Loss

We could do something like that. What kind of categories are we talking?

On that note, it is a shame that because of time constraints, they're going to have to completely gloss over the Hart/Lawler feud of '93, which was terrific and never gets the credit it deserves.

I'd normally agree, but I'm surprised Piper even knows that he used to be a wrestler, or where he is most of the time for that matter. Meltzer previously reported that they were asking Piper pointed questions specifically to get negative reactions from Piper. It must be doubly confusing for Roddy that this new school shooty bullshit where you break character on DVDs left him not understanding his role.

Well, that match could have been brilliant in the right hands. I'd *love* to see Eddy Guerrero against Big Show and Kane in a triple threat just because he'd put some thought into his role and manage to credibly squeak out a victory. Michaels just hits his girly flying forearms the same way he worked against Daivari earlier this year. Wrestling fans want ... desperately ... to believe what they're seeing or they wouldn't be fans. Michaels, however, is so content in the fact that he gets pops and gets his ass kissed as being the best worker in the business on a regular basis that he's coasting along on that, and he rarely tries anything original or varied in a match to get over the storyline.

Yeah, they had a couple of brief TV matches that showed promise, but ultimately were nothing to get excited about. Austin/Michaels, just because Austin had a way of actually making HBK look like a badass in his own right, and Bret/Vader are the two feuds from that era I really wish could have happened.

By hotshotting the belt back to Jeff Jarrett, TNA has shown me quite a few things. (1) They have no concept of the difference between TV and PPV. The same match that headlines a pay-per-view, surprise or not, should not be shown on TV. It just makes the fans feel foolish for bothering to pay money for their shows in the long run. (2) They are oblivious to the constant hotshotting for attention and rushed decision-making that has caused many promotions to go under or lose popularity in the past. (3) They have no idea where they want to go next, so they go to their standby champ to buy time until they can work something out. Going on Spike without a gameplan is silly. Really, what babyface are they building up to take the belt off of Jarrett? Everyone makes suggestions on everyone from Monty Brown to Raven to Samoa Joe, but the fact that it isn't obvious who specifically they're booking to be the one standout guy above the rest is a weakness in their booking. Think back to Hogan/Sting. Everyone knew Sting would be the guy to end Hogan's run, it was just a matter of getting him in the ring and making it happen. (4) They see Jeff Jarrett as a bigger asset to the company and a bigger star than Raven, despite Raven having more relevance in the current scene and actually being over with the audience. (5) They don't care what their fans think. If they did, Jeff Jarrett wouldn't even be in the picture. TNA's got a lot of work to do.

Carlito strikes me more as a badly-trained wrestler than a bad wrestler. He apparently was a pretty good high-flying guy in Puerto Rico, but has eliminated all the highspots from his repertoire in the move to WWE so he can work the company style. Now that that aspect of his game has been taken from him, he has little left. He's what AJ Styles would be if you told him he could do absolutely no highspots in a match.

Agreed. If they felt that they needed to give the fans a title change to make them feel they got their money's worth, wouldn't staying consistent with that by giving them a title change that actually has a *long term affect on the promotion's booking* be part of that package?

Regarding the NWO ... I think the oversaturation of the group and bad booking and overcrowdedness of it all by mid-1997 or so has tainted the memory of the whole thing and how amazingly good it was at the beginning. From a storyline perspective, watching the 07/29/96 Nitro is like watching a movie. That's the Nitro where all the main eventers were in the ring for a six-man tag when Hall and Nash laid out the entire locker room backstage. Rey Misterio got thrown into the trailer like a dart. Eddy Guerrero is screaming for help for Rey and Rey is swearing that he saw four guys. Randy Savage goes nuts and jumps on top of the limo as it's speeding away. Ric Flair and Sting, hated enemies from a rivalry as old as the promotion itself, help their respective friends onto stretchers and accompany them to the hospital in the *same ambulance*. Woman breaks down in tears. Bobby Heenan walks off the show in fear of his own safety. It's extremely captivating television. The next week, the NWO is nowhere to be found and the Horsemen jump Brutus Beefcake and beat the everloving shit out of him. Flair does a great promo saying that if Hogan wants to take out his best friend, he's going to take out Hogan's best friend. Other friends of Hogan The Nasty Boys are being pummeled by a large group of babyface and no one makes the save because again, they're friends of Hogan. The NWO sends WCW flowers consoling them "on the death of WCW" to end the show. Arn's promo is an all-time classic! "Intense pain is a wonderful thing, Gene Okerlund. Your life flashes before your eyes, things that are the most important to you become crystal clear. You start to begin to learn the meaning of life. Last week when they stuffed me in that ambulance and I looked across and I saw Flair, Sting, Woman, Bagwell and myself, I realized that we were people brought together not by philosophy, but by necessity. And I started to think, new world order, new world order, where have I heard that? "And I remembered in the Good Book it says, 'When the new world order is put into place it signals the beginning of the end of time.' Well, WCW is our world, it's where we live and breathe. And if you want to destroy it, Hogan and The Outsiders, you've already made a mistake that jumps off the page. If you're gonna take a baseball bat to a Horseman, finish the job. Because there's one rule of gang fighting. See, we are the original gang and we're the most vicious in all of professional wrestling history. They send one of yours to the hospital, you send two of theirs to the morgue." Three weeks later, Ted DiBiase shows up at ringside and holds up four fingers before saying "Next week, five!" The announcers are convinced he's joining the Four Horsemen. Later that night, the NWO swarm the ring and attack the Horsemen. Sting and Luger are not available for the save because they're led to believe they are chasing the NWO down the highway in a high-speed chase. They even hi-jacked a police vehicle to do so. The next week, you see what appears to be Sting in the parking lot talking to the NWO. Lex Luger confronts him and Sting turns on him ... outside, in the rain, after dark. Of course, the whole Sting thing being revealed as a fake Sting was the shocker of all shockers, capped off by Sting morphing into a different persona because no one in WCW trusted him. Wrestling storylines haven't hit a high note anywhere close since this, really.

I didn't see that until now. Good idea. The whole project is going to take over a year to do anyway, and there aren't even any categories that we're remotely close to having as complete a view as we need, so yes, we can take this time and figure out all the nominations in advance, and anyone who donates needed footage won't have to provide any DVDs or pay postage.

That's funny, because Angle said in his book that he blew up in that match very quickly.

Had he ever expanded on the great booking handed to him and the great wrestling he did himself after 1996, it would be extremely close between he and Liger.

Jushin Liger hands down. Probably the biggest number of great matches as a junior over the longest span of time. Rey, Ultimo, Otani and Benoit would be the next tier.

There's also a difference between stiff and careless. Working snug is probably fine, but working reckless and endangering your opponent is another ballgame entirely. It's possible to work stiff and still protect your opponent. Then again, wrestlers themselves are going to be the ones who are most qualified to have an opinion on this.

The first point should be hilarious to anyone who knows about Meltzer's history of covering Kevin Nash's career. You can almost feel the smarm, if smarm can be felt. The second point is just creating more headaches to WWE because they don't think things through, which they deserve, as usual.

I remember the same rumor and I'm not sure. I can e-mail Meltzer and find out.

If people are standing in the audience because they truly believe Jeff Hardy is about to become WWF World Champion, then yes, the match is above average. Ditto most of the other names mentioned.

Bret Hart has said that if you're in the ring with a great worker, you will catch yourself at times not even knowing if he's touching you.

Dundee was such a fantastic interview that he could convince you of anything. But aside from that, he was a feisty little shit and wrestled hit and run style against big men on a regular basis and looked good doing it. I remember seeing him have a ***1/2 match with KAMALA in 1991 -- of all people -- based entirely on doing that. He eventually wore Kamala down to a point where he got the win because he'd strike and take off. The reason Dundee doesn't get much praise is because no one has seen him.

His run as champ in '02 really didn't get the credit it deserved from anyone (self included) just because he was one of the worst possible choices to be champ at that point in time. But he made Rob Van Dam, John Cena, Jeff Hardy, Kurt Angle, Tommy Dreamer and Taijiri all look like they were about to become the champ at some point or another in that little window, and in retrospect, it was a hell of a run.

While we're talking about being unable to buy slighted wrestlers on top, while he was one of my favorites for years, I have no problem admitting that Jericho sometimes didn't look credible when he was facing guys like Kane and Big Show, even on the rare occasion that he was able to pull a good match out of them. The one exception to that was on the 09/30/02 RAW, where Jericho apparently watched a dozen Bret Hart tapes that afternoon and decided to channel him against Kane.

I totally bought Dundee. Always. I'm glad, but surprised, that no one has said Rey Misterio Jr.

Undertaker is frustratingly good, in that he'll occasionally bust out such a great performance that you're left wondering what the hell he's doing the rest of the time he's out there. The guy could fucking rule if he chose to do so.

Meltzer sums up what I was trying to say in the Styles thread really well.

Benoit upped everyone's game in the company in 2000. Good matches weren't even all that important anymore because Russo had taken the company in such a drastically different direction, and Benoit came in and suddenly people started taking more pride in the quality of their work, not just on the mic. HHH was hilarious, immediately spinning it that Benoit was overrated but very capable of being carried, and being made to look like a fool for ever saying so and quickly shutting up about it.