MoS

Of course Omega's booking is not close to as awful as Hunter's run of terror, but that promo was not a good sign. Trying too hard to be unlikeable and looking like a geek in the process is also a valid explanation. I don't get that. Their most acclaimed promo guys are Mox, King and Taz, and none of those three use shooty insider terms (Kingston saying he is not going to do sports-entertainment aside, but that's the opposite of an insider term) or bury their opponents in any way. Unless you think Mox calling MJF a virgin is burying him, but I admittedly popped at that

I dunno if we are ready to move beyond the War Games discussion, but what did you all think of the Omega promo? I thought it was boring, went way too long, and did nothing but attempt to bury Orange, when they need to build him in his first PPV main event. Thankfully, Omega sucks at cutting heel promos so he couldn't actually bury Orange, but the booking was so weird. What, was Omega watching Raw 2002-04? Did he think "You know what our show REALLY needs? Some of those 15-min rambling heel world champ Triple H promos about how my opponent isn't on my level." Also it was funny to listen to him say Orange copied him by wearing sunglasses. I can think of one or two wrestlers who wore goggles to the ring before Omega

The latest non-controversy about AEW and Botchmania was hilarious. Amazing how, despite AEW giving plenty of ground for legitimate criticism, there are all these sad weirdos whose aim in life is to piss on AEW for daring to go against their beloved billion dollar childhood institution

Wood also had one of the best lines in the show's history, about how the best way to break up with a girl is to make her think it's her idea. That was a massive burn at Bischoff's expense, and I wouldn't be surprised if 83 Weeks soon did a special episode of "Brian Pillman in WCW: Eric Bischoff SETS THE RECORD STRAIGHT"

Absolutely dead at how even in this pic of everyone laughing and having fun, including Baba-san himself, Kawada STILL looks grumpy and pissed off. The man probably kicked the doctor who delivered him in the face as soon as he climbed out of his mom's womb

I have seen people say that they have had bad finishes to two straight big-time gimmick matches now, and like, are we just going to ignore the Lights Out Britt-Rose match? Maybe Britt can teach Jericho how to blade without showing the entire world what he is doing.

AEW topped the 18-49 chart for the first time ever and did so by a huge margin for a show literally titled Blood and Guts. Maybe it's time to definitively retire the narrative that blood and violence is chasing away women viewers

I haven't listened to it yet, but apparently Meltzer was really vague and confusing and weird about the Daniel Bryan contract situation.

A friend of mine texted me saying "That Jericho bump was more padded than the directors cut of The Hobbit movies" and that honestly might be the most brutal insult I have read so far of that bump

I think that's Joeg's point. The "one" box KO checks is probably that he can talk

So apparently, the reason for this is that the prelim matches were taped but they were using the live crowd reaction to the matches. So what we were hearing was the match being shown on the big screen, and the crowd reacting to it

The Jericho one or the Matt one? The Matt one was of course unnecessary and the fact that they continued the match after that might be the biggest black mark in AEW's history. The Jericho one..I don't know. They had a clear idea for the finish, but I guess, apart from wanting to write off Jericho, they probably als thought it was the wrestling eqquivalent of Chekov's gun. If you have teased a big spot, then you kind of have to do it, otherwise fans might complain. With the benefit of hindsight, I would just not do the rooftop finish at all. There was a clear point where the match started falling off, and it was when it took Jericho about 3 hours to slooooooooowly, gingerly climb the cage. Sammy Guevera could have climbed the cage, done a 630 degree splash from the top of it, got up and climbed up again in the time it took Jericho to climb the cage once lol. Jericho's historica, famous weakness has been trying to do physical, athletic spots that he is not capable of. So of course he was going to try this lol

I would say my big disagreement in this topic is that I don't think this was much worse than normal similar stunts honestly. This was an average Shane McMahon/Jeff Hardy bump imo. There have been many better Shane McMahon/Jeff Hardy bumps. There have been as many, if not more, worse bumps. It definitely looked bad/funny. My only point of surprise is the extent to which it has been focused on and dissected. Most similar bumps in major wrestling looks similar to me imo, crash pads and all. I don't think it was embarrassingly fake, in that it wasn't much different from the usual kind of bumps of this nature. Of course, they should have never showed the close-up of Jericho falling. The money was in focusing on MJF's expressions. Letting fans imagine the Jericho fall would have been actually more effective. It's why I don't think it is fair to compare this to the Explosion dud. That one was a disaster. AEW had literally sold their most PPV buys ever on the premise that the ring was going to explode. Sure, there would be a match before it, but it was basically the setup to the explosion. And then the explosion never happened. This, though? Here the hook was the match itself. The stunt bump was supposed to be the unexpected cherry on top. It didn't work out, but it was not the main hook. Hell, they had a similar, much more dangerous bump an hour before when Darby went flying down the stairs. Actually, now that I think of it, the bigger issue is them booking two spots like this on the same night. Even if this would have gone perfectly, having two holy shit falls in one show would just dilute both

One bad-faith defence by AEW fans on Twitter is that the ones criticising it want wrestlers to take unsafe bumps and get injured. Like, no, not at all. Just shoot it better. Or at least TRY to hide the crash pad. They probably were really scared about a repeat of the All Out Matt Hardy situation and went in the other direction. J.R using his patented Owen Hart voice definitely hurt. This is much harsher than my reaction but I think it is fair. Really like the point about focusing on MJF's face. He already had a crimson mask, and he has great facial expressions. It would have made for a tremendous visual. I actually went and rewatched the KOTR 98 spot, and they never shows a close-up of Mankind going through the table until like the 5th replay. The live angle was a wide shot and it made it even better imo, cuz you could see the pure distance which Foley travelled in his brief fall. It's really weird cuz I am sure they did some rough rehearsals of this match, and the spot. Did they not bother trying to see how their intended production would look like?

Yeah the fed sucks, thanks for agreeing! No one criticises AEW here more than I do, so I am perfectly comfortable with my sensitivity about AEW. SHotzi Blackheart trying to troll someone for a funny bump that is a trademark of one of her bosses is hilarious. It's not a regular thing at all, given they do crazy stuff every week. But they should definitely improve upon easily avoidable nonsense like not hiding the crash pad. Again to reiterate though, a funny bump is a dime a dozen in wrestling and is really not the story of the night. Not knowing how to stick the landing in general is the bigger issue. Omega being a dork who undercuts the big match they have been building to for weeks 10 minutes before it begins is the bigger issue. She has nearly killed herself on live TV on so many occasions, it is ridiculous. I haven't watched NXT in a while, but last year I remember watching at 5:30 AM when it would air in India and feeling like I was dreaming, it used to get scary.

LMAO at anyone who works in the QAnon capital of wrestling making fun of anything in wrestling for being funny or embarrassing

Imagine having a reality show about a wrestling couple, and it is Cody and Brandi, and not Mox and Kingston. I want a three-hour buddy cop movie starring Mox and King. Followed by a TV show about my favourite couple in wrestling

I am honestly surprised that more people on Twitter are talking about the stupid bump than other, actual issues with the match, like the fact that, as pointed out, the old crazy violent intensity of War Games isn't very compatible with the long, epic, all-the-moves-in-the-world modern War Games. The bump was funny and stupid but unlike the terrible explosion dud at Revolution, this was normal wrestling level funny/stupid. Chris Jericho doing a bad Shane McMahon impression isn't the issue. Chris Jericho being slow as a molass and seemingly having forgotten how to wrestle in front of a camera, with all his spot-calling (literally tapping MJF's leg when it was time to reverse the walls) and no-selling and blatant blading, on the other hand, is a big issue. He better be out for the rest of the year. He needs some absence so we start missing him and get fond of him.

Truly his dad's son. Except Dusty would never sell for QT

They'll also do well not to book any crazy big-time high-impact spot for a loong while though. It just never seems to work for them. Maybe it's a sign from the wrestling gods. At least this time they didn't ask people to fork over $50 for a PPV to potentially see Jericho fall softly onto a crash pad

Also, for future War Games booking, this is a great thread and makes some very salient points

It wouldn't have been an issue if JR wasn't screaming about how the floor is PURE CONCRETE

I will say this though, while the finish worked for me in the sense that it showed Jericho getting outsmarted and being the weak link, going to the cage top when the entire idea of War Games is that you are trapped and the only way to win is submit or surrender. Kind of makes the gimmick useless and superfluous, although of course Hell in a Cell saw plenty of escapes too

Yeah I thought the crash pad was funny but "bush league"? I have been seeing this happen on all crazy bumps since the attitude era. Wrestlemania 17 had a much more comical "holy shit" bump when Taker chokeslammed Hunter through 3 feet of air onto a crash pad. Pretty much every match on a big stage in the last 20 years have used crash pads, and they have all been visible. Perhaps not as easily as this one, but it has always been fairly obvious to anyone watching. Same thing with the commercials. They sucked and they definitely hurt, but the match I thought was excellent despite them. Plus, the entire reason they put this on TV was to sell ads to advertisers and prove themselves to be a valuable TV product. It is an inevitability.

The commercials sucked, but I really don't get the take that the match got killed cuz of them. The entire match upto the last break, with the Inner Circle decisively getting the better of Pinnacle, was absolutely crazy and excellent. The last 1/4th of the match slowed due to the cagetop fighting and Jericho being slower than soil erosion, but the idea that the match got "killed dead" when it had excellent action and a finish that strongly put over MJF is completely alien to me