Loss

Wrestling fans are sick scumbuckets.

People were just as high on the Lynn matches that made the 1990 Yearbook as they were the Wellington match. It's just that the Wellington match hit YouTube, so more people have seen it. That stuff from PWA pre-dated Global, though not by much. It was on the 1990 set when it should have been on the 1991 set.

I choose to believe the smaller Wrestlemania number solely because I smile when that company is humbled, even in a tiny, tiny way.

"Yeah? Well, I hope your babies look like monkeys."

The very end of this video is how I felt after turning in the ballot:

I turned mine in tonight! I'm afraid I'll accidentally spill the beans on something, so I'm not going to post in any nominees' threads from here forward.

Or facts.

I'm pretty sure Black Bart said Hollywood came calling after the Desperados skits.

I'll look into it.

I really love, love, love this thread, and I appreciate you sharing all of this here.

It likely *exists* but it's not in circulation.

They should do that anyway. Why does a guy in backstage segments throughout the show later leave the backstage area and enter through the crowd? Is he wanting a Pepsi or something?

Flair's claims are somewhat verifiable if anyone wants to vet it.

There's an interesting conversation about place in history here, which is not a deciding factor for anyone when it comes to my list, but is absolutely a plus.

Technically, I'd say yes, but I also think he transcends the role in a way the others may not. We think of Morton as a great babyface. We think of Kobashi as a great performer. Not to say Morton isn't a great performer or Kobashi isn't a great babyface, but I just don't think that's what we think of first. It's a colloquial thing.

Jeff Hardy is probably the highest babyface, but he won't be on my list. Joking aside, probably Steamboat, with Rey, Morton and maybe Kikuchi not too far behind.

Well their is the Steamboat/Savage match from Toronto in Feb. which I liked better than Mania. He had a great match with Bret in 86. Jake Roberts from Boston. Don't have dates in front of me. 2/15/87 3/8/86 8/9/86

Who would you rate higher -- Bret Hart or Ricky Steamboat?

Do we have a lot of Santo matches on tape? We do for Rikidozan.

At Smarkschoice, we had a no spoiler policy about revealing our exact placement of someone or posting our full ballots until after the countdown was complete. This kept the anticipation high and also aimed to reduce overly strategic or reactive balloting. I don't know that we need to go that far, but I do think at least refraining from revealing our rankings publicly until after the deadline is a good rule of thumb. Thoughts on that? EDIT: I just read the March Madness thread and think it's even more important to be spoiler free if people are betting on outcomes. EDIT 2: I misread that post and thought it was $10 a head to get in with the winner getting the pot. I was about to lay the hammer down on that happening here, but since that's not the case, it's fine.

I watched three Gorgeous George matches today. I plan on watching a lot more. If I see another 5-6 matches where he impresses me at that level, he's guaranteed a spot somewhere on my list. He really does come across as the guy who invented modern heeling. He also has a nice combination of schtick and grit -- kind of a proto Adrian Street in that regard. For whatever reason, when people reflect on the greats of that era, he often gets forgotten. There's still way more footage to peruse than what I've seen so far, but what I have seen just looks brilliant. Flair, Hogan, Savage, Lawler, Goldust, Jimmy Garvin, Michael Hayes, Shawn Michaels -- any heel with larger than life charisma owes at least some of their act to this guy, whether they know it or not. We are blessed to have plenty of his matches on tape too. Search YouTube and you'll find tons of stuff. I've always thought it odd that such a famous wrestler has largely gone so undiscovered by fans like us.

I'm glad we were able to start the topic! Rikidozan is someone who when I looked over who was nominated was the most glaring omission. We have more of his career on tape than you may think, including a half dozen or so long, complete matches that reflect well on him and a couple dozen JIP or extended clipped matches and that includes singles, tags and six-mans against the premiere workers of his era. I think that's plenty to figure out where he ranks as a worker. As for the key matches: Rikidozan vs Lou Thesz (10/07/57) Rikidozan vs Lou Thesz (10/13/57) Rikidozan vs Fred Blassie (03/28/62) *This was in LA if you want to see him tested in a different setting* Rikidozan vs Fred Blassie (04/23/62) Rikidozan vs The Destroyer (12/02/63) I won't lie and say that being the Godfather of Japanese wrestling isn't playing into my fondness of him, but I also think it's more than his standing as a historical figure. All of those matches are ones I'd go to bat for, and I also like a lot of the extended clips against guys like Masahiko Kimura and Pat O'Connor. To me, he comes across as the best possible version of that super charismatic babyface like a Dusty, JYD, Duggan or Hogan. I don't think there's quite enough footage to say he's definitively better, but anyone who plans on ranking those guys will probably enjoy Rikidozan.

Is it controversial to also think Steamboat and Youngblood were better than the Hart Foundation?

Who would you rate higher and why? I'd probably rate Steamboat higher because I think he peaked higher with the Flair series, because he was a better TV and house show worker and because he was elite for a much longer period of time. But I'd be willing to hear arguments for rating Bret higher too.