Timbo Slice

That mainly had to do with merch not being an issue at the time. It's recently become a talking point as Bryan has started getting over, with him not getting as big a push because his merch wasn't a top seller. So recent stories from the WWE brass are making it known that merch is a big talking point for a guy getting a big push, which coincided with Punk's run.

To this day, as someone who has worked in TV and produced shows, I'll never understand how they can't time out a taped show with commercial breaks where the break comes back right after a break in the action. I understand they like the WWE app, but man alive. It has always bugged me.

The more things change and all that.

There's a good chance it's the poll posts. You actually have to read those in order for them to be declared as read.

It's like Dana's squinting to see if that's actually Punk's name. EDIT: Also, it looks like he's being interviewed from jail with that shirt.

I like Adam Cole so at least the main would be fun.

CHIKARA sucks anyways. PWG has fucking Mount Rushmore going strong, the best indy heel stable in years. Kevin Steen's promos are top-notch right now. Watch that instead.

Chants get started at wrestling shows all the time. Some work, some don't. Most of the times, it's someone too smart for their own good trying to get himself over. Most of the time, that fails. The chants you hear aren't just a few people chanting. It's hundreds that turn into thousands because people think the chant is somewhat worthwhile to them. Does it mean it's smart? Of course not. But if people think chanting something like they do will make things enjoyable, they're going to chant it. Punk leaving has been picked up on many outlets outside of the dirt sheets, meaning that the word is out there and people are going to make their opinions heard one way or the other. Coffey's right: Fans are going to chant what they want in regards to the product that's presented to them. But for the change to happen, they can't just chant it. They have to back it up with their dollar.

Yeah, if Punk is truly "gone," WWE would have said something by now. At this point, they obviously don't know how to handle the situation, which is understandable. He's still under contract and because there's a guarantee, they would have to work out a settlement. It's not rocket science. The only reason anyone is saying it could be a work is because it really could be one. The more time passes, the less likely it becomes.

It's not only that, but a heel promo should give something for the face to overcome in steps where it looks like he actually has a shot. If you keep piling it on and not have him overcome it, why keep cutting those promos? And usually, the answer is because guys can't bear to lose heat. Because God forbid the face goes over on them.

There's a bigger chance about it being a work than anything considering WWE hasn't come out and said anything yet. Plus, since his contract isn't up for six months, there is a guarantee involved of some kind, so they wouldn't mention it unless there was some type of settlement reached on what was left on it. Which might take a bit.

If Punk is leaving on his laurels, then he's only going to get involved again when he feels like it's worthwhile. New Japan would have to shuffle some major cards for him to be up at the top, but if there is one thing that could work out, it's that Jado and Gedo love US wrestling and could make something happen with Punk as the new gaijin ace, something NJPW hasn't had in quite a long time. Say what you will about NJPW, but if he wants to wrestle for a non-WWE company that will pay him well and will most likely work with what he wants to do, NJPW is his best option. Which is crazy.

He took two months off last year. My mistake. The payoff thing would be interesting, but that's for the Network thread.

Not surprised Punk did it. Hell, if it's true that it's going to be Bryan/HHH, this means there's basically no room for Punk at WM. Also, wasn't there word a while back that he was banged up something bad? He hasn't really taken any time off in a few years.

Yeah, Brock did fine with Hogan. Don't see why he wouldn't do the same with Taker.

Bryan winning the belt in the EC seems like a disingenuous way to finally give him the belt, which actually makes sense in a way.

Well, that depends on what you think "improve" means. If "improve" means to diversify your move set in order to not be stale, or to condense a move set into your most dynamic moves, or work on connecting with a crowd...there are a ton of people on here who believe the key to a good wrestling match is dynamic moves. There are also a ton of people on here who want heat-building near-falls that build to a finish. There's also people who would rather have moves scaled back so that they mean more. A lot of people want the wrestlers to work the style they enjoy the most, but in the current WWE environment, that's not going to happen. They have their style. The wrestlers have to adapt. And sometimes, as a byproduct, it makes them a better worker. Stan Hansen's shtick wasn't over in the US as much as it was in Japan or PR. So he was absolutely huge in those places while not doing well in AWA or WCW. Evan Bourne was more about throwing out dynamic spots and bumping like a pinball before coming to WWE, and then used his bumping and athleticism to make him more well-rounded in a toned-down environment, which in turned made his more dynamic spots that more appealing because they "meant more" in the WWE environment. It's like Tim said. The goal is to make money. If you have skills that can be used to help make the company money, in terms of coming into the WWE environment, that's "improvement" in their eyes.

John, you're talking more about "passing the torch". Actually doing stuff to get the other guy over because you think it's good business. All those guys you talked about helped Trips get over because they thought their rub would help business and make him a top guy. Which it did to an extent. The main reason people are perceiving this as different is because outside of Cena, nobody else really wants to put Bryan over on a big-time singles match to end a show. Much like Trips got his rub from Vince, Steph, Rock and Mick, they thought by giving Bryan a "rub" by pairing him with Orton, Trips and HBK was the right move. Problem was that he was never put over. That's more the issue here. Bryan actually has to go over. And now that Batista is there, a 7 figure investment with incentives, there's little room for Bryan to get over, especially with someone like Batista coming back and being thrown right into the supposed show-ending match on the biggest show of the year. So this is another holding pattern that Bryan got stuck with, might like the bridge from Cena to Orton, which they wanted before Cena got hurt.

Yeah, there's no way Vince will miss out on a subpoena here. Will Roddy Piper appear as a character witness?

That report seems like bullshit. There's no way at all that WWE would have planned to garner that reaction. That's them covering their ass.

Yeah, I was about to say. The ability to adjust to your surroundings IS improvement. Also, this harps back to the conversation in another thread about why Hansen isn't considered an all-time great because he "only" worked Japan, where that's actually the reason he DID become an all-time great.

Yeah, it's a lot of aping of the guys who actually had a "fighting spirit" gimmick and now everyone's trying to do it. Like anything else in wrestling, once a lot of wrestlers are doing something that was once unique, it becomes meaningless.

They weren't booing Mysterio. They were boing the fact that he wasn't Bryan.

That, plus they know there's a line they can continue to push because people are wanting Bryan to win, so they can keep getting them out there, even if they shit on the product. They'll keep trolling, throwing the bait, hoping they bite. Still getting that money.

It's not about hardcore fans, though. Hardcore fans are the guys who bitch on pro wrestling boards. That's who they think the hardcore fans are. These are actual paying customers coming to the show to see someone and then being pissed when they didn't get what they wanted. Like I said before, this is all about money. With the Network coming out, Batista's ratings boost (even as a small sample) raised ratings enough that they could command a bit more in advertising whereas Bryan doesn't bring in as much. So they have Bryan play up the "Him vs. The Machine" storyline while he's doing his public stuff to keep up the gag. It's not rocket science. Austin got a hell of a reaction and had the promo of his life, but it was only when he had the Austin 3:16 shirt made that he was pushed to the moon.