Dooley

Until Vince buys an island he thinks contains treasure, Inoki is well in the lead. But I reserve the right to revisit my opinion after Linda's second failed Senate campaign.

Nope, it really seems the consensus. Not just among wrestling fans, real people.

I agree with John. I like the level of conversation here generally no matter what the topic is. The historical perspective things are my personal favourite, the Linda thread is good, the WON recaps were/are fantastic, this is by and large a good place to converse. If a topic doesn't interest me as much, I generally don't click. But by and large, those topics are few and far between. Viva la difference! Viva PWO!

Verne's notorious for advertising guys who had already jumped ship. Is it that hard to believe he continued billing Hogan through '84?

Why else would a man with a six figure income have two grand in cash?

From Cawthon's site: WWF @ Boston, MA - Boston Garden - September 9, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant in 18 seconds WWF @ Grand Rapids, MI - Stadium Arena - September 18, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 30-second mark WWF @ Utica, NY - Memorial Auditorium - September 19, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 21-second mark WWF @ Denver, CO - McNichols Arena - September 22, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at around the 30 second mark WWF @ Richfield, OH - Coliseum - September 29, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant with the splash after a matter of seconds WWF @ Toledo, OH - Sports Arena - October 3, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 25-second mark WWF @ Springfield, IL - Prairie Capital Convention Center - October 11, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 19-second mark WWF @ Philadelphia, PA - Spectrum - October 14, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 17-second mark WWF @ Winnipeg, Manitoba - Arena - October 21, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 20-second mark WWF @ Edmonton, Alberta - Northlands Coliseum - October 22, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 12-second mark WWF @ Altoona, PA - Jaffa Mosque - November 2, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 20-second mark WWF @ Erie, PA - Civic Center - November 3, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 20-second mark WWF @ St. Louis, MO - Arena - November 24, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 30-second mark WWF @ Daytona Beach, FL - November 27, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant at the 20-second mark WWF @ Cape Girardeau, MO - Show Me Center - December 11, 1989 WWF IC Champion the Ultimate Warrior pinned Andre the Giant in 20 seconds I only included the matches that had the times, but suffice to say it went around the horn. There were DQ's mixed in as well, most notably the ones you posted and the first Toronto match, which led to a cage rematch.

Could be, or it could be Andre realized he was done and just said fuck it. After all Andre hated Warrior and apparently insisted on the matches going that short.

Here's a good example of Andre having fun in '89. Duggan/Warrior vs Rude/Andre

Why would they focus more on the Strikeforce card featuring a tournament that may or may not ever conclude when they have 4 cards in 4 weeks on the horizon, two of which feature the promotion's biggest stars? Zuffa bought Strikeforce to get a few key pieces of talent, not to deal with Showtime. It's akin to them buying WFA just to get Rampage and Lyoto. Dana has said repeatedly he doesn't want to deal with Showtime. Since the day they purchased Strikeforce it's all been about waiting out the Showtime deal. This "massive purge" you speak of is going to be lower level guys Zuffa doesn't want around anyway. Are you advocating putting promotional efforts into Strikeforce and Showtime to save the Zuffa employment of Lorenz Larkin?

As much as I like Keith's writing, this was always the plan. People even made a drinking game around Dana's "business as usual" quote. It was always about siphoning Strikeforce talent into the UFC until the Showtime contract ran out or the network got sick about it enough to drop them.

The question that popped into my head was can McDevitt hide behind that when WWF's guys aren't "employees" but independent contractors?

Definitely sounds like some kind of benzos.

It's amazing how quickly interest in this angle is fizzled. A couple of months back, it seemed like everyone was talking about CM Punk. Not just wrestling people, real people. Sportsnet's (Canadian sports network) website was covering the angle around the time on MITB, people in my social circle were talking about, it was a buzz that I hadn't heard near wrestling since Rock/Austin. Now, 2 months later it's completely fizzled out and people are back to not caring.

Bock is my immediate first choice as well. Consider that his 60-minute draw with Curt Hennig in Vegas happened when he was 52. Aside from that, the sheer number of quality matches and opponents he had defending the AWA title for the most part from 79 through 87 is pretty astounding. Bock's my choice too, for pretty much the same reasons. Not only his high-end stuff, but I was recently watching some AWA from '86 and even at his advanced age he made a match with Boris freakin' Zukhov interesting. I've never seen anyone at any age do that before.

He said at the time they were working under a deal memo and not an iron-clad contract.

Minor point: It was initially Hogan (and Mr. T) that saved Orndorff from a 2-on-1 beating from Piper and Orton on the first SNME.

Butterbean also lost a fight because he literally fell over and couldn't get back up.

It just keeps getting funnier.

Great call. Wrestling has always had this insane "size equals toughness" mindset, and it's just not true. Let's imagine a hypothetical scenario. I kidnapped you into a time machine, took you back to 1985, put a gun to your head and said "Okay, you have to fight one of these two people". Standing there are Andre the Giant and the Dynamite Kid. Which one would you rather fight? Personally, I'd go with Andre in a heartbeat. At least I could attempt a hint-n-run strategy on him, landing strikes to his knees and then backing off and looking for another opening. You know, stuff out of the old Sakuraba playbook. I'd probably lose (using myself was probably a bad idea, considering that I've got cerebral freakin' palsy) but I might have some small percentage of a chance at getting in a lucky shot on the big guy. If I was in there with Dynamite, I'd pretty much just resign myself to a severe asskicking and hope that it ended quickly, because I can't possibly win a fight against a guy like that. Size is great to have, but it's nothing without technique and speed. It's not just pro wrestling. There's a reason that Olympic martial arts, amateur wrestling, boxing and MMA have weight classes. As for the Andre-DK scenario, if we're talking prime Andre I will always take my chances with DK. But neither would be on my to-do list.

While I find Rey's matches fun to watch, I have a harder time buying him as a "threat" than Snitsky. Let's say you inadvertently offend someone in a bar. Are you hoping he looks more like Rey or Snitsky? Or to continue with Jingus' UFC example, would you rather run into Urijah Faber or Heath Herring in a dark alley? Sure Faber's more skilled, but Heath is a foot taller and hundred pounds heavier. Big guys don't have to be as skilled, in a work or a shoot. Because when they hit you, they hit you that much harder and it hurts that much more.

TORCH #433: WCW NEWSWIRE Yikes! I'm thinking that someone on the booking committe (or someone else who heard) was passing along an early, early, early draft of the finish... and Wade kinda bought it as being a finish that stuck around for a while. It's pretty much impossible to believe given how Benoit was being pushed, and how the rest of them were being pushed. John I can buy Team Piper being originally booked to go over as they seemed to be setting up for Hogan-Piper in a cage, which was what Piper's winning stipulation was. But like you say, Benoit wasn't being pushed at that level. If anything, it would probably have been Piper being the sole survivor.

I've said this before but the WWF fanbase was ready to accept Sid as the new #1 face and franchise player before they turned him heel. Hogan had been on top for six years and fans had grown tired of the schtick. Along came Sid who was similar to Hogan but younger, bigger and not balding. When they did the Rumble angle of the two shoving each other after the match the crowd clearly sided with Sid. It's fun to think about what might have been had they chosen to turn Hogan at that time instead.

Sid brought Harvey in.

Does Meltzer still cling to the "he has millions in retirement accounts" story?

Was that why Sid left? Sid said in his shoot that it was because he was asked to lose to Warrior around the horn right after Mania.