Bookers with undeserved bad reps

[Sean Liska]

There is a definite shift in TV style in 1998. I would say Summerslam was the dividing point, but I'm not sure if that's entirely correct. But the format and flow of a typical show was very, very Russo by October or November at the latest.

SummerSlam 98 was the apex on my WWF fandom. There was some stuff I didn't like with the new direction of course (for instance, the retarded use of Kaientai), but all in all the build to this show was terrific and it delivered. After, it was a painfull downward spiral, with the Survivor Series being the first extremely Russoesque show with zero good matches and all stories and swerves. The Royal Rumble 99 ended my relationship with WWF for ever. I stopped being a fan right there, never looked back since.

 

I would seriously invest in a 2000 RAW DVD set.

[sek69]

I found it very telling that the episode where RAW finally broke Nitro's 83 week winning streak was all non finishes. Between Undertaker interrupting all the matches to goad Kane and the main event of Austin-McMahon turning into the return of Dude Love, everything on the show was a schmozz.

 

Ironically, considering the detour this thread took, it also had the promos building to the debut of Val Venis. Those porno double entendres that were so edgy in 1998 come off so forced and corny in 2010.

[Strummer]

There is a definite shift in TV style in 1998. I would say Summerslam was the dividing point, but I'm not sure if that's entirely correct. But the format and flow of a typical show was very, very Russo by October or November at the latest.

 

I think you're spot on with that. The post Summerslam shows in Sept. and Oct. seemed like different shows with all the short matches and tons iof run ins, dqs and swerves. That kind of booking starting in late 97/early 98 but by fall 98 it was the norm

 

and yes the build to Summerslam 98 was fantastic. BTW in Russo's shoot he claims he wanted Undertaker to turn heel in the build up on Austin but Vince vetoed it

[Loss]

Good move on Vince's part. Undertaker as a heel would have made the build work a little less. They really hyped that match very well over three months.

 

Russo obviously had influence prior to that time of the year, but yeah, not in the same way.

[kjh]

I think the SummerSlam main event garnering disappointing heat when Austin and Undertaker vetoed Russo's ideas for the match and decided to do a clean babyface vs. babyface match instead probably helped Russo get more influence over the product.

[jdw]

It's fun to imagine that in 20 years people will still be arguing over how much Russo Sucked vs the Russo Rehabilitation Movement. It's a bit like people rehabbing the image of Nixon.

 

You know... all that stuff about how Nixon may have had issues domestically, but did wonders internationally. Like dragging on the Viet Nam war for an extra four years, authorizing mass war crimes in Laos and Cambodia, the later of which paved the way for the Khmer Rouge to take over Cambodia and add another few million to the Nixon-Kissenger Body Count. Wait, I'm forgetting the toppling of President Allende in Chile and replacing him with US friendly dictator Pinochet. Yeah... that's some kick ass foreign policy.

 

Russo will be the same way. For as long as he lives, he'll be putting himself over and excusing away all the negatives: someone else's fault. And the folks who actually tracked the horrorshow if his "greatness", or even vividly recall the details of the Raw era he takes credit for, are slowly but surly going to wander off from their interest in pro wrestling... or our memory is going to fade a bit. Folks in this thread have pointed out things I've "forgotten": thoughts of that era and of pointing out the Bullshit in Russo's thirst for credit have been pushed out of my mind. Similar to all the Bullshit about the greatness of Heyman in the late 90s and early 00s.

 

I think in the end, Russo will get rehabbed. Wouldn't be surprised if he ends up in the WON HOF when Dave Meltzer III is running it in 2070.

 

 

John

[Sean Liska]

I think the SummerSlam main event garnering disappointing heat when Austin and Undertaker vetoed Russo's ideas for the match and decided to do a clean babyface vs. babyface match instead probably helped Russo get more influence over the product.

Yeah, but that show did over 600,000 buys, so they couldn't be too unhappy.

[Bob Morris]

I think the SummerSlam main event garnering disappointing heat when Austin and Undertaker vetoed Russo's ideas for the match and decided to do a clean babyface vs. babyface match instead probably helped Russo get more influence over the product.

Yeah, but that show did over 600,000 buys, so they couldn't be too unhappy.

 

True, but PPV buys are a sign of how good your buildup was, not how well received the matches themselves are. The live crowd just didn't react and I suspect part of that is because of what a face vs. face match can lead to.

 

While I don't feel Taker turning heel would have been a good move, the problem with doing a face vs. face matchup as your main event is that it can force people to choose sides... and at that point, Austin and Taker were two guys both portrayed as having an axe to grind with Vince McMahon.

 

It didn't help, either, that they didn't have anyone built up as a top challenger to Austin to bridge the gap to Rock, who was certainly going to be the foil against Austin at WMXV. True, the Survivor Series storyline wasn't built as well as it should have been, but I could understand why they would have to keep Rock heel after that show... and it wasn't that they turned him face prior to the show, he was just getting cheered because people started wanting to.

[Jingus]

The live crowd just didn't react and I suspect part of that is because of what a face vs. face match can lead to.

Why is this myth still around? Go back and watch the match. They reacted just fine. It was a slightly less overwhelming reaction than some of Austin's main events got, but that's inevitable in a babyface match. They just didn't have anyone in the match whom the crowd really hated and wanted to die. Still a louder crowd than most PPV main events get now. For example, they popped LIKE THIS on the finish.

 

If you want a genuinely quiet crowd, just check out how they sounded around the halfway point of the Cold Day In Hell match, one year prior:

.

 

I think the SummerSlam main event garnering disappointing heat when Austin and Undertaker vetoed Russo's ideas for the match and decided to do a clean babyface vs. babyface match instead probably helped Russo get more influence over the product.

I remember in an interview Russo mentioned that match was supposedly awful, and Austin and Taker were so embarassed about it that they walked around with their heads down for days. Which I call bullshit on. Austin was admittedly knocked loopy early in the match, but they still recovered and turned it into a perfectly decent match. Hell, I'd say it's probably my favorite singles match from those two men, god knows they had several that were worse.

[MJH]

I'd say it probably holds up better than any of the 1998 (or 1999 for that matter) main events, with the possible exception of the second Austin/Foley match. Maybe not in a "WWF Attitude Era" crazy sense (and so not to, say, what I'd imagine Russo's tastes would be) but still...

[kjh]

Yeah, Russo may have been embellishing the story a bit, but given that Austin and Taker are perfectionists, I wouldn't be surprised if they were disappointed in the match. It was a good match, but it couldn't follow the preceding ladder match which was Rock's breakout performance. In this case the hype was better than the match itself, which probably helped Russo's standing when Austin and Taker nixed his script, and what they came up with instead didn't really click.

[El-P]

I thought this was by far the best match of the night, the best Taker vs Austin match ever, and the closest thing to a legit MOTYC the WWF could deliver. Yeah, the heat was down because the crowd had been drained by the ladder match (which wasn't very good when you think about it, and although Rock was over like hell, he wasn't a very good worker at that point), and because a face vs face match wouldn't draw the same heat but that wasn't the fault of Austin nor Taker. It was a rare no bullshit wrestling match, which I guess is why Russo hates it, but as far as the work goes, it was great. Russo and his idiotic booking then saw fit to re-book Austin and Taker for the two next PPV with the addition of Kane and stupid overbooking, which led to terrible boring matches.