Loss
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Everything posted by Loss
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Lots of things in lots of genres are "important" but not "good". Wrestling isn't unique in that regard. I just don't think seeing Hogan/Andre is a "must before you die" for a wrestling fan. There's nothing you can learn from seeing it that you couldn't get from a well-produced video package, or even a well written description of it. This is a thread about must SEE matches. The reason the match is actively bad to me is the attempted piledriver on the floor and Andre backflipping Hogan, and Hogan not even making contact with the floor, but selling it like he did anyway. It was a first day of wrestling school-level bump. It's a spectacle. I like spectacles. Sometimes, spectacles aren't necessarily good. Hogan/Andre is worth watching, but I don't think it's at the level of a must-see match. There are plenty of matches I like that I wouldn't nominate for this list.
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I think you can understand the importance of the match without ever seeing it.
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I loved it. I saw flaws in it that stood out in a big way, but I still think the match was awesome. No conflict there. I would have included more Takako matches for sure if they had been recommended. I recall you posting in the DVDVR thread that there were only five Joshi matches that even had to go on the yearbook. -
-- I'm never clear if people agree or disagree that the decline in the oil economy is what killed Mid South. I know that is what Watts says, but I don't know if that's considered carny promoter talk or what. Dave reports it, but I don't know his opinion. Are there things that happened from a booking perspective when Watts was in control that are generally considered big mistakes that hurt them? -- There have been so many alternating stories floating around that I still don't know WHY the WWF decided to break up the Rockers. Revisionist history would suggest to give Shawn a singles push, but I've heard contradicting stories about everything from fights over WWF cereal rights to Michaels telling the front office Jannetty was going to WCW when he wasn't, to Shawn threatening to leave and go to Memphis so he could prove to the WWF that he could carry a territory as the top heel. What's true? What isn't? -- The Rick McGraw death story should be a bigger deal than it is. He dies, and the WWF airs him doing a stretcher job on TV a few days later anyway. Some blame the WWF, some say the taping schedule at the time would have made it impossible to edit, but either way, it's worth talking about more. Those are a few.
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I don't recall Undertaker getting cheered by fans until AFTER he turned. Point me to what I need to see that demonstrates otherwise.
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Well, this is just being tossed around. No one said Hogan/Andre definitely shouldn't make the list. Although ... Hogan/Sheik is a fun, historic five-minute match, and Hogan/Andre is a terrible, actively bad historic match. The match is one of the most famous of all time and the opening staredown, Andre being pelted with trash on his way to the ring, and the bodyslam are iconic images within wrestling. But I'm not sure what about the match screams must-see. You can see everything you need to see by watching the Hulkamania 3 Coliseum video release and a quick video package of the match with the only moments that are really worth anything.
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Paul's problem is that he doesn't represent what the GOP power base wants at all. Many of the Republican pet initiative and special interest groups under a Ron Paul administration would be worse off than they would with a Democrat in the White House. Paul would go after the Pentagon and defense spending much more aggressively than anyone who is electable in either party would.
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WWE gets plenty of criticism.
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The hype has begun for the 2012 Royal Rumble! Just this week, Newt Gingrich threw his hat in. He is attempting to present himself as a babyface, but fans remember the angle where he joined Callista more than he'd like. Santorum is just there to improve the workrate, and it's clear the GOP wants to push Mitt Romney as the top star. But I'm not sure why Romney is waiting so long to make his entrance official. Meanwhile, Sarah Palin may set out to become the first intergender champion, although she's making so much money working indies that it may not be worth her time. Not to mention that during her time in the indies, she really hasn't improved her skills that much. Ron Paul is forever the big draw that the GOP refuses to push. Regardless of who wins the Royal Rumble, I suspect they will have a hard time defeating the reigning champion Barack Obama, although quite a bit can happen between now and then I suppose.
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I'd also like to point out that little kids were crying when Michael Jackson died, and I know quite a few teenagers who love 80s Madonna songs. I'm sure people exist that don't know who they are, but what's the point in bringing them up?
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Something I've never been clear on: Is wrestling training typically 100% bumping and moves, or do most camps also teach psychology?
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July 1993: #1 - Stan Hansen vs Kenta Kobashi (AJPW 07/29/93) ***** #2 - Sakie Hasegawa & Kyoko Inoue & Takako Inoue & Aja Kong vs Mayumi Ozaki & Dynamite Kansai & Hikari Fukuoka & Cutie Suzuki (JWP Thunderqueen 07/31/93) ****3/4 #3 - Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama vs Toshiaki Kawada & Masa Fuchi (AJPW 07/19/93) ****1/2 #4 - Felino vs Ciclon Ramirez (EMLL 07/09/93) ****1/4 #5 - Mitsuharu Misawa & Kenta Kobashi & Jun Akiyama vs Toshiaki Kawada & Akira Taue & Yoshinari Ogawa (AJPW 07/02/93) ****1/4 #6 - Mitsuharu Misawa vs Toshiaki Kawada (AJPW 07/29/93) ****1/4 #7 - Toshiaki Kawada vs Jun Akiyama (AJPW 07/09/93) ****1/4 #8 - Hollywood Blonds vs Arn Anderson & Paul Roma (WCW Beach Blast 07/18/93) **** #9 - Ric Flair & Arn Anderson & Paul Roma vs Hollywood Blonds & Barry Windham (WCW Saturday Night 07/03/93) **** #10 - Great Sasuke & Sato vs Super Delphin & Gran Naniwa (Michinoku Pro 07/26/93) **** #11 - Great Sasuke vs Super Delphin (Michinoku Pro 07/24/93) ***3/4 #12 - Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannetty (WWF Monday Night RAW 07/19/93) ***3/4 #13 - Genichiro Tenryu & Ashura Hara vs Masa Chono & Tatsumi Fujinami (NJPW 07/14/93) ***3/4 #14 - Kazuo Yamazaki vs Yoji Anjo (UWFI 07/18/93) ***1/2 #15 - Bart Vale vs Yuki Ishikawa (PWFG 07/21/93) ***1/2 #16 - Rick & Scott Steiner vs Money Inc (WWF Superstars 07/17/93) *** #17 - Marty Jannetty vs Mr. Hughes (WWF Challenge 07/18/93) #18 - Eddie Gilbert vs Road Warrior Hawk (NWA Grand Slam 07/10/93) #19 - Yokozuna vs Crush (WWF Monday Night RAW 07/12/93)
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I guess this would be true for every wrestler, but there is a vast difference between Ric Flair with nothing to do and Ric Flair in an angle. His promos are great in the middle of a feud, and are not so good when he doesn't have any immediate grudges. There may have been a time in years past when Flair could have done a stock promo and still been great, but he's past that point by 1993 and needs to be part of something interesting for WCW to get the most out of him, and most of the time, that's not really true. He spent way too much of the year spinning his wheels.
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First, we get a clip of Jim Cornette pinning Bob Armstrong on a house show. Armstrong announces the Big Boss Man is coming in as a special referee the next time they get in the ring. Bob Armstrong is a great promo. Armstrong guarantees that he will send Cornette to the hospital.
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Lawler brags that more people have come to see him wrestle than for any act in the history of Mid South Coliseum. I'd hope that's the case, considering he's gone there weekly for two decades, but I'll let him have his moment. He does a great promo about his feud with Bret Hart, explaining why calling himself a King is an insult. He says he knows the Hart family is huge, but Bret has never seen a family as huge as his fans. Love this.
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Bret Hart is coming to Mid South Coliseum to settle a score with Jerry Lawler and "all you Southern people in Memphis". Surreal. Bret is awesome! Redneck accent: "What we have here is a failure to communicate." He laments what happened to Owen and vows revenge on this nobody, all while saying these Southern hicks will learn he's serious business, and they'll be crying around him just like they do Elvis! Hell of a promo.
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This was an amazing match, and I don't want to take away from it, but I wanted to love it and it wasn't as great as it has been hyped to be, at least not to me. I was hoping the heat would sustain for the full hour, in the way it did during that elusive 12-woman tag floating around out there from the 80s in semi-complete form. I had also heard the story before of how JWP is the hometown team and spend the last few minutes drastically trying to catch up on falls. But that's not the story here. So I think part of it is that the explanations I've read of this match were not quite accurate. They are down one fall in the last few minutes, not several. Ozaki does win with about five seconds remaining, but it doesn't really get a pop any bigger than the other falls throughout the match. I guess it's memorable since people remember it, but I didn't really get what made that pin so memorable, other than the timing of it (which was also done in February with Benoit/Scorpio). Complaining out of the way, I thought Aja Kong looked the best I have ever seen her look in any setting. She didn't wrestle even, which she often does. This was a nice touch when you have a match full of people wrestling even with each other. They did a great job furthering anticipation for Kong/Kansai, both during the match and in the post-match. I already knew Kyoko Inoue was awesome, but these yearbooks have been an eye opener for Takako as well. I know these sets are a snapshot, not a full career retrospective, but I want to know why Takako Inoue isn't praised as one of the best. Is she inconsistent? Was her run short? Was she just not the focus in booking? Or is it something else? Any way it goes, I'm curious. Ozaki is the best performer in this match, and she also seems to be booked to be the star of it. This is really true for everyone in the match, but more so than anyone else, Ozaki feels like she's in a war or fight for survival instead of just a normal wrestling match. In spite of my complaints, this is in the top handful of wrestling matches from the year and I loved it, so don't read too much into what I said.
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These two had a really tough act to follow, but they still had a really awesome match. At times, it feels slower than it deserves to feel because of the match before it -- whereas Hansen/Kobashi was all-action, this match is more focused around Kawada attempting to tear off Misawa's arm and possibly feed it to him, and Misawa sells this throughout the match. Kawada makes a great showing at first, with Misawa putting him over strong with lots of classic NWA champ match layout. I love the timidity early on with Misawa getting caught very quickly with a couple of kicks. As the match progresses, Misawa feels like he outwrestled Kawada, because he did a better job pacing himself. I really enjoyed the dead lift of the finish. This is a match Misawa won with an exclamation point. Kawada pushes him, but Misawa comes out ahead. Whereas Hansen/Kobashi had the guy who won giving his opponent most of the match, this match had the guy who won being patient, letting an eager challenger tire himself out, then capitalizing when he had very little left. Both were right. Both worked.
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Well, that was a war. Everything said here was true. I especially appreciate Kobashi's desperation stretch at the end. Beating the hell out of Hansen wasn't doing him any good, so he just kept trying every pin attempt he could think of in rapid fire succession, and it didn't work. This is also incredibly brutal from the beginning, and on top of the stiffness, you have a match that is paced brilliantly with a super hot crowd. Also, that was a hell of a finish that was perfect, because Kobashi losing may have helped him more than winning could have, if only because Hansen gave him so much of the match. Not sure what takes the top spot between this and Hokuto/Kandori at this point, but one of them definitely does.
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This is a really classy, emotional segment that feels far more real and less overdone than most sendoffs, and I'm including Flair on Raw in that category even.
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This is an actual heel promo, and not the usual walk-around-Philly-and-act-like-a-goof stuff. Well, I spoke too soon. That's exactly what we get when this is over. Interesting stuff that I'm glad is on the set because it shows what Gilbert-era ECW was like, but I'm not a fan.
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Vince interviews Luger in an empty arena. I still can't get over what a good idea this whole push was, even if it didn't work.