable from the so-called "Main Roster" WWE shows but I found in time that was becoming less and less the case. I was becoming increasingly disillusioned with AEW because I just wasn't enjoying the style of the in-ring product and especially the creative. There was a lot of good in there, to be sure. But there was also a lot of stuff I didn't enjoy, so I pretty much tuned out. The "nail in the coffin" for me was the pandemic and the lack of live crowds. I had honestly never realized how integral fans were to my enjoyment of watching Pro Wrestling. (Which is ironic because the fans are the reason I won't attend live shows any more.) I didn't have a problem watching Baseball, Hockey or even MMA with no fans in the crowd...but to me Pro Wrestling was just way too weird without the crowd reactions...and the piped in fake cheers and chants sure didn't make up for it. I will say that of everything I saw, AEW did far and away the best job at adapting to the lack of crowds. The ROH Pure Tournament was the first new product I watched. It definitely took some getting used to, watching Pro Wrestling with no fans in attendance. But ROH did a great job adapting their presentation to make it work. The announcing was particularly good, and the quality of the mat based actual wrestling was really enjoyable, in my opinion. To a degree, it almost reminded me of early Pancrase or even U-Style. Maybe because the crowds there were totally silent, and by the end of U-Style I know they had a couple of shows where there were less than 100 fans in attendance. I have one old U-Style show on VHS where I swear it looked like there wasn't anybody there except the crew. But for whatever reason, that didn't distract from my enjoyment of the actual wrestling...just like with the ROH Pure Tournament. If you check it out, I hope you enjoy it.

Did you see the recent ROH Pure Title Tournament? I thought it was outstanding.

That's really the key point, right there. I find myself becoming quite tired of the bickering back and forth between fans of "traditional" or "old school" Pro Wrestling and fans of the more modern product. The presentation is totally different, so judging both types of Pro Wrestling against each other is almost pointless. It really has become like comparing applies to oranges at this point. It is an argument that can't be won, and it has become totally circular. There is no provable case to be made that one particular style is "better." It all boils down to which style you prefer. A lot of the older Pro Wrestling that I enjoy was produced at a time that the participants were still making a concerted effort to convince the audience that what they were seeing was a legitimate athletic contest. Clearly, in some (but not all) aspects of the modern product, that premise has been abandoned which has resulted in the more cinematic style made popular by Matt Hardy, Lucha Underground, Impact, certain segments of AEW, and now the WWE with their own cinematic stuff. When I watch a classic movie, like The Good, The Bad and The Ugly...I know Clint Eastwood isn't really a cowboy. I know it's pretend, but I like to get caught up in the suspension of disbelief. If he was to turn to the camera and wink during one of the most important scenes, or if lazer beams were to come shooting out of one of his pistols during a story that is supposed to be taking place during the Civil War, I wouldn't like it. It would take me out of the movie, much like a lot of the things that go on during modern Pro Wrestling take me out of the match. The breakneck speed, the repeated spots, the lack of selling...I can understand these things and even appreciate them on some level, but that doesn't mean I have to like them. I was debating this with a good friend of mine who was basically berating me because I had the audacity to say that I didn't enjoy that match in AEW that took place on the Football Field. (I can't remember what the actual name of the match was.) He asked me what I thought of the match, and I told him that I had turned it off during the match because I didn't enjoy it. He was horrified and gave me a prolonged lecture about the evolution of the product and how I needed to accept the fact that Pro Wrestling had "evolved." My only response was to ask him: "Okay, fine. But why should I watch something I don't enjoy?" He ended up laughing and admitting that he had no argument for that...and he's right because there isn't an argument to be made. Fans really need to stop trying to convince each other that their preferred style is the superior style and that if you don't agree then there is clearly something wrong with you. I can accept that is what modern Pro Wrestling has become, but it doesn't mean I have to like it. It also doesn't mean there is anything wrong with me because I don't enjoy it. I use pop music as an example. The #1 song on the Billboard Pop chart in July 1955 was "Rock Around The Clock" by Bill Haley and The Comets. The #1 song on the Billboard Pop chart in July 2020 was "Rockstar" by DaBaby. Both are #1 songs on the Billboard Pop chart and both contain the word "Rock" in the title. They are both songs. But clearly that doesn't mean there isn't an obvious world of difference between the two songs. They share pretty much as many differences as they do similarities. If I say that I don't like modern pop music, it doesn't mean I'm wrong or refusing to get with the times...it just means that pop music has evolved into something I don't particularly care for. I don't think fans of traditional Pro Wrestling should berate fans of the modern product, but I also find lectures about how we must all evolve and embrace how wonderful the modern product is now, and how much better it is now, to be quite tiresome. It's not better. It's different. I myself personally still enjoy slower paced, technical style matches which focus on mat based "psychology." My friend finds that stuff boring. He could no more sit through Jumbo vs. Billy Robertson in the 70's any easier than I could sit through one of the Omega/Okada matches. I get that. Hell, I have shown him some vintage 90's All Japan and he didn't like it. I was somewhat surprised, but after thinking about it I came to understand that we just have wildly divergent opinions in what we are looking for in Pro Wrestling. I'm okay with that.