goodhelmet Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? Dude, you are dense. Not everyone who reads this thread will post in this thread. Those who are ignoring this little sidetrack discussion of ours and reading about the matches will have an opportunity to pick those up and check them out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? How do you know they haven't seen it? I admit I don't watch a ton of TNA, but I've still seen several Angle matches from this year. If we looked at his post-WWE career I've seen a ton of Angle matches, including many praised ones, the vast majority of which I strongly disliked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? How do you know they haven't seen it? I admit I don't watch a ton of TNA, but I've still seen several Angle matches from this year. If we looked at his post-WWE career I've seen a ton of Angle matches, including many praised ones, the vast majority of which I strongly disliked. Dylan, will you at least explain why you don't like them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? How do you know they haven't seen it? I admit I don't watch a ton of TNA, but I've still seen several Angle matches from this year. If we looked at his post-WWE career I've seen a ton of Angle matches, including many praised ones, the vast majority of which I strongly disliked. I should have made it clear that I meant the Smackdown 6 era. I watched every televised match Kurt had this year up until about September. I can look them up but off the top of my head I remembered liking his match with Samoa Joe and AJ. I think the Joe match was in a cage. IIRC, he spent a lot of the year involved in Ace's stuff. However, it is quite hard to provide good discussion on anything if you haven't seen it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? How do you know they haven't seen it? I admit I don't watch a ton of TNA, but I've still seen several Angle matches from this year. If we looked at his post-WWE career I've seen a ton of Angle matches, including many praised ones, the vast majority of which I strongly disliked. Dylan, will you at least explain why you don't like them? Half because Dave Meltzer does, and half for unnamed reasons..... More seriously my favorite Angle matches tend to be short. I don't like Angle in long matches, definitely not from about 03 on, with a few notable exceptions. A big part of this is the fact that his matches are primarily about doing "stuff" and not building heat. I prefer matches with well developed heat segments and selling, unless they are balls out spotfest sprints. I also don't think Angle has any real depth or variety. He works Sonjay Dutt the same way he would work Chris Benoit. This is a pet peeve of mine, and my favorite wrestlers tend to be those who have approaches that are much broader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 Also, my assumption on why I didn't think people saw some of his stuff this year was through various TNA Impact show threads at DVDVR, Reddit, F4W and of course my blog. I've seen Impact threads not even hit a page. Not that I blame anyone, but I haven't seen Impact in months and have no idea if it is good or bad. Maybe I'm not right with my assumptions but there's a reason a Wrestlemania thread can go 30-50 pages and an Impact thread can't go 3-5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Schneider Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? It's your site, so you can shill as much as you want, just I don't think the timing was appropriate. You of all people are going to complain about shilling? You make 20 posts a week at DVDVR linking to your blog, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 At least I am offering people a chance to view the stuff that is in the thread.How can they discuss it if they haven't seen it? It's your site, so you can shill as much as you want, just I don't think the timing was appropriate. You of all people are going to complain about shilling? You make 20 posts a week at DVDVR linking to your blog, The only thing I have linked since September there were 2-3 Memphis reviews. There's a 3-5 picture posting rule on DVDVR so it's not like I can post the whole thing. Hell, I can't even load some of my own reviews for big shows in under 5 minutes. At some point, you have to link. My site was also free and involved no monetary gains through advertisements or anything else. I basically did it because I enjoyed pictures and gifs as much if not more than anyone else. Judging by the PM's I've gotten, it seems others enjoyed it too. I wish I could review everything but I don't have the time, care or sanity to do so anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 I watched the Rumble match out of curiosity, because it had been a long time. And I was surprised how much I liked it. They did a really good job of establishing how evenly matched they were. Not every match has to have a protracted heat section, and in this case, they built excitement by working lots of quick, intense counter exchanges. I don't always like that style, but they won me over with how hard they went. I liked the teases of the sharpshooter and the diving headbutt. And even though they pushed the pace, I wouldn't say they ignored selling the accrued damage. I could see people finding the finishing stretch a bit much. But again, these guys were supposed to be the best athletes in the promotion, pushing each other to the limit. The Benoit headbutt was a great, holy shit spot, and his one roll-up nearfall looked great as well. The ankle lock shit seems worse in retrospect because Angle overused it to an absurd degree in later matches. I thought Benoit fought long enough to fit the storyline but not too long. I don't know; it's not my favorite type of wrestling. But I thought Benoit and Angle pretty much nailed what they were going for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 That is some great sheep mentality reviewing there Childs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exposer Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 Wow, I mention the Benoit-Angle match offhand and it came to this? Anyways, my old computer has word documents of SD6 match reviews (all are Rey matches). Too bad the keyboard is inoperable or I'd post them here. I do remember thinking there were still several matches from the era that were very good. I've mentioned the under ten minute Angle-Rey match at SS 02 which is a great "cat and mouse" match with both Angle and Rey putting on great performances. I watched the No Mercy tag title tournament final too and thought it was very good. I wish I could elaborate more on that but I can't remember the details on my notes offhand. I'm pretty sure I enjoyed the 2/3 falls re-match from SD a few weeks after No Mercy more and I recall thinking it was a great match and one of the better matches of the SD6 era. The Edge-Eddie No DQ is a match I haven't seen in years but I loved it when I watched it on Eddie's DVD. However, I do confess I may have only caught most of the match as my brother Dustin was watching the DVD and I happened to walk in while it was on. Again, this was four or five years ago. I might want to re-visit that one. There are several Rey cruiser sprints that are extremely fun. Notably, he has a match with Tajiri, maybe his second televised match with the company, where he opens the match with a flying somersault senton on Tajiri. I LOVE Brock/Tajiri vs. Rey/Edge from October in the tag title tournament. Brock throwing Rey around and his interactions with Tajiri are outstanding. A-Train and Rey have an incredible four minute match on SD in early January after Rey's return from injury. Both guys are great in it. Angle and Rey have a great TV match on SD post-Rumble I think that has an awesome finish. It was something like Rey going for a springboard from the back and Angle catches him with a german suplex roll over for the pin. I don't know just trying to move this thread along better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 More great sheep mentality commentary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 I wasn't sure if it was okay to shill but that comp looks great. I'm looking forward to reliving it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 We shill here discreetly Troy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoblivion Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 I would like to add more to this when I have time, as due to age and technology I was actually watching the WWE week to week pretty heavily at the time. I do think that if you compare the Raw and Heat shows with the Smackdown and Velicoty shows that the smackdown brand felt much fresher and that it was very apparent, especiacliy when they held their pay per views together, not that it was perfect. Lesnar on top felt much fresher than HHH as well. I dont think the criticism of it is new though. Arent there death valley reviews with criticism of Angle for working the same match regardless of the wrestler from around the same time period? It would be intresting to reexamine this periord though, and when wanting to, I immediately thought of a certain set that I need to get my hands on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 Angle and Rey have a great TV match on SD post-Rumble I think that has an awesome finish. It was something like Rey going for a springboard from the back and Angle catches him with a german suplex roll over for the pin. HOLY SHIT YES. I think Rey is Angle's best opponent, and this is my favourite match of theirs. It was an unbelievable sprint with Rey just throwing EVERYTHING at Angle, who is desperately trying to contain him, and finally succeeding with the finish you mentioned. Love that match. I hope that I'm not being lumped into some anti-SD Six group just because I have criticisms about Angle/Benoit as a match up. I motherfucking love the SD Six. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoblivion Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 I thought it was interesting that someone brought up the rumble match as a return to the style that benoit worked in wcw, as his match with eddie the month before always seemed the closest he would come to working that style again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohtani's jacket Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 All I've got to say about this is that in '99 there were people hoping that a 3 minute Brood vs. Hardy Boys match would contain workrate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 I hope that I'm not being lumped into some anti-SD Six group just because I have criticisms about Angle/Benoit as a match up. I motherfucking love the SD Six. Don't worry about this shit man. If you happen to criticize Angle it is because you are reflexively anti-Meltzer AND a sheep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 I hope that I'm not being lumped into some anti-SD Six group just because I have criticisms about Angle/Benoit as a match up. I motherfucking love the SD Six. Don't worry about this shit man. If you happen to criticize Angle it is because you are reflexively anti-Meltzer AND a sheep. Man you are a trolling machine today. I am honestly impressed that I was able to get to you that badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 I hope that I'm not being lumped into some anti-SD Six group just because I have criticisms about Angle/Benoit as a match up. I motherfucking love the SD Six. Don't worry about this shit man. If you happen to criticize Angle it is because you are reflexively anti-Meltzer AND a sheep. Man you are a trolling machine today. I am honestly impressed that I was able to get to you that badly. Own up to your words. The only thing that got to me was insulting the members of this board. I am still waiting for you to actually contribute to the topic at hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Waco Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 All I've got to say about this is that in '99 there were people hoping that a 3 minute Brood vs. Hardy Boys match would contain workrate. 99 WWF/E was a cesspool. You can literally take any year in the history of the company and compare it favorably to that year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dooley Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 All I've got to say about this is that in '99 there were people hoping that a 3 minute Brood vs. Hardy Boys match would contain workrate. 99 WWF/E was a cesspool. You can literally take any year in the history of the company and compare it favorably to that year. Except for all the millions of people who were watching then that aren't watching now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 Because they totally cared about workrate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjh Posted December 22, 2013 Report Share Posted December 22, 2013 Dave never elaborated on this to my knowledge, but I remember him saying once that the standing ovation was worked/started by plants. I think Dave's point was that it wasn't an organic spontaneous reaction, but one that was expected and scripted by having Benoit look at the crowd with big eyes that screamed "please cheer for me" whilst he hobbled to the back like a wounded warrior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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