JerryvonKramer

Been trying to source the proper spelling of Adnan Al-Kaissie, and although there are seemingly hundreds of different ways it is spelled, that one seems the most common.

Ah shit, is Randy Colley not nominated for GWE?

New Japan 5.4 Tatsumi Fujinami & Akira Maeda vs. Riki Choshu & Higo Hamaguchi (12/2/83) Ah, Choshu's buddies are coming in to the matches now. I'm hoping business is about to pick up. Three of the four are wearing black tights here, I bet Kent Walton is happy he's not calling this one. We get a backdrop suplex on the outside within the first minute. It's weird isn't it, how Choshu upped the action in his tags but not in his singles matches. Great early heat sequence by Choshu and Hamaguchi focused on Fujinami's neck which he injured taking that back suplex on the outside. Hamaguchi uses some cool basic offense like a shoulder breaker and they control with chinlocks, and elbow drops. It's an effective FIP section. Choshu just seems so much more willing to bust out his bombs and work FAST in a tag setting. And it's so much more enjoyable from where I'm sitting. Which is to say that I don't really want to watch Choshu working basic leg holds on Fujinami, I'd much rather see him ripping the joint up and dropping him on his head as he does throughout this match. When Maeda comes in, he slows this match down and things become more mat orientated. You can kind of tell they are setting up to go long during the Maeda - Hamaguchi portion. But not too much lying around in fairness. Fujinami is really working with intensity here. It's like he's possessed and is on a one-man mission to destroy Choshu and his minions. He's fantastic in the switch over to Hamaguchi being the one to be worked over. His character work is actually better than I've given him credit for, he's a dynamic hero. Choshu does some neat little touches of heel character work here too. Pointing at Fujinami on the apron. Using the rope for leverage and then pretending he was going for a tag when the ref checks it. And then holding on until Hamaguchi can get a leg drop in. Pretty great and subtle heel work. This is the longer Japanese tag structure where all four guys are worked over in turn. I'm a fan of that structure, because it creates four different dynamics through the match. I thought Hamaguchi was impressive here and carried his end of things great. Maeda was better as a FIP than when he had to deliver offense, felt he took the pep out of the match too often -- it's the sort of thing that people slaughter Dory Funk Jr for in the 1980s. But super hot finishing stretch with big bombs and excitement. The match drags for short stretches in the middle, but never long enough for me to get bored. Also, I honestly think this feels like it kicks the feud up a notch or two in terms of heat and hatred. Choshu is getting more cocky, Fujinami is getting more pissed off. And the work is getting faster and bigger as a result. That makes me happy. Really good match. ****1/2 New Japan 5.5 Tatsumi Fujinami, Akira Maeda & Kengo Kimura vs. Riki Choshu, Yoshiaki Yatsu & Animal Hamaguchi (12/8/83) Hello Yatsu, I've missed you. Kimura is here to play too. This should be fun. Four guys in black tights in this one, Walton would not be happy! Yatsu's involvement seems to turn the pace up again and now Choshu is working as fast as he would in All Japan. I'm genuinely a bit puzzled by this contrast between him in tags and him in singles. He runs the ropes like a crazed demon in this match. Where was this Choshu back in April? Some awesome triple teaming here from Ishin Gundan. What a great stable eh. Yatsu is sporting a little goatee and is as kickass as ever. He also works ... A million dollar dream! That is a cobra clutch, random! They just beat the tar out of Kimura and Maeda here. Just awesome tags in and out with Choshu hitting bombs, Hamaguchi dropping those sweet elbows and Yatsu hitting knee drops and swinging neckbreakers and multiple suplex variations. This is everything I hoped it would be. Million miles an hour, bombs galore, super stoked crowd, I mean fuck yes Choshu and Yatsu are in the building baby. This is a spotfest for sure, but remember this is 1983 not 2006 with a crowd shouting This is Awesome. It's got real heat, real hatred, some brilliant workers involved, and some super cool triple teams. And it really does feel like business has picked up in NJPW. And I honestly think Yatsu does something to light a firecracker under Choshu's arse cos the contrast in his work when he is and isn't around is huge. ****1/2 New Japan 5.6 Antonio Inoki, Akira Maeda & Yoshiaki Fujiwara vs. Riki Choshu, Yoshiaki Yatsu & Animal Hamaguchi, (2/9/84) Things must be getting serious now if Inoki has inserted himself into proceedings. Honestly Ishin Gundan are just so fucking cool aren't they, like Dangerous Alliance swank heel cool. The sort of thing that smart fans have always worshipped. What I really want is Choshu, Saito, Yatsu, Hamaguchi and Killer Khan all in tuxes walking down the aisle. Maybe ol red pants Kobayashi could wear a red tux. Imagine how awesome that visual of the group would be. Speaking of cool visuals, Fujiwara gets colour early here after his head bandage comes off, and Choshu and co are only happy to attack the cut. Absolutely loved it when Choshu had Inki in the scorpion and Yatsu and Hamachi we're taking turns elbow dropping him and stomping him on the head. The post-match brawl is as fired up and ass-kicking as I've ever seen Inoki look. This stuff is just awesome. Fujinami and Maeda turn up in their red training gear. Fujiwara just looks so bad ass with his cut up face. The heels bail. That stand off is the stuff of legend. Amazing stuff. As for the match, not quite as boom boom boom as the last match, but some really hot stuff and Inoki actually selling and being exciting, which is something in itself. I dug the beatdown on Fujiwara's cut. And the post-match stuff is great. ****

Who was it who made fun of HHH's promo style? Was it Jericho?

Now that I'm less excited about! Also can you remind me is it Saint or is it Vic Faulkner who does the spot where he curls up into a ball?

Been thinking more about Grey and I think he might warrant some comparison to the great Jack Brisco too. Brisco's calling card was as a "defensive champion", in practice that means he spends 85%+ of his matches selling, but then gets in moves on a quick counter. And Grey probably is closer to that than to Martel or Steamer -- I mean both actually take quite a lot of their matches if you watch them, especially in Japan with the endless armwork. Grey has more of that amateur-style sudden explosiveness a la Brisco. So from 20 minutes, his time on offense might be less than 30 seconds, but they are 30 seconds that feel like they have real impact. The fact I feel Grey warrants comparison to any of these guys is some pretty high praise. Truly great working babyfaces are actually pretty rare.

I think this calls for greater exploration on my part. You are right that I've only really seen him against the best guys. Also, I kind of get a kick out of random WoS heels, so it should be fun.

I think this is the sort of guy who'd have a lot more people taking him up if he spent his whole career in WWF. I mean people are arguing that The Barbarian is a guy who might push for the bottom end of their lists, and, well, surely this dude is better than him and has more memorable matches to his name. I like his singles efforts vs. Jumbo in 1986 as well as Choshu in 1990. Add those to all the multiman extravaganzas he was a part of, as well as the 1970s stuff, and I think it is a solid resume.

Memphis 5.1 Fabulous Ones vs. The Moondogs (1/9/84) Wild brawl with a lot of different things being used as weapons. This has been a good feud between these two teams. Not super high end but an enjoyable way to spend eight minutes or so. *** Memphis 5.2 Jimmy Valiant vs. The Assassin (Hair vs. Mask) (4/2/84) This is Hercules by the way. Huh look at that a "genuine" Assassin in Memphis. And honestly, this might be his career singles match. This is so much better than a Boogie Woogie Man vs Herc match has any right to be. Assassin bumps all over the shop, gets some good offense in. Crowd hot and well worked. Paul Jones is here too! ***1/2 Memphis 5.3 Jerry Lawler vs. Randy Savage (4/9/84) I know it's a cliche to complain about stalling in Memphis, but this one legit takes about five minutes to get going and then they lay on the mat for the next five. Takes an age to get going. But once it does, there are some sweet punch exchanges. I don't see people talk about Savage as a great puncher much, but he really lays in the jabs here. I was pretty disappointed by this match. It's almost just too simplistic. The early going was super slow, but then when they do get going the match never really gets beyond punches. You could call it a taste thing, but where I can get fired up by watching Flair and Wahoo slap the shit out of each other, I find it much harder to get excited by punches and that is all this match is. There are a lot of Randy Savage matches I prefer to this one, any of his ones with Flair, most of the 1988 Dibiase ones, all of his greatest hits with Steamboat, Warrior et al. It's coming around to the time when I need to think about a rating and making a call on Lawler for the GWE. And really, what I'm missing here are GREAT matches. This one is in the "memorable" category, and he is likely going to perfect 10 that, but these opponents are coming and going and where are the classics? Will told me that one reason Flair had an unfair advantage over Lawler is that he had more opportunities to work great opponents while Lawler was working scrubs. Okay, but Randy Savage? He's not a scrub is he and this match really ought to be a bit better than this. I sound like I'm running down Lawler here, I'm not, he's good at what he does. But I'm really struggling to see the #1 GWE case running through this stuff. ***1/2 Memphis 5.4 Eddie Gilbert & Tommy Rich vs. Pretty Young Things (4/12/84) The Pretty Young Things are Koko Ware and one of the original members of the Midnight Express, Norvell Austin. This was a pretty long match and so much of it saw Rich sitting in a nerve hold applied by Austin. Pretty dull stuff, I thought, despite how well the babyfaces sold for Ware and Austin. Snooze fest. *1/2

I think the problem is that when you've seen him dress up like Hulk Hogan, goof around, do moonsaults and job in 10 minute tv matches, it's hard to put the genie back in the bottle. What Vince probably should have done is made a deal years ago with New Japan and maybe even one of the Mexican promotions, and had him shipped out twice a year for three to four months. Kept him special and strong. And made it seem like a big deal when he'd come back. It's kind of weird how little he learned from his father when you think about it.

No, it's this one:

I hate to disagree with OJ, when he's done so much to try to uncover some of the great WOS workers, but I don't get why he thinks Saint is so overrated. Breaks is the clear #1, that's obvious, but based on everything I've seen, which is less than OJ for sure, I'd have Saint jockeying with Grey for #2. I haven't been able to get into Jon Cortez as much, find him bland. Honestly I find the babyfaces all merging into one. It doesn't help that they all wear black trunks and have that same haircut. I mean if Alan Sarjeant and Jon Cortez were standing side by side, I'm not sure if I could tell you who is who. Johnny Saint has made more of an impression. I'd like to see all three of Breaks, Grey and Saint make my list. I'm not sure who else I could justify rating at this point.

Another standout match for him is vs. Assassin (4/2/84). That's Herecules by the way.

http://placetobenation.com/all-japan-excite-series-14/ Back once again for the All Japan masters / KT damager / Power to the people / With the ill behaviour. 10/18/96 - Toshiaki Kawada vs Kenta Kobashi 10/18/96 - Akira Taue, Giant Baba & Dory Funk Jr vs Mitsuharu Misawa, Jumbo Tsuruta & Jun Akiyama, 11/16/96 - Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama vs Steve Williams & Johnny Ace 11/22/96 - Toshiaki Kawada & Akira Taue vs Steve Williams & Johnny Ace 11/29/96 - Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama vs Toshiaki Kawada & Akira Taue

Honky Tonk Man Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 0/3 1/3 1/3 = 2 Intangibles 3 Great matches 1 Length of Peak [never one of the best in the world] = 0 +1 ability to work babyface +1 ability to work gimmick matches +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work different gimmicks (Blonde Bomber) Ability to work different styles / roles = 4 Variety = 2 12 Iron Sheik Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 3/3 1/3 1/3 = 5 Intangibles 3 Great matches 4 Length of Peak 1979-85 = 6 years = 4 +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work gimmick matches +1 ability to work brawls +1 ability to work different gimmicks ("Great Hussein Arab" / "Col Mustafa") +3 ability to get over in multiple markets (JCP, GCW, WWF, Mid-South, WCCW, WCW, indies) Ability to work different styles / roles = 8 Variety = 4 28 Chief Jay Strongbow Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 0/3 1/3 3/3 = 4 Intangibles 3 Great matches 1 Length of Peak [never one of the best in the world] = 0 +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work gimmick matches +2 ability to get over in multiple markets (GCW, WWF, Detroit, Florida) Ability to work different styles / roles = 4 Variety = 3 15 Ivan Putski Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 0/3 0/3 2/3 = 2 Intangibles 4 Great matches 1 Length of Peak [never one of the best in the world] = 0 +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work gimmick matches +1 ability to work different gimmicks ("Mighty Igor") +1 ability to get over in multiple markets (JCP, GCW, WWF) Ability to work different styles / roles = 4 Variety = 3 14 Ernie Ladd Basic (offense, selling, psychology) 1/3 1/3 3/3 = 5 Intangibles 5 Great matches 0 Length of Peak [never one of the best in the world] = 0 +1 ability to work tags +1 ability to work gimmick matches +3 ability to get over in multiple markets (GCW, JCP, WWF, Mid-South, LA, WWA, Central States) Ability to work different styles / roles = 5 Variety = 4 19

He's the new Dusty isn't he

I think he's a contender for "best FIP ever" in a conversation with Ricky Morton, Steamboat, Terry Funk, Kobashi, Kikcuhi, and Rick Martel.

His thread links to Jr. Pete, how much has Chavo been helped by Houston stuff on NWA classics?

I'm worried about people forgetting about Tully so I'm bumping his thread.

We've discussed it three million times before. So there's no fairness. More ratings soon.

Here's one of the matches from the World of Sport run, if interested: Cropped up on the side when I was watching the Spiros Arion match.

Of the classic Bruno challengers, Arion is probably the one we have the most footage of and also the one who looks most impressive in that footage. He was one of the few glimmers of hope in the 1975 footage, which could be -- at times -- totally fucking dire. The Golden Greek was a big name in Australia around the same time as Denucci was, but in the US he worked as a dastardly heel. Outside of WWF, we have footage of him in the old Aussie WCW against Abby, here: And against Jack Brisco: He also, randomly, crops up in World of Sport, in this longish bout: And here: I've nominated Arion because he is one of those workers who feels totally lost to time.

Sometimes it is forgotten that the Von Erichs had an evil Nazi uncle. Waldo was an absolutely fearless worker who was not above goosestepping or giving a few Heil Hitlers, even as late as 1975 to generate heat. You could say it is cheap, but name a heel from the past .... ooooh 20 years to be as over as that (who isn't John Cena or Roman Reigns ¬_¬) I've nominated him because from what I've seen he was probably a better worker than ... basically any of the von Erich boys or Fritz with the possible exception of Kerry.

Before Mr. Saito carried the workload for Fuji, there was Professor Tanaka. Long-time Bruno challenger and a reasonably big-time heel in his day, before he went on to make movies. You can get a good idea of what Tanaka was about from this clip of him in Memphis attacking Jerry Lawler: Here is he beating up jobber Steve King: The most footage we have of him is in the tag run with Fuji. You can see he was kinda like a Haku / Meng of his day. He definitely also had a "cool look".

Graham's case is that he did all the things Jesse Ventura could do, but was more over and was a shade better in the ring. He worked his character well. Had better timing and a better understanding of crowd psychology. I would argue that on occassion he is hurt by bad booking. Why would you ever book him to go an hour with Harley Race? It's just stupid. But if positioned well, he is among the top tier guys for "intangibles".