C.S.

Because it's two totally different things. Goldy's streak came in by beating JTTS every week on Nitro. It was a steady, conscious effort (past the faux-pas with McMichael at first) and was vital to Goldy's character. Sure, after a while he began to beat more names, but he was built as a squash-worker basically. Asuka's streak was that no-one could beat her in NXT, no challenger could take her and then no one on the main roster could take her down either. But it was not about squashing people, matches were always competitive. And it was only a part of her character, but not the entire character. Asuka was much more than her streak. For starters, she was a hell of a worker. And to deny she was over is, well, being in denial. She was over as fuck at Mania. I'd argue that Charlotte coming off her cold SD stint was the one was "wasn't that over", but she's such a great performer that it doesn't matter (add in the fabulous megastar intro she got too). Anyway the point is that of course it couldn't be the same as Goldy's streak. As far as Tatanka & Borga, the old 90's WWF fan in me is smiling, but honestly, this was a totally different era (so was Nitro, but it's still much closer in form to the current product). I don't remember when Tatanka being undeafeted began to really be a thing as part of his push, I do think it was important, although much more circumstancial. It's not like he was doing much after not getting the IC title from Michaels. Yes, Borga beating him seemed big at the time but really, when you look back at it, it was an angle to put Borga (and Yoko) over, Tatanka went nowhere after that point… Borga the Nazi didn't exactly set the world on fire at Survivor Series either after ending the streak. I doubt Asuka will suffer the same fate as Tatanka did, and Charlotte on the other hand looks like a big star again, which puts her on the way to a big match with Rousey, so really you can argue than yes, Asuka's streak was much more efficient. I can agree that Asuka was more than her streak, but the streak and forced "history making" propped her up. Asuka is smoke and mirrors. Without the streak, she'd be face Nakamura in the fans' eyes. Even with it, the fans cared about her a lot less than the top 5 female acts and even an ice cold Bayley. As for Tatanka, this is being nitpicky, but I think people cared after his streak. The Tatanka/Lex "you sold out" program and subsequent heel turn were pretty big deals. I'd argue that he faltered right after the heel turn, which clearly didn't work past the actual act at SummerSlam. You're right about Charlotte going into Mania cold, but that's because she is badly miscast as a babyface. There's nothing likeable about her and no reason to cheer her. Despite the deficits both Asuka and Charlotte brought to WrestleMania, they still had a hell of a match and the result was a genuine shocker, so there's that. As you should! The fall? She just had the second best match at Mania, and the best match of Charlotte's career that didn't involve Sasha. It's not like she's Bayley or anything. We're not talking about kayfabe rasslin' results. As pointed out by numerous people in this thread, Asuka's presentation waned pretty early on. Besides, I'd argue that people care more about Bayley - even now, even when she's ice cold - than they do about Asuka. People want Bayley vs. Banks. People want Bayley to matter again. People would gladly trade Asuka's forced "history making" streak for another good Bayley run. The time they could have spent capitalizing on genuinely hot acts they had - like Bayley and Sasha Banks - were instead wasted on forced "history" and a boring streak that was barely over. I think losing the streak will be the best thing that ever happens to Asuka. She'll never be a star on the level of Ronda Rousey, the Four Horsewomen (either version), or Alexa Bliss, but she has a niche she can fill.

My votes: Bryan vs. AJ: Both are infinitely gifted in-ring performers. For me, it came down to charisma and connection to the fans. Bryan has both in ways AJ's never had and never will. Flair vs. Misawa: I abstained. I haven't seen enough of Misawa. Bret vs. Steamboat: It might be a generational thing, but I voted for Bret. As incredible as both of them were in-ring, Bret had more memorable feuds and connected with the fans on a deeper level. About the only advantage Steamboat had was being able to wrestle much better matches with Ric Flair - all of Bret's were stinkers and style-clashes from what I've heard (I never caught their WCW matches because they were pointless by then). Steamboat might have been a slightly better babyface, but Bret was a great baby and a great heel - something Steamboat never had the chance to be. Also, Bret got to be "the guy" in a way Steamboat never was - and I'd argue never could be.

Not at all. A bunch of other people jumped in to detail the rise and fall of Asuka, so that work is already done for me. Starting out over (and I'm not even sure she did that) and staying over are two different things. Look at Nakamura, who I was nuts about at first - the bloom was definitely off the rose within a couple of months, never mind the main roster. His heel turn has been entertaining so far though, so I'm cautiously optimistic. No one has bothered to address my main point: Was Asuka's streak ever as big, organic, and over as Goldberg's streak? No, not even close. It felt like forced "history making" because it was. Even the Tatanka and Ludvig Borga streaks had more juice.

This is a pretty good interview that explains they had a lot more (Stephanie, Japan, the title win/referee/DiBiase angle, etc.) but cut a lot out for pacing. http://www.espn.com/wwe/story/_/id/23098974/wwe-digging-origins-journey-making-hbo-andre-giant-documentary-producer-bill-simmons I'd love a special edition Blu-ray with all of that footage included as extras.

I completely understand the hometown aspect. Differing viewpoints don't bother me in the least. It's refreshing that I can dislike Asuka, Joe, Kassius Ohno, etc. without being accused of trolling like I probably would be on any other board. It's why PWO is great. P.S. Was your "Renee" an ex-girlfriend or something?

To be fair, the pre-show is a shitty spot to be in and a demotion - kinda hard to get geared up for that.

Yep, because Renee seems pretty beloved and appears to be a genuine wrestling fan. Yours is literally the first cross word I've ever seen against her anywhere. And Asuka isn't over, or at least her streak wasn't. Unlike Goldberg's, it was forced, completely inorganic, and - here's the important part - no one gave a shit.

This is a weird hot take.

Hopefully this is just for India Saudi Arabia.

If they had Carmella end Asuka's streak via MiTB cash-in, the entire internet would have gone ablaze pretending to care about Asuka and the streak all of a sudden - it would have been truly marvelous to watch. WWE wants to protect Asuka and keep her strong, and there's nothing wrong with that. Charlotte isn't the "monster" type, so this doesn't really hurt her the way it might have hurt an undefeated Asuka.

Ending the streak was a mercy killing. No one cared about it - or Asuka - compared to the Goldberg streak, or even the Tatanka and Ludvig Borga streaks. It was epitome of forced "history making" on WWE's part. I don't think this hurts Charlotte at all. She had a tough match two days ago with very little time to recover, got attacked tonight by debuting wrestlers she wasn't expecting, and Carmella took advantage of the situation. As far as bullshit MiTB cash-ins go, this is one of the least offensive.

IMO, if anyone's earmarked for a future singles push, it's Kofi. It's always been Kofi. Kofi gets to: - be the sole New Day member on the WM advertising (2016 or 2017) - make solo appearances like WWE Photo Shoot (WWE Network show) - have a memorable Royal Rumble spot every year etc.

I found the New Day interview: http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2018/0407/638708/the-new-day-on-what-they-call-people-who-want-them-to-break-up/

I read somewhere from one of the New Day members that they feel there's no need to split them up because they can still achieve their singles goals while together. I agree. Edit: http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2018/0407/638708/the-new-day-on-what-they-call-people-who-want-them-to-break-up/

BRAUN is indeed the answer, but with two World Titles, Joe's chances are as good as anyone's - the ice cold Nakamura got pushed into that spot despite being completely underwhelming on the main roster and giving AJ Styles his worst big match on PPV (not counting the ones with KO). I'm not saying *I* want to see Joe in that position - Nicholas would be more interesting to me than Joe - but to say there isn't a chance seems inaccurate to me, especially in a year that Ronda will (probably) be the true main event anyway.

Nah, I don't see Bryan going to Raw. He was clear even before his previous retirement that he wanted to make Smackdown his show, and this was years before they brought back the brand split.

Am I the only one who thinks Bryan vs. AJ is really just a setup for some KO/SZ shenanigans?

A Lashley World Title run hardly excites me, but there's a difference between a run and making him "the guy." He'll never be "the guy" but he'll get a run. No big deal, other than making the worthless Universal Title picture even duller. Joe vs. Lashley at next year's WM? I'm getting sleepy just thinking about it. In the meantime, the Joe vs. Roman feud could actually be compelling. I've been waiting years for Joe to position himself as a Samoan outsider - the ONE Samoan who ISN'T in the Anoa'i family. I'm not a fan of Joe, but that practically writes itself. Now I kinda wish they didn't waste the absurd "Vince's boy" storyline on Lesnar, when it would be perfect for Joe vs. Roman.

I created these if anyone wants them. I like them so much that I almost want to start rooting for Joe.

Agreed. I erased my Joe post before I saw yours. It's better left for another thread (or not at all, since I actually deleted it and can't get it back, lol).

Since people seem to know me by who I don't like, I'll get a jump on the next person and point out ahead of time that I also don't like Kassius Ohno. (My dislike of Adam Cole doesn't seem controversial 'round these parts.)

Nobody's ready for Asuka.

Aren't the vacant Raw Tag Team Titles being decided in Saudi Arabia?

This will happen on any board. You sometimes post something and it's "ignored." Or, worse, you're the last post in a thread and you feel like you killed the thread, lol. But no one is ignoring you and you didn't kill the thread (unless you're this guy ) - these things sometimes happen. One tip: Try uploading an avatar for yourself. They might make your posts more noticeable. I'm not sure if that kind of thing matters on this board, but it's definitely had an effect on other boards I post in.