Guest savagerulz Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 I was at the indy show on Friday, and it was fun, as I had hoped it would be, but there were a few things about it that bothered me. After going to my first indy wrestling show, I now completely understand and empathize with all the complaining about ROH fans. I thought the people on some forums ranting about that were just overreacting, but now I've seen first hand how EXCRUCIATINGLY ANNOYING indy fans can be. When I first heard the dueling chants on TNA PPV (ie "Let's go Petey...Let's go A.J.!"), I thought it was fun, but when people do dueling chants NONSTOP from the beginning of the match until the end, the chants lose all meaning and just become grating nonsense. I understand the chants being done to help rally a comeback from the wrestlers, but doing them continuously regardless of what's happening in the match is a pain in the ass. During Sonjay Dutt's match, there were about six Asian kids who were about ten years old standing in the front row right by the ring, and one kept yelling "let's go, (wrestler's name)" at Dutt's opponent, before the kid beside him would SCREAM "LET'S GO SONJAY" at the top of his lungs. I literally watched him lose his voice from screaming that. Other people were laughing, but I just thought it was one of the most pathetic displays I have ever seen, as his voice just got worse and worse with each chant. The "no-name" indy guys actually had better matches than Dutt, not that Dutt's was horrible...he just had a pretty ordinary match (the only really special part was him doing a very impressive standing shooting star press), whereas the indy guys were busting out just about every wrestling move I've ever seen or heard of. I get the feeling that these are the kinds of guys who would play a video game like "WWF No Mercy", go into "Create A Wrestler" mode, and then try to memorize and learn how to do every move listed in there. One guy did a sweet variation on the burning hammer (landing with a bit of a twist, so he doesn't drop the guy on his head like Kobashi would), and there were a lot of set ups for moves that paid off unexpectedly (one guy somehow turned what looked like it was going to be something like a hurricarana into a stunner). Alex Shelley was fun to watch, especially when he did the Steve Austin double middle fingers and yelled "fuck you!" before hitting his running opponent with a flying spin kick. His dyed white hair looks silly, though. I noticed that a lot of indy guys are doing The Canadian Destroyer, which I don't agree with, because even if he didn't invent it, I think Petey should be the only one doing it. A move seems to be cheapened and less special when more people do it, although it was great to see a cool variation where a guy did it from the position of being on another guy's back. The most annoying chants were "please don't die" during the ladder match, the dueling "let's go" chants, and "you got fucked up". I laughed when some guy tried to get a "match of the year" chant going during the main event and no one went with it. The crowd stuck with "this match rules" instead. Call me a prude, but I can't help but find it disturbing to see little kids (maybe 10 years old) chanting "fuck him up (wrestler's name), fuck him up!". I don't think kids should be saying that shit, and if there are going to be chants like that, maybe the show should be 18 +. Do you think I'm overreacting, or that kids being exposed to (or participating in) that might warp them when they grow up? There were also some very funny chants, like "you're not Rhino" and "stolen gimmick" at a guy in red tights who really did look a lot like Rhino (although he didn't do any of his moves), and one guy who kept heckling a wrestler called "Flury" by chanting his name (think Bart Simpson heckling Daryl Strawberry in The Simpsons softball episode). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Cooke Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 What show was it? Any good matches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest savagerulz Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 What show was it? UWA Hardcore Wrestling. Any good matches? Card: Chris Bishop vs. Ruckus(ladder match) Osiris vs. Josh Prohibition (company vs. career) UWA Canadian Championship: M-Dogg 20© vs. Asylum UWA Lightweight Championship: Alex Shelley© vs. Claudio Castagnoli Sonjay Dutt vs. Sabian The Amazing Darkstone vs. Dan Paysan Hazuki vs. Lionel Knight The Flying Hurricanes vs. 2.0© (Special Feature IWS Tag Match) Nick Watts and Jeff Flury vs. Rip Impact and Matt Bison The ladder match main event was very good, with one of the best spots being a death valley driver into the ladder, which bent the ladder into a weird shape. The only really bad part was the champion idiotically giving up a chance to easily get the belt by opting to set up a big table spot instead, although the spot was awesome. With two ladders on the outside, a table between them, and a table on top of them, the two wrestlers were fighting on opposite sides of a ladder in the ring. The match ended with the champion throwing the challenger from the top of the ladder, through those two tables set up between the ladders on the oustide. I truly believe that the match was pay per view quality, aside from the fake-looking "I can grab the belt right now, but I have to do the big spot first" moment. Maybe spots like that table spot at the end happen at indy shows all the time and I'm just ignorant, but I thought it was pretty amazing. There's another show next sunday (same city, different company) with Christopher Daniels vs. Petey Williams in the main event, but I don't know if I'll go yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DylanWaco Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 I'd be alot less worried about kids chanting "show your tits" and "you fat fuck" then I would be about them getting their sole entertainment from watching grown mean beat the holy shit out of each other with ladders and tables in a high school gym for fifteen bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 I long for the days when fans put the product over with the cheering, chanting and booing. Now, fans put themselves over with the cheering, chanting and booing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 Unfortuantely, you cant expect the fans to act the same when the product has changed so dramatically that almost any resemblance to the wrestling we knew is barely there except for two guys in tights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 The product has changed. But fans aren't blameless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 But why should we, as fans, act accordingly when so many mixed signals are being sent out? In WCW, towards the end, the bookers and wrestlers were out to entertain themselves, not the fans. Vince McMahon originally tells us that he will not insult the fans' intelligence and then proceeds to do exactly that. He criticizes WCW for censoring their fans and does exactly that. ROH tells us they don't produce sports entertainment but then throw out an 8 man scramble death cage match. TNA encourages fan participation but then continues to shove JJ down our throats even though every fan in the arena at home doesn't want to see his tired 1999 act. So, what exactly is a fan supposed to do? Sit there and cheer and boo accordingly when any chance the feds get, they remind us that what we are watching is fake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 No. The appreciative chants bug me more than the insulting ones. "Match Of The Year", "This Match Rules" ... stuff like that sucks and is more of a reminder that it's fake than anything the wrestlers are doing at that moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 But once again, when the promotion encourages it, as ROH does by constantly reminding everyone that they are watching a Match of the Year, as Jim Ross had done countless times in his career as well, then is that the fans reminding us it is fake or the promotions encouraging that kind of fan behavior? Plus, those chants started coming along long after it was shoved down our throats that wrestling was fake, that it was just entertainment, they were really friends in real life, blah blah blah. The fans had to adapt more than the promotions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boondocks Kernoodle Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 I noticed that a lot of indy guys are doing The Canadian Destroyer, which I don't agree with, because even if he didn't invent it, I think Petey should be the only one doing it. A move seems to be cheapened and less special when more people do it, although it was great to see a cool variation where a guy did it from the position of being on another guy's back. Does Petey wrestle for that promotion? If not, there's no reason for those wrestlers not to use it. It's not like Teddy Hart when he did AJ's move on a TNA PPV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Hawk of Miami Posted February 24, 2006 Report Share Posted February 24, 2006 No. The appreciative chants bug me more than the insulting ones. "Match Of The Year", "This Match Rules" ... stuff like that sucks and is more of a reminder that it's fake than anything the wrestlers are doing at that moment. To me, it's just an extension of a standing ovation. Are fans not allowed to stand up and applaud them for their performence? Or is that acknowledging, that it's fake too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest White Lion Posted February 24, 2006 Report Share Posted February 24, 2006 Lord knows that internet fans, by definition have enough places they can praise good performences without making the results of the actual wrestling look completley unimportant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted February 24, 2006 Report Share Posted February 24, 2006 Fans are allowed to do whatever they want to do, of course. It's just really hard to suspend disbelief when *anyone* breaks kayfabe, no matter who it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted February 24, 2006 Report Share Posted February 24, 2006 No. The appreciative chants bug me more than the insulting ones. "Match Of The Year", "This Match Rules" ... stuff like that sucks and is more of a reminder that it's fake than anything the wrestlers are doing at that moment.To me, it's just an extension of a standing ovation. Are fans not allowed to stand up and applaud them for their performence? Or is that acknowledging, that it's fake too? It's the fans trying to put themselves over. They're trying to be like the Japanese fans while completely missing the point of why it works over there. Sometimes you just need to shut up and go with the flow of the show. There are way too many matches on the indy circuit where the fans are actively working against what the workers are trying to do in the ring. Though I can't talk because I just sit silently during the shows and watch. But then that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted February 25, 2006 Report Share Posted February 25, 2006 I dug the "This is Awesome" chants when I first heard them in TNA, but once I watched Joe vs Kobashi and the ROH fans were doing it at the start of a match it dawned on me that they were doing it to get themselves over. Yeah I know, they were excited to see one of their puro Gods in person, but what's wrong with just marking out for the guy? The "Match of the Year" chants grate on me more than anything since that's such a smarkish thing to chant at a show. It'd be like going to see a movie in a theater and chanting "Best Film of the Year" 3/4ths of the way through. It's as if the people in the crowd are afraid of losing their smark card if they act like the marks they always put down on their message boards and chanting something like "MOTY" will redeem their cred. Then again, goodhelmet makes a good point about the audience changing. I watched Smackdown tonight (first time in months) and my fiancee watched for the first time in an even longer time. When Booker and Sharmell (who wasn't around the last time she watched) came out, she actually asked me "what's her gimmick supposed to be?" and I make a point to never talk "smark" around her. When Tatanka came out and Cole did the usual spiel about being a member of whatever tribe he's part of, she (as a part Native American who gets bothered by people who pretend to be Native) commented "they probably made that up, didn't they?" If she - who grew up marking for the Warrior and Lex Luger- is talking about gimmicks and assuming what the promotion is telling her is fake, that probably says more about the state of wrestling than what some smarks chant at a ROH or TNA show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts