BigBadMick

Long time since I've watched Havoc but wow - I'll look forward to hearing you argue that.

Great stuff as usual lads - listened to this at work today (lots of Parv) I always thought this was WCW's best ppv of 91, with only SuperBrawl as possible competition.....

Really enjoyed this today at work, thanks lads. Will definately try to dig up the recommended matches.

I think you just articulated all the dorment irritations I have with Wade and Bruce! But you're right, they're good guys to read/listen to once you get past that. Thanks for the Booker T article recommendation.

He has a two parter (I think) coming up with Shawn Michaels, who describes events in the gorilla position during and after Lesnar v Undertaker. Don't think Michaels would put up with being subjected to a rant.

Can you recommend anything in particular? I have most Torches from 2002-12. I'm not asking for a specific date, just good writing around a particular incident or topic.

The Orwellian overtones in WWE since last September is getting very old......

JR was on with Wade Keller for almost 4 hours of audio last week. He sounded at peace with himself and acknowledged that perhaps he took himself too seriously in the past which set him up for ribs. He said he looks back and thinks 'really, JR, really?' Time to deactivate this thread. Goodnight everyone!

I've been listening to his stuff for about a year now. I enjoy his knowledge, experience and insight, but harping on about the same 'issues' on modern wrestling weekly can get a bit repetative and grating.

Tragic.

Don't know if it jumped that shark but I'd had my fill by the end of 08. Nothing in particular was annoying me going into 09, but I never mustered the enthusiasm to follow as closely thereafter. Something Savage - Irish, right?

When I started this, I meant what did you consider dream matches that had actually happened. But this stuff is fine too...

If wrestling isn't grabbing my attention, I find it easier to stop watching, step back, let a few things unfold and cherry pick the pimped stuff afterwards. Similarly, I find myself favouring proven, well regarded films and tv shows over something new a lot of the time. I have to remind myself that it's still nice to take a chance that something might get better if you persevere sometimes.....

Undertaker's best year was probably 97, followed by 07 and 08 (wasn't a full timer by then, but the Batista and Edge matches were super). Perhaps 02 is worth a mention also.

I'm with you on Taker/HHH. I thought most of the match was garbage until the last few nearfalls. I actually enjoyed their HIAC match more even though it was pretty over the top with the acting. Their Mania 17 match is still my favorite. Agree on 3 stages of Hell. Huge fan of Austin in 01 generally too. I've tried to like it (oh how I've tried!) but cannot. Might give it one more go sometime.

I love US film history, and US history and politics in general. Wrestling has certainly aided my understanding of geography and cultural quirks throughout the states.

One massive drawback in the demise of WCW was it severely restricted the potential for future dream matches. My classification of dream matches is two comparably highly regarded workers, or massive draws, having moved up the ranks in separate areas and coming together for the first time in a, well, Clash of the Titans. The last such matches I can think of were Angle/Michaels in 05 and Angle/Joe in 06. I'm not saying I haven't been excited or inspired by a match since, but it's virtually impossible to get two wrestlers up to that level without some interaction before they're both big big names. Within my criteria, what's everyone else's last true dream match?

It didn't. Pity.

I thought it was interesting a few weeks back when Corny admitted he really didn't watch mid to late 80's WWF (while saying that he taped and watched anything else he could get, even while working full time with JCP). Looking through old Observers, I can see that Meltzer wasn't singing the praises of much under his Titan section, but I would have thought Corny would find something worthwhile in the tag division and all the workers he rated highly pre-WWF. Or maybe his aversion to everything happening with WWF was too strong to look for anything worthwhile there-in? Either way, found it fascinating.

Looking forward to things settling down a bit with the Smackdown 6 in the autumn. You won't hear ME slagging off match structure with Angle/Edge/Benoit etc...

Watched it again recently. Thought it was solid, bit overly long. Probably Flair's best in a long time, but HHH had a better HiaC with Batista that June, imo....

I remember really liking the Souled Out 98 match with Bret. Thought it was Flair's best since the Savage match at GAB 95. Agree that there wasn't much essential stuff between those two matches though.

Read through this entire thread last weekend (great stuff!) and while I agree that lots of TNA is utterly detestable gunk (yes, gunk!) I think the May-December 2012 period deserves more love. The Bound for Glory matches on Impact weekly were rock solid and the PPVs were always worth your time. Kudos to Joe, Angle, Roode, Aries, Hardy, Bully Ray, Styles, Daniels and Kaz for that brief resurgence. Loved it.

I've enjoyed reading the last few pages on this thread. Reminds me of the glory days (I'd say 04 all the way to end of 08, and plenty of decent stuff in 09 too). RoH is one reason I haven't commited on the pre/post 1996 debate....

I've been reading Torches from this period, really enjoying these podcasts too. 2002 WWF/E was messy as hell......